What Happened To You Today?

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  • AhmetAhmet Wherever I wanna be
    Thurisaz. Meteor. Ether displace.
    Huh. Neat.
  • You can do it while inside.  If you're on mono, inside, and spamming radiance.  Not much you can do outside of just go "Well, wait for our monk to counter-lock me.  Or duanathar to escape."

    It isn't an interesting mechanic.
  • Ahmet said:
    Thurisaz. Meteor. Ether displace.
    Thurisaz/meteor both have distance limitations, while telepathy does not. Ether displace is the only valid counter you listed, and its negated by a monolith. So in realty, the only real counter is another monk.

  • Where is the lol button when it's needed most? 
  • AhmetAhmet Wherever I wanna be
    Oh did thurisaz and meteor get changed back with the sweeping changes to LoS? Huh. Good to know. Doppleganger, maybe? Idk how those stupid things work.
    Huh. Neat.
  • edited February 2017
    Ahmet said:
    Oh did thurisaz and meteor get changed back with the sweeping changes to LoS? Huh. Good to know. Doppleganger, maybe? Idk how those stupid things work.
    Doppleganger is line of sight only. Like I said previously, only real counter to an intelligent monk sitting in a safe room on the other side of the city is to have your own monk.

    I'm not as annoyed about the telepathy as Frederich is, but I don't disagree with him. Telepathy is pretty much the last thing that has remained area-wide when every other type of range has been limited to a set distance from the origin or line of sight only.

  • AhmetAhmet Wherever I wanna be
    I could have sworn there was a channeled summon that bypassed monolith, but maybe Im high.
    Huh. Neat.
  • Doppleganger can get banished/killed, then they have free reign to spam you once more.  (Until maybe they get a new contract with one? idek.)

    There should be more counters to it other than "Hope we have a monk or this is just gonna suck."  Either by limiting the range of certain telepathy skills to INT/2 rooms away, or by simply not allowing mind locks to be started/maintained easily from 18+ rooms away.  Radiance, while hillariously effective at it's job, shouldn't be usable whenever you can just sit behind a locked door and go "NEENER NEENER!"
  • edited February 2017

    The forestal one bypasses monolith (but is slowed by it), but that requires being in a forest and is faction-locked. I think ether displace will still complete if you drop the monolith after it's started, but it can't be started on a target who is on a monolith unless they're a mutual ally.

  • I'm now at level 98, 'lady of creation'. so, almost there!

    2015/01/12 Tecton, the Terraformer has bestowed His divine favour upon you. It will last for approximately 1 Achaean month.
  • Antonius said:

    The forestal one bypasses monolith (but is slowed by it), but that requires being in a forest and is faction-locked. I think ether displace will still complete if you drop the monolith after it's started, but it can't be started on a target who is on a monolith unless they're a mutual ally.

    This is correct regarding displace, but any intelligent monk who's about to use radiance is going to drop a monolith to prevent the target from quickly traveling to him or summoning him while he's off eq for the next 10 years.

  • Sure, let's lessen the range on Radiance and telepathy locks. It's annoying to fight whether you're defending or attacking in a raid.
     <3 
  • Like.  INT range to get a lock (or even INT/2) to get a lock, as per now.  With up to INT*2 wherein eq times are heightened, WP/mana is used more, etc etc.

    If you're going to allow cross-map shit, at least make it more costly than it is.  As of right now you can just batter > blackout > Disrupt and they won't get anywhere until they concentrate to get back on eq.  It's a bit silly to just do this as harassment.  Lord have mercy if the person is actually being attacked.
  • That instance was hardly harassment, though. You were a raiding group inside Hashan. 
     <3 
  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo Domingo
    Just make it a bit more costly on WP or some such depending on how far the monk is from the target. I don't see the problem with Monk having that uniqueness.

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

  • edited February 2017
    Yep, Telepathy radiance is ridiculously annoying, mostly because it forces your people to constantly duanathar or having to leave the area in some other fashion to avoid it, which from a strategist point of view is pretty effective and disabling.

    From a risk vs reward scenario, there is very little risk to a smart monk using radiance vs the reward of actually getting a kill. They can easily fortify themselves in a room in the city, click the button, then sip some tea while eating a biscuit and watch the screen to see if it worked. If they are with a group, it is even more effective as they likely wont be interrupted by someone entering.

