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Extermination and Vivification

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  • AegothAegoth Member Posts: 2,975 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Melodie said:

    Please pardon the overly snarky ass that he is
    Please. I'm the nicest, sweetest guy you know
  • RangorRangor Member Posts: 3,308 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Way to derail a thread! Thought this was about vivify/exterminate changes. So far so good?
  • TitonusTitonus Youngstown, OhioMember Posts: 238 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Rangor said:
    Way to derail a thread! Thought this was about vivify/exterminate changes. So far so good?
    I was initially very, very upset, not only at the mechanic but at the implication that the alteration would extend a current conflict 97% of the people involved in are prepared to move on from. 

    That being said, in practice, it looks like, should we find a way to bookend the current conflict, future interactions involving Extermination/Vivify may be pretty fun, barring Forestbinding on the first extermination message followed immediately by Worldburning.
  • RangorRangor Member Posts: 3,308 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Titonus said:
    Rangor said:
    Way to derail a thread! Thought this was about vivify/exterminate changes. So far so good?
    I was initially very, very upset, not only at the mechanic but at the implication that the alteration would extend a current conflict 97% of the people involved in are prepared to move on from. 

    That being said, in practice, it looks like, should we find a way to bookend the current conflict, future interactions involving Extermination/Vivify may be pretty fun, barring Forestbinding on the first extermination message followed immediately by Worldburning.
    I think future conflicts should be great. Exterm/vivify will be used for Rp and most likely  skirmishes/even raids, while the "uneven" raids will hopefully move into cities where there are mechanics in place to give the defender an advantage.
    TitonusAetheleDochitha
  • YselaYsela Member Posts: 189 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Rangor said:
    Way to derail a thread! Thought this was about vivify/exterminate changes. So far so good?
    Anticlimactic, and a missed opportunity for greatly enriching storylines and the Achaean world at large. I'll stop sulking about it soon.

    Wouldn't know about the mechanics. If they aren't fine now, I'm sure they will be soon. The admin are usually very good at such things, I find.
    AileaPrythe
  • CailinCailin Member Posts: 359 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    I'm just going to pipe up and say that I am really glad admin didn't delete exterm. I love the RP of exterm/vivify, it makes things interesting.

    As a matter of fact, I always enjoyed the RP of exterm/rejuvenation, despite it being excessive lately.
  • TitonusTitonus Youngstown, OhioMember Posts: 238 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Ysela said:
    Rangor said:
    Way to derail a thread! Thought this was about vivify/exterminate changes. So far so good?
    Anticlimactic, and a missed opportunity for greatly enriching storylines and the Achaean world at large. I'll stop sulking about it soon.

    Wouldn't know about the mechanics. If they aren't fine now, I'm sure they will be soon. The admin are usually very good at such things, I find.
    Yes, for the RP minded, it would have been great to have something lead up to this, maybe use the 500 rooms in 24 hours that Naoma keeps talking about as the catalyst for the forest itself 'teaching' vivify or something.

    At this point though, unless they craft some cool event post circling around events that no-one would have been able to be present for, we're past the point of being able to do an IC reasoning for it.
  • TaryiusTaryius Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 913 @ - Epic Achaean
    Perhaps it'll go down in history as a mystery, with both sides claiming it is a victory for their side...
    Prythe
  • TitonusTitonus Youngstown, OhioMember Posts: 238 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Daeir said:
    I'm kind of proxy bummed for both sides. Vivification is not a small thing and neither is the relaxation of forest enemy potency overall. Something worth more than just an OOC announcement post, tbh. Seems like something that should've been the culmination of a greater event, not just a bandaid response to nearly 10 years worth of criticism on a dated game system. People are gonna foist this up as evidence that "you can chaaaange the woooorld" when in actuality it's just a triage response to a conflict so toxic that it was literally and figuratively driving people away from the game.

    I doubt there'd have been any shortage of people willing to help make an event like that happen.

    World-scale RP seems to be eating shit a little bit as of late.
    Extermination I don't think was ever, in itself, the problem. It was how we got Eleusis' attention, sure. That's how it was always meant to operate. They had OP forestal offensive(summon, flow, conceal, port, forestbinding) to make up for it. The tools have always been there, and they've always been used. And I can't even say not to the extent we've used them now. MLC>OIA would exterminate entire forests in a go also, and it never required divine intervention to the scale of this, ICly unexplainable change.
  • NaomaNaoma Member Posts: 69 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    The change would have happened regardless of when and it stated such. There was literally no retaliation forestals could do. Oh lets bunch up and kill them. Yeah that wont work when at times it was literally Bors and I only fighting. To which you would group up and steam roll us. I see no point in your arguments when Mhaldor at large is bitching because they have a playing field leveled. 
  • TitonusTitonus Youngstown, OhioMember Posts: 238 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    I'm pretty sure I said that this would eventually be pretty cool, we're talking about the fact that, Vivify is a pretty big thing, with nothing to explain it's becoming a thing.

    Also with the fact that I haven't been able to locate anything saying why a necromancers essence would be tied to the Red Fog, considering essence and Necromancy both existed prior to Mhaldor Island and the Red Fog.

    Finally, Vivify and the incurring effect on global essence regeneration feels more like a divine punishment, than a balancing agent added to level this.

