Quick Combat Questions

Taryius

Anyone know the proc chance for void fist? Got completely demolished by it in a duel, and just want to know if I got unlucky or if I should be expecting so many failed cures?

Kythra

Taryius said:

Anyone know the proc chance for void fist? Got completely demolished by it in a duel, and just want to know if I got unlucky or if I should be expecting so many failed cures?

Super RNG but pommelstrike extends it to my knowledge.

Ryzeth

Thought it was a 50% chance to block? Somewhere thereabouts. Super high but with a short duration.

Exelethril

It's abnormally high, given what it does.

Dochitha

Taryius said:

Anyone know the proc chance for void fist? Got completely demolished by it in a duel, and just want to know if I got unlucky or if I should be expecting so many failed cures?

I had a straight 15 herb eat misses on void, that's like 10s of trying to eat something and can't. Somehow I think it's bugged, or too high chance, or not supposed to me. @Makarios

Sobriquet

Dochitha said:

Taryius said:

Anyone know the proc chance for void fist? Got completely demolished by it in a duel, and just want to know if I got unlucky or if I should be expecting so many failed cures?

I had a straight 15 herb eat misses on void, that's like 10s of trying to eat something and can't. Somehow I think it's bugged, or too high chance, or not supposed to me. @Makarios

It's proc rate is inversely proportionate to your credits Escrow I believe 

Dochitha

Sobriquet said:

Dochitha said:

Taryius said:

Anyone know the proc chance for void fist? Got completely demolished by it in a duel, and just want to know if I got unlucky or if I should be expecting so many failed cures?

I had a straight 15 herb eat misses on void, that's like 10s of trying to eat something and can't. Somehow I think it's bugged, or too high chance, or not supposed to me. @Makarios

It's proc rate is inversely proportionate to your credits Escrow I believe 

Woot you cross threads! PUNCH SOBRIQUEST 100 CREDITS <deals % damage equals to credits spent>

Taryius

There really has to be something wrong with it? Hitting it 10 or more times right off the bat? I dueled someone and didn't get a single herb cure before I was dead.. y

The duration isn't that short if your in Sanya stance and pommel extends it...

Painful stuff

Ryzeth

Taryius said:

There really has to be something wrong with it? Hitting it 10 or more times right off the bat? I dueled someone and didn't get a single herb cure before I was dead.. y

The duration isn't that short if your in Sanya stance and pommel extends it...

Painful stuff

RNGesus, friend. You could have it not affect you at all the entire duration, or you could have it affect 5+ times in a row and get locked. It's the same with shit like piety. You see people walk out of it first attempt, while you're still trying to walk out of it a minute later.

Calira

Ryzeth said:

Taryius said:

There really has to be something wrong with it? Hitting it 10 or more times right off the bat? I dueled someone and didn't get a single herb cure before I was dead.. y

The duration isn't that short if your in Sanya stance and pommel extends it...

Painful stuff

RNGesus, friend. You could have it not affect you at all the entire duration, or you could have it affect 5+ times in a row and get locked. It's the same with shit like piety. You see people walk out of it first attempt, while you're still trying to walk out of it a minute later.

You can tumble out of piety to avoid the checks entirely, at least. There's not a whole lot you can do if your cures don't work. Raze is nearly as fast as pommel, so shielding won't do much to help. Pommel was made to allow strikes even if it misses, too, so clumsiness and mount are no defence, nor is rebounding.

Frederich

Touch Web @Target

Duanathar(ic)

Amok

Asmodron

Calira said:

Ryzeth said:

Taryius said:

There really has to be something wrong with it? Hitting it 10 or more times right off the bat? I dueled someone and didn't get a single herb cure before I was dead.. y

The duration isn't that short if your in Sanya stance and pommel extends it...

Painful stuff

RNGesus, friend. You could have it not affect you at all the entire duration, or you could have it affect 5+ times in a row and get locked. It's the same with shit like piety. You see people walk out of it first attempt, while you're still trying to walk out of it a minute later.

You can tumble out of piety to avoid the checks entirely, at least. There's not a whole lot you can do if your cures don't work. Raze is nearly as fast as pommel, so shielding won't do much to help. Pommel was made to allow strikes even if it misses, too, so clumsiness and mount are no defence, nor is rebounding.

@Taryius

If a blademaster attempts to pommel and strikes your shield, then not only will they be pushed off equilibrium, but they also wont be able to followup the pommel with a strike. If a blademaster is standing there pommeling you, then you can put up a shield and it is very likely from how fast they are trying to throw out the affs, that they will smack your shield before they can stop themselves at least once.


If a blademaster attempts to pommel you while your rebounding is up, the strike -will- follow through, however they will be pushed off balance and equilibrium, as if any other hit to a rebounding. The recovery is much longer than a simple quick pommel, and will definitely slow down the process.

Asmodron

Oh and dont forget, blademasters have almost no way of keeping you in the room. Unless your leg is broke (which truth be told may soon lead to your death as is), it can be fairly simple to avoid a blademaster.

Rom

Uhh except for two of the best ways, hamstring and block. Not to mention all the paralysis spam coming alongside any genuine attempt at making voidfist worthwhile.

Aerek

And spamming Shield against a BM is just about the worst advice you can give someone. Raze/Knees will murder you.

Xaden

Mountjump for days

Asmodron

Rom said:

Uhh except for two of the best ways, hamstring and block. Not to mention all the paralysis spam coming alongside any genuine attempt at making voidfist worthwhile.

