Classleads

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  • Yea, I posted the 1st classless on this. Granted, I didn't know everything that throwing axes can do ( @Rom had a long talk with me about it, lol), but yea, I'd still love a juggling throw returning type deal. 

    Of course, getting the ability returning like Sentinels (which returns to equipped, which means right to juggling, which is obviously a problem) won't happen, but maybe like......


    Have jesters get ropes, tie them to the handles of daggers/axes, and let them YANK STRINGS or something to pull them all back at once. Make it so that if another person tried to pick them up, it makes a Hester autoyank without balance penalty, but if it's still on the ground with a yank, maybe give it a small balance penalty (or none at all?)

    I should've added that to my classlead. Dammit.
  • Voidfist is fine. =)
  • I concur, have no problem killing Blademasters
  • Returning daggers of any kind, incoming tieing ropes, have been suggested again and again in many previous classleads. Not sure why it can't get approved. Will endorse this again!

    And please, don't ask to Nerf veils anymore. Get a veil and you are level playing Field. 

    And imo, all artefacts are balanced and fair, need not be equal. Everyone has access to them even without putting in real dollar. Opportunities are abound in game, ppl just don't want Artefacts hard enough. That aside, I have seen skills that kills Artefolks like Arties never existed. 

    If you are stuck, change course. 
  • Image result for cash

                  
  • JonathinJonathin Retired in a hole.
    Own a veil.

    Still think they're stupid.
    I am retired and log into the forums maybe once every 2 months. It was a good 20 years, live your best lives, friends.
  • Yeah I definitely did not look in artefacts for a classlead I wanted to submit on pranks before going to sleep. If I did... I probably wouldn't expect "Returning" to be it. 
  • Kogan said:
    Yeah I definitely did not8 look in artefacts for a classlead I wanted to submit on pranks before going to sleep. If I did... I probably wouldn't expect "Returning" to be it. 
    Yeeeaaaa, sorry. First time, guess I didn't read enough. 
  • edited April 2017
    I support veils. 

    I don't think people are stupid for disliking them. I support your right to think they should be removed. Will still censure and vote down any classlead to remove them.

    Artifacts should be powerful. Some should be infuriating. If i want to spend 2k credits on being able to hide from you, or jump you, I should. And you should have to invest the same to nullify that advantage.

    The games model is based around credit purchases. Big ticket items like this are good for the game, even if they're bad for you personally or irritate the fuck out of you.

    /doesn't own one
  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo Domingo
    At this points those classleads are just a statement anyway. If veils were ever to be removed, I doubt it'd just be because of one of them..

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

  • Hopefully veils do get removed.  Leave the SoW cloaks that give veil-like ability for an hour.

    I'm A-Okay with that sticking around so long as constant veil isn't.  If you want to hide/be sneaky, invest in a couple of those shrouds and put them in a non-decay bag.
  • edited April 2017
    Not economical to remove veils bro. And I still don't get why veils should be removed from mechanics point of new, shouldn't link veils to haves and haves-not discussion*, just game mechanic.

    *I used to think veils should be removed too. Then I decided and hunted like mad and got a veil for myself. Now I think they are fine.
  • Atalkez said:
    Dochitha said:
    Not economical to remove veils bro. And I still don't get why veils should be removed from mechanics point of new, shouldn't link veils to haves and haves-not discussion*, just game mechanic.

    It's not really economical for them to be there, either. Sure, you get the people who are willing to buy them or grind them out - but you will have twice or three times as many that look at that cost and say 'no thanks'. I know we all like this game a lot, and we're hooked, but let's be honest: it's goddamn expensive. You shouldn't have a $500 item that you need just to find people when there are only 200 people around to begin with.

    *I used to think veils should be removed too. Then I decided and hunted like mad and got a veil for myself. Now I think they are fine.

    See issue > buys into issue > no longer an issue -- I assume you see the problem with that statement boss.

    I disagree completely. 

    Is there a market for this thing? Yes. Will people pay for it? Yes. Then there is an economical reason to have them exist.

    Artifacts are meant to be strong. They are meant to change things and meant to give advantages over people who don't have them. Being able to hide from you is an advantage. If you don't like me being able to jump you, buy one. Besides, the only reason you want to be able to find people is to kill them. An artifact stopping you from doing that is entirely valid.

    That's my opinion and it's not going to change.

    I still don't own a veil. But I will.
  • ataklkez isbrifbtb fuck veils fuxk the  songard etf 
  • edited April 2017
    Devran said:
    Atalkez said:
    Dochitha said:
    Not economical to remove veils bro. And I still don't get why veils should be removed from mechanics point of new, shouldn't link veils to haves and haves-not discussion*, just game mechanic.

    It's not really economical for them to be there, either. Sure, you get the people who are willing to buy them or grind them out - but you will have twice or three times as many that look at that cost and say 'no thanks'. I know we all like this game a lot, and we're hooked, but let's be honest: it's goddamn expensive. You shouldn't have a $500 item that you need just to find people when there are only 200 people around to begin with.

    *I used to think veils should be removed too. Then I decided and hunted like mad and got a veil for myself. Now I think they are fine.

    See issue > buys into issue > no longer an issue -- I assume you see the problem with that statement boss.

    I disagree completely. 

    Is there a market for this thing? Yes. Will people pay for it? Yes. Then there is an economical reason to have them exist.

    Artifacts are meant to be strong. They are meant to change things and meant to give advantages over people who don't have them. Being able to hide from you is an advantage. If you don't like me being able to jump you, buy one. Besides, the only reason you want to be able to find people is to kill them. An artifact stopping you from doing that is entirely valid.

    That's my opinion and it's not going to change.

    I still don't own a veil. But I will.