    I won't, and I doubt any of the Mhaldorian aggressors will either, take responsibility for the Eleusian player base(which has always had the population to play with Mhaldor) to have taken a downswing towards RPers and non-comms instead. Does that switch mean that the conflict between Eleusis and Mhaldor suddenly doesn't exist anymore? You seem to either not know, remember, or understand, that our PK player base, is also our RP invested player base. The majority of established players leave other cities for Mdor, BECAUSE of our enforced RP plus the fact that we are so heavily involved in worldwide PK. The same for Targ, and the same for how Eleusis use to be. This really isn't our fault, but the finger pointing from either side still doesn't correct the RP inconsistencies. 
  • TaryiusTaryius Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 913 @ - Epic Achaean
    edited June 2017
    Edit: Not worth writing the same long winded response over and over... In summary: Balance changes will come in time, RP events for this would've been nice, Mhaldor will not always be on top. We're not all complaining that Eleusis got a way to hit back.
  • TaryiusTaryius Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 913 @ - Epic Achaean
    Titonus said:

    Also with the fact that I haven't been able to locate anything saying why a necromancers essence would be tied to the Red Fog, considering essence and Necromancy both existed prior to Mhaldor Island and the Red Fog.

    It doesn't even remove the Red Fog, just coexists alongside it. Foggy plants, and considered we have a forest room and other plants on the Isle it means plants and fog have lived together without affecting our Life Essence.

    Sorry for double post.
  • GavriilGavriil Member Posts: 82 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Yea.... I joined before the conclave thing. Might be why I remember Eleusis as more unified than it has been recently. 
  • TitonusTitonus Youngstown, OhioMember Posts: 238 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    edited June 2017
    Makarios said:

    words

    On punishment: this 100% is not intended as a punishment for Mhaldor. We actually talked about making exterm mess with sunlight generation too, but decided it didn't really translate very well. I do think we can make exterm more high impact now that its much more limited though, so we'll be discussing options there.

    More words happened after.

    The (edit:) current impact is very much lost when someone can forestbind as soon as we begin exterminating. Maybe have forestbind require a certain number of completed exterminations before it is successful? I don't really know how to go about that issue, and it might only be an issue currently with me because the 1 exterm, forestbind, worldburn situation is still so fresh in my mind right now.
    Taryius
  • NaomaNaoma Member Posts: 69 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Simple solution. Don't turtle up on a shrine?
    Gavriil
  • NazihkNazihk Member Posts: 993 @ - Epic Achaean
    Kill Forestbind entirely, there's no good reason for the skill to exist. It's an outdated relic from an earlier time.
  • ReysonReyson Member Posts: 812 @ - Epic Achaean
    Given you can't exterminate that many rooms in a row anymore, I'm not sure why forestbinding is a thing, tbh.
  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo DomingoMember Posts: 3,542 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Obviously its  so you guys Suffer in the Suffering.

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

    CailinCaelan
  • TitonusTitonus Youngstown, OhioMember Posts: 238 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Naoma said:
    Simple solution. Don't turtle up on a shrine?
    I think you're missing the point here. Or just trying to be argumentative. 
  • NaomaNaoma Member Posts: 69 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Titonus said:
    Naoma said:
    Simple solution. Don't turtle up on a shrine?
    I think you're missing the point here. Or just trying to be argumentative. 
    there is a thing called common sense. You exterm, and are enemied to Artemis, who tf in their right mind would turtle up on a shrine, and stand there?
  • KietKiet Member Posts: 3,263 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    When's the last time we wb'd you.
  • TaryiusTaryius Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 913 @ - Epic Achaean
    I completely forgot about worldburn until a couple weeks ago when we got worldburned at Eleusis' defendable... Shits scary but I'm glad most people don't use it.
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaMember Posts: 5,186 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited June 2017
    When you put up forestbind and we only have one room done - especially if it's an interior room, not a room connected to a road - we're in a pretty tight spot. I doubt the room was chosen to turtle up on, but rather as an rp and a coordination thing (there is a shrine to Artemis here, we will burn it first and bring down the shrine! Also it will help with defiling so they can't just pop in so easy). You understand once forestbind is up, we literally cannot enter forest rooms in that forest normally, right? We have to get a serpent to evade, or get to someone who is already inside, and if neither is an option, that's that.

    Forestbinding right on the first (and interior) room, and then very quickly doing worldburn while we're stuck, is pretty painful. It really sat sorely with us (not me so much so, I was online not but engaging, but others) because I recall we worked to try and bring even numbers to the fight... and that's what we got for our troubles. Forestbind most definitely needs a change, I was gonna wait until classleads but if we can do it sooner than that, I'm all for it.
    And I love too                                                                          Be still, my indelible friend
    That love soon might end                                                         You are unbreaking
    And be known in its aching                                                      Though quaking
    Shown in this shaking                                                             Though crazy
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  • NazihkNazihk Member Posts: 993 @ - Epic Achaean
    I'd worldburn you explicitly because you would hate it and it would make you mad. 
  • KietKiet Member Posts: 3,263 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I mean tbf I'd yell at any group who decided to start exterm on a shrine without defiling.
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaMember Posts: 5,186 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited June 2017
    Edit: Ehhh nevermind too many posts to see who posted to who.
    And I love too                                                                          Be still, my indelible friend
    That love soon might end                                                         You are unbreaking
    And be known in its aching                                                      Though quaking
    Shown in this shaking                                                             Though crazy
    Lately of my wasteland, baby                                                 That's just wasteland, baby
  • ReysonReyson Member Posts: 812 @ - Epic Achaean
    edited June 2017
    To clarify, we'd extermed a different room, they forestbound, and it was only when we were moving to get our ducks in a row that Mycen started worldburn. 

    I find the line of 'don't exterm on a shrine' a bit funny, coming from Naoma, because when I pointed it out, she:

    A ) Claimed she didn't know it was done until I told her;
    B ) Claimed she has no control whatsoever over what other people do;
    C ) Claimed Mycen kinda went rogue on that one and worldburned without her team knowing/asking her to.

    So now, getting the 'lol your fault' answer as if it was planned all along and totally what they'd wanted to do, a few days later after the fact, is pretty laughable. But that's forums for you. 
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