Mining and Legions

Makaela

It was not just your mine he took. But I am fli flopping on my views pon this.. i agree in theory it works. However in the end its going to end up being at most 16 people controlling the entire commodity market in the current iteration.  Knowing the past in achaea... when a select few get to control a valued resources prices tend to skyrocket so I am not looking forward to trying to maintain being a forger as a result.

Amranu

Don't build hard to defend mines on valuable resources. No one is going to try to solo large mines for quite awhile, and large mines also allow your squads to level up quickly. At the very least, start with one medium mine to give yourself some ability to build an army.

Makaela

there are no lodes left to build new mines on. I just spent 40k prospecting looking. Trust me there are none left

Jacen

I would definitely suggest only shooting for medium or large mines. I had a small mine for about 44 hours and a medium mine for 3 hours and I still don't have a level 2 squad.

Inuad

Makaela said:

there are no lodes left to build new mines on. I just spent 40k prospecting looking. Trust me there are none left

I would say that's just bad luck in terms of timing. Earlier today (maybe ~5-6 hours ago) I found I think 5 lodes, and I didn't look at all the mining camps.

I'll definitely be happy when they remove the gold cost for prospecting, though. I believe @Sarapis mentioned being able to go to a stronghold/mining camp and getting a list of possible lodes in the radius of that camp? Whatever the case, currently  you simply have to -always- be prospecting and cross your fingers that you find something.

With regard to attacking/defending mines: while the attacking army does take a penalty on its level, based on what has been said they will always be able to front a 1 squad advantage (defending mines need at least 1 mining squad). The fact that the defenders (according to the help file) get to attack first could balance this out, but I still feel like the system leans more toward an attacker.

Inuad

Tecton said:

I've just finished splitting up the massive HELP MINING file into its own HELP section - you can see it under HELP 24. Now that it is in more manageable pieces, I'd love to work on improving the documentation. As people who've not been looking at the system for months, what areas did you find confusing? What would you like to see more documentation on?

Could you do a sub file specifically for mining costs? It's still kind of buried at the bottom of HELP MINING (or HELP 24.1).

It might also be helpful to include an example or two, just to give a better idea of the costs of running a mine. For instance, the current thing notes that it costs 5 gold/day for each miner, which does not quite send home the fact that a medium mine with a full mining contingent (120 miners) will cost 22.8k gold per month/RL day. 

Amranu

It does, if it leaned towards the defender no one would ever have to worry about an attack.

Inuad

Amranu said:

It does, if it leaned towards the defender no one would ever have to worry about an attack.

I think there's a difference between overly leaning toward an attacker and slightly leaning toward an attacker.

That said, would you be willing to share the kinds of losses your squads suffered in the attacks you've launched?

Tesha

One idea I'd love to see is the details on the battles. It all sounded so cool in the helpfile with who attacks first and how it's all calculated, but the message just says who won. I'd love to see a much more detailed message with how many casualties were inflicted on both sides in all the different waves etc.

Makaela

I tend to imagine that I just failed to kill any of his troops.

Tesha

Also, can we please have the new minerals targetable by their new names? So 'a translucent piece of shunsten' should be targetable by shunsten, piece, and mineral. Right now it's only mineral.

Melodie

5110h, 7102m, 22330e, 28450w cexkdb-get xerthyst from pouch

You take a chunk of xerthyst from a frosted azure pouch.

Must be only some that didn't get it. Perhaps an accident/bug?

Tesha

Oh I thought it was like this for every mineral. I'll just bug it.

4340h (100%), 4784m (90%), 100%w exdbk-  01:12:38.28    ii mineral

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You are holding:

Misc:

   mineral421277       a translucent piece of shunsten

You are wearing:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 items were shown.

4340h (100%), 4784m (90%), 100%w exdbk-  01:12:41.71    poke shunsten

You stumble and poke yourself in the eye.

4340h (100%), 4784m (90%), 100%w exdbk-  01:12:43.92    

Ashelynne

Amranu said:

Don't build hard to defend mines on valuable resources. No one is going to try to solo large mines for quite awhile, and large mines also allow your squads to level up quickly. At the very least, start with one medium mine to give yourself some ability to build an army.

That's kind of hard to do when iron has been impossible to get. I built a small mine because I had enough iron and wood for a small mine. 

Xer

Only 22.8k per RL day? Weeeeeaaaak. I had to pay 115k per day at the start with all my mines <.<

Ashelynne

As far as cost this is what I'd come up with:

* SMALL

75 iron / 180 wood

60 squad members [ Max 40 miners ]

200 gold per Achaean day for the mine

200 gold per Achaean day for the max number of miners

4,800 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep)

9,600 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep w/max miners)

* MEDIUM

140 iron / 350 wood

200 squad members [ Max 120 miners ]

350 gold per Achaean day

600 gold per Achaean day for the max number of miners

8,400 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep)

22,800 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep w/max miners)

* LARGE

230 iron / 650 wood

480 squad members [ Max 280 miners ]

600 gold per Achaean day

1,400 gold per Achaean day for the max number of miners

14,400 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep)

48,000 gold per 24 hours (mine upeep w/max miners)

I did this half asleep, so hopefully all the math is right!  