    Except that's not how a market works. You can get 10 people to buy X for $2,000 because they view that as a good investment/price, congratulations you made $20,000. Everyone else turns away, because they're priced out of it. You don't get rich off of this.

    If you can get 3,000 people to buy Y for $50, because they view this as a good investment/price, you make $150,000. Now anyone can afford it, and it's not such a burden to do so. Congratulations you increased your base of operation and increased sales/profits at the same time.

    Edit: Also, it's worth considering the fact that several of the people who did purchase veil, only did so to counteract veil to begin with. I know I did, and I can name at least 10 people right now who did the same thing. That's $5,000 that I can name off the top of my head right now that wouldn't have purchased this item for the hide aspect to begin with if someone else hadn't already spent it. That doesn't mean that money wouldn't go to the game, it just means it would be in the form of other stuff. If I got a 2000 credit refund of my veil today, I'd have them spent within an hour. 45 minutes of which would be me figuring out what to buy, because I have way more than 2000 credits worth of crap I want at some point.




    Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
  • edited April 2017
    Your argument is invalid. You bought it to stop others from hiding from you/being able to jump you/your friends. So what?

    How is that in any way different than investing the time to bash to Dragon so that you don't get damage killed? How is that different than investing the time in learning combat so you can kill people who would otherwise kill you if you engaged them? It's still investing a resource (time/money) into something so that others can't do something to you (hide from/jump)

    If someone wants to spend 2k credits in order for the benefit it gives them then they have that right. You equally have that right. You also have the right to put up with it if you choose not to.

    And don't be ridiculous by saying veils should be lowered in price so everyone can afford it. It's a premium tier artifact and its bonuses are intended to be extremely powerful, thus the price tag. If the game doesn't have things like this then it's boring as shit. It's like nerfing all the fun overpowered abilities. Game gets old and fast.

    You're like "But people buy veils because other people buy veils and so in the end veils are pointless!" Except you're wrong, because there will always be more people who can't afford veils than those who can. And while that might be a bit harsh, oh well. Artifacts are expensive. Deal with it.
  • Devran said:
    And don't be ridiculous by saying veils should be lowered in price so everyone can afford it. It's a premium tier artifact and its bonuses are intended to be extremely powerful, thus the price tag. If the game doesn't have things like this then it's boring as shit. It's like nerfing all the fun overpowered abilities. Game gets old and fast.
    This would be a better argument if veils were a remotely fun mechanic. In what way does not being able to find/interact with people make the game more interesting?
  • Calling veils fun... I think this discussion has peaked.
  • KenwayKenway San Francisco
    If someone with a veil participates in a player kill they become detectable for a duration. Maintains usefulness as a gank/infiltration tool and for always being able to see other veiled people but makes dealing with it less of a wall and more of a steep slope with spikes and falling rocks. Win win. Or something.

    - Limb Counter - Fracture Relapsing -
    "Honestly, I just love that it counts limbs." - Mizik Corten
  • KayeilKayeil Washington State
    There are still those of us who want and use veils for non-combat reasons. I think the thing that needs to happen is once you've done something aggressive the defense drops for X amount of time. Therefore, the veil haters are met halfway when it comes to combat implications.

    As for people who don't always want to be found and interact, so what? Not everyone is here to socialize every single minute they're in-game. If they want to interact with you, they will find you or go to some spot that is known for high traffic and interaction with other players.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • Devran said:
    Atalkez said:
    Dochitha said:
    Not economical to remove veils bro. And I still don't get why veils should be removed from mechanics point of new, shouldn't link veils to haves and haves-not discussion*, just game mechanic.

    It's not really economical for them to be there, either. Sure, you get the people who are willing to buy them or grind them out - but you will have twice or three times as many that look at that cost and say 'no thanks'. I know we all like this game a lot, and we're hooked, but let's be honest: it's goddamn expensive. You shouldn't have a $500 item that you need just to find people when there are only 200 people around to begin with.

    *I used to think veils should be removed too. Then I decided and hunted like mad and got a veil for myself. Now I think they are fine.

    See issue > buys into issue > no longer an issue -- I assume you see the problem with that statement boss.

    I disagree completely. 

    Is there a market for this thing? Yes. Will people pay for it? Yes. Then there is an economical reason to have them exist.


    Same could be said for nuclear technological warfare.


    Is there a market for this thing? Hell yes. Will people pay for it? Top damn dollar. ...Then there is an economical reason to have them? Well...No.
  • Hahahaha. Nuclear warfare. 
  • Devran said:
    Hahahaha. Nuclear warfare. 

    Point being made is pretty simple. You cant just say that "if people pay for it, then it is good for the economy"! That isnt even how the economy works. You need to approach this from a different angle if you are attempting to defend it, because so far you are coming out flat.
  • Kayeil said:
    There are still those of us who want and use veils for non-combat reasons. I think the thing that needs to happen is once you've done something aggressive the defense drops for X amount of time. Therefore, the veil haters are met halfway when it comes to combat implications.

    As for people who don't always want to be found and interact, so what? Not everyone is here to socialize every single minute they're in-game. If they want to interact with you, they will find you or go to some spot that is known for high traffic and interaction with other players.

    Knowing you're online, or even being able to see what room you're currently AFK in, doesn't equate to interacting with you. Neither does it mean you have to socialize with anyone. I think you're getting 'being able to be seen' and 'being bothered' confused.

    Besides that, you're hiding from who exactly? Not the people who bought the same thing you did, because they can find you regardless. So you're hiding from people who probably don't even know who you are? Seems trivial to lose, to me.




    Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
  • First they came for the Veils, and we did nothing.

    Then they came for the Collars and Int Sashes and we did nothing.

    Then they came for the Level 3 weapon artifacts and the game was suddenly boring as shit.

    Sure, this post is a poor argument. But it's a very slippery slope when you start removing artifacts like this.
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