Attempting to hamstring, and upkeep of it, will slow down any form of 'rapid firing' that was being mentioned before, and will last for roughly 10 seconds (Can ask sena for better statistics). Even if you are hamstrung, you can still walk from the room, it'll simply make it slower. If you are mounted, you have no fear of hamstring and -additionally- will have to force your opponent to throw in Strike Feet into the mix, further slowing the process.  No...Hamstring is definitely not piety or tentacles or gravehands.

As for block, unless you for some reason decided to fight a BM in a 1 exit room (which the chances of that happening are pretty damn slim), then block wont be an issue.  If you are stuck in a room with a blademaster from the get-go, then that is definitely on you.

Aerek said:

And spamming Shield against a BM is just about the worst advice you can give someone. Raze/Knees will murder you.

Raze knees is only applicable if you are not mounted, additionally this will further slow down the mentioned process of rapid firing with voidfist.



I have yet to encounter a situation where a blademaster was effectively locking me with pommels alone. Perhaps with the changes with stance + fist, this has become more profound? I still find it difficult to believe it will put you in dire straits..

Armali

You should spar @Kalila then.

Ryzeth

Or Mizik / Tirac / Atalkez (jk the nub gave up BM).

Dunno why you're trying to say people are wrong, when they've made BM work significantly better than you did. BM can change the direction they're blocking, just so you know. '1 exit rooms' don't really mean a whole lot in this scenario.

You also can't "just walk away" from a BM. Hamstring makes it very easy for them to stick on you. Outside of the arena, rift locks are also a very real possibility. Voidfist is just icing on the cake, for that.

Asmodron

Ryzeth said:

Or Mizik / Tirac / Atalkez (jk the nub gave up BM).

Dunno why you're trying to say people are wrong, when they've made BM work significantly better than you did. BM can change the direction they're blocking, just so you know. '1 exit rooms' don't really mean a whole lot in this scenario.

You also can't "just walk away" from a BM. Hamstring makes it very easy for them to stick on you. Outside of the arena, rift locks are also a very real possibility. Voidfist is just icing on the cake, for that.

The original point brought up was on "being locked down by voidfist" and not BM combat overall. That is the focus of my comment, that people are claiming they got locked by the use of pommel and voidfist.


People said voidfist was too much, when others simply mentioned it is based on RNG and could really go either way, not to mention needs to be reapplied.


People said the afflictions from pommel are fast. Then some valid options for easily countering it were given.


People said it is hard to run from a BM...even though their ability to try and stick you in the room is pretty minute.

If someone is going for a riftlock, then you can simply outr from your rift beforehand. This will force them to -also- have to throw addiction into the mix, alongside your strategies of keeping someone in the room with hamstring and striking feet to dismount.

Voidfist has been around for awhile now, and most professional BM players will say that locking as a BM is a pretty difficult if near impossible task. Has this changed since the Sanya + Voidfist tweak? I'm not certain, but BM affs just help to buildup to the possible kill method of brokenstar.

Xaden

Was fighting Kalila the other day and had to afk to answer the front door. Came back to a truelock. Never logged it to review  

But the girl is p. good, no question about that.

Antonius

You can't look at things in a vacuum because that's not how combat actually works. Shield might be a viable counter to pommel alone, but if that just gets you killed another way, it's not actually a viable counter.

Armali

Uh... even Mizik has said that it's pretty ridiculous and he can straight voidfist pommel lock you. Kalila's been practicing that for the past week or two. If you don't think Kalila is 'professional', then I hope you at least have the courtesy to call Mizik professional.

Frankly, I'm not sure how I'd deal with it if I were a momentum class without passives and a lock breaker. It's pretty nuts.

Atalkez

You don't deal with it. Unless you're fast para/high output momentum to outhinder the BM, you're pretty much gonna lose. Don't forget hamstring lasts 9 second straight now, and its loopable. BM can keep that up no problem.

@Asmodron I don't know why you want to argue this point. The change to use void mid attack with two affs (lightning/strike) made it a lot easier to keep up. It took it from being a standalone ability entirely, that you had to stop momentum to use, into an ability that can be used in conjunction with your attack.

Confident I could go back to BM and have you dying to damage or locked within a couple hours.

Edit: BM eats shield for breakfast, brunch, lunch, afternoon snack and dinner too. Forget you even have the tattoo vs BM unless you walk/shield to try to slow down the follow attack. Risky though.

Mathilda

Atalkez said:

Confident I could go back to BM and have you dying to damage or locked within a couple hours.

??? 

Voidfist definitely is pretty amazing. I've had @Kalila lock me in under four hits. Scurry stuff.

Atalkez

I'd have to massively edit my offense, not updated to the changes etc

Cailan

I'd hope that you could lock me if I just stood there for hours, is what @Mathilda was getting at.

Aerek

Armali said:

Uh... even Mizik has said that it's pretty ridiculous and he can straight voidfist pommel lock you...

Frankly, I'm not sure how I'd deal with it if I were a momentum class without passives and a lock breaker. It's pretty nuts.

Most of that issue is Void, but part of it is that Pommelstrike can't miss to my knowledge, which means only heavy paralysis or lethargy can actually hinder that route; clumsiness ineffective. That could probably change in the current state of things. 

Atalkez

Aerek said:

Armali said:

Uh... even Mizik has said that it's pretty ridiculous and he can straight voidfist pommel lock you...

Frankly, I'm not sure how I'd deal with it if I were a momentum class without passives and a lock breaker. It's pretty nuts.

Most of that issue is Void, but part of it is that Pommelstrike can't miss to my knowledge, which means only heavy paralysis or lethargy can actually hinder that route; clumsiness ineffective. That could probably change in the current state of things. 

Hmm, I think it can miss. 

Kalila

Oh hello!

This is getting way too much attention. Blademaster is a dead class, yeah? Barely anyone plays it anymore.

Let's not pay attention to me