Ruth

I held a medium platinum mine on a medium lode and I was finding it difficult to level up my guards. About 30 hours and no level 2s!

That being said, I always found building larger mines to protect your investments (especially those that are valuable right now, like iron, coal etc) is worth the initial investment.

Kazu

The battle message is more detailed if you repel the invaders. I got a message saying that I wiped @Ruth's 3 invading squads while only suffering 7 casualties to my own. Shame I was immediately crushed by Xer's crew after that though.

Morthif

Tesha said:

One idea I'd love to see is the details on the battles. It all sounded so cool in the helpfile with who attacks first and how it's all calculated, but the message just says who won. I'd love to see a much more detailed message with how many casualties were inflicted on both sides in all the different waves etc.

No one was left alive to report the other sides loses.

Ruth

Ashelynne said:

As far as cost this is what I'd come up with:

* SMALL

75 iron / 180 wood

60 squad members [ Max 40 miners ]

200 gold per Achaean day for the mine

200 gold per Achaean day for the max number of miners

4,800 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep)

9,600 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep w/max miners)

* MEDIUM

140 iron / 350 wood

200 squad members [ Max 120 miners ]

350 gold per Achaean day

600 gold per Achaean day for the max number of miners

8,400 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep)

22,800 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep w/max miners)

* LARGE

230 iron / 650 wood

480 squad members [ Max 280 miners ]

600 gold per Achaean day

1,400 gold per Achaean day for the max number of miners

14,400 gold per 24 hours (mine upkeep)

48,000 gold per 24 hours (mine upeep w/max miners)

I did this half asleep, so hopefully all the math is right!  

CONSTRUCT <small/medium/large> MINE
 - Small mine  : 60 squad members (max. 40 miners)
 - Medium mine : 200 squad members (max. 120 miners)
 - Large mine  : 480 squad members (max. 200 miners)

Miners for large mines seem to be changed.

Ahmet

Morthif said:

Tesha said:

One idea I'd love to see is the details on the battles. It all sounded so cool in the helpfile with who attacks first and how it's all calculated, but the message just says who won. I'd love to see a much more detailed message with how many casualties were inflicted on both sides in all the different waves etc.

No one was left alive to report the other sides loses.

You can see it from the inside, if you're inside your stronghold.

Ahmet

ALSO, MISTERS @TECTON AND @SARAPIS
Since it doesn't do any thing on our (the user's) end, can we have our MINE emote back?

Ruth

How long does it take for mines that have collapsed to re-populate across the mining camp areas? I would assume a few hours after? Or does it re-calculate the commodities flooding the market and releases a new one when comms have gone out of the current market?

Inuad

@Ruth:

Sarapis said:

I should note though guys that the intention of this system is absolutely NOT to provide mining opportunities for anyone who wants it. That would lead to flooding the world with comms. The system is rate limited intentionally, and not just by how quickly you go through lodes. If you go through all the lodes of something very quickly, there'll be no more lodes of that type generated for awhile, until the system determines it's time to populate again. The idea is to create, over time, a rough average maximum output for each comm, so that we know roughly how much, at max, of a comm is being produced (just like with the village comm system).

Xinna

Should be a MINE LIST to tell you where your mines are located.

And some kind of MINE STATUS that tells you the total daily expenses of all of your mines, for convenience.

Inuad

Xinna said:

Should be a MINE LIST to tell you where your mines are located.

And some kind of MINE STATUS that tells you the total daily expenses of all of your mines, for convenience.

Yeah, I IDEA'd that in game already. I'm hoping that @Sarapis mentioning that a day or few from now will have the ability to dismiss squads from your legion also means that various other overhauls will be released at the same time (like a mine list). Similarly, a LEGION INFO SQUAD <squad id> would be nice for things like % experience, list of specialties, and other potentially useful information.

Sarapis

@Xinna I agree with both of those. Thought we actually had the former, but I guess not.

Ahmet

Xinna said:

Should be a MINE LIST to tell you where your mines are located.

And some kind of MINE STATUS that tells you the total daily expenses of all of your mines, for convenience.

Nu. I want my mine emote back. It's taunting me. You can still see it with SHOWEMOTE.

But in all seriousness, yes, we need a list for that, possibly containing strongholds as well.

Sarapis

Btw, you can actually LEGION SQUAD RETIRE <squad id> now to get rid of an unwanted squad.

Sarapis

Ah hah, and we do already have MINES LIST and MINES SHOW <mine id>. Failed to document though!