    It isnt just raids either, where a monk could just as easily slip a radiance in during a skirmish in the area to either kill off another target or force that person to abandon their group, but also smart monks that sneak in and attempt to pop someone for X reasons. Pray they are paying attention..


    I dont mind the ability in itself, I just wish there were more forms of counterplay to it.. or at the least more risk for the reward.


  • Antidas said:
    Antonius said:

    The forestal one bypasses monolith (but is slowed by it), but that requires being in a forest and is faction-locked. I think ether displace will still complete if you drop the monolith after it's started, but it can't be started on a target who is on a monolith unless they're a mutual ally.

    This is correct regarding displace, but any intelligent monk who's about to use radiance is going to drop a monolith to prevent the target from quickly traveling to him or summoning him while he's off eq for the next 10 years.
    And is also going to be sitting on guards, so when you do displace him you die.

  • Displace transports them to you, no?
         He is a coward who has to bring two friends as backup to jump people hunting.

  • Mathilda said:
    That instance was hardly harassment, though. You were a raiding group inside Hashan. 
    Harassment as in harassing someone and fucking with them (aka; just sitting in safety and throwing shit at us to just annoy us)

    Not harassment in the "imma issue u" sense.  More the "Being a god damn annoying pest" sense.
  • If you raid a city, you put yourself at the mercy of the other side. Don't want to get 'harassed'? Don't raid that city. People will either change the behavior to encourage raids, or the city will do without inbound conflict that is not as annoying to fight as they are. 

    Personally, I don't mind area-wide telepathy. I know the huge push as been to small-contained areas for group fights/city raids, but at that point, it really does come down to "which group is larger/more artefacted/able to pump out more damage". I always found the ability to use ranged attacks as an extra strategy for smaller, more capable groups. If the larger defenders/attackers get you into the room with them, you die. If you can keep them at ranged, you may be able to pick them off or pull them apart. With everything basically becoming LoS, the idea of strategy feels like it boils down to either beckon into a totem, or get all your Dragons/Serpents/Knights/artie-bow owners together and pick people off with arrows. Which then it boils down to "which side has the more ability to LoS, or bring in a DW to prevent it" and then we revert to strategy A. 

    I understand that long skirmishes are not fun, and raiding is all about room control due to tanks. I am biased, though, as I have never enjoyed either digging in and waiting for the rush, or choosing the most opportune time to rush. 
  • @Israyhl

    It's the fact that the only way to counter said long-range-across-the-map harassment, is by having your own monk.  There is no skill, or prowess there.  It is, quite literally, a "Leave or die." effect.  In an offensive raid against the defending monk.  They can turtle and split the group.  If the offenders don't have a monk, whoever the defending monk targets has to Duanathar/use some other method to leave (raido, etc).  Then they have to get a way back in.  If they Duanathar, they can get cloud ganked.  So, the real tactic here is to just have a monk to stop it.  If you don't, you lose.  If you cannot fast travel out of a city (ala unartied folk), you lose.

    There is no way you can attack them or get retribution on them in the midst of the raid.  Because you cannot touch them.  This isn't a fun, nor fair, mechanic.  This issue lies alone with Radiance, and just seeing it changed would be more than enough to deal with the bull that it provides. 
  • I can put an end to the Monk thing by taking on the class.

    (Is there a limit to how many classes one may have?)

    - To love another person is to see the face of G/d
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    - It's your apple, take a bite
    - Don't dream it ... be it


  • edited February 2017
    The problem with just limiting radiance to X number of rooms is that one, it is basically neutered unless the equilibrium time on it is DRASTICALLY reduced, and two, is there really a difference in radiancing behind a locked door/in a massive group from 2-5 rooms away with no LoS due to exits/walls, or an entire area away with no LoS due to exits/walls? The problem of radiance being unstoppable without reaching the monk or having your own monk still exists. 

    Using INT as a basis for room range isn't viable. If you do Int/2, you're looking at 6+ rooms away. While not a crossroads, persay, still close enough if the group decides to mount an offensive. If the defending/attacking group goes for a rush, then the range of 6-8 rooms (most people having 12-16 int) would make the still useless as the ONLY time the group would be in range would be when they are rushing or attempting to use their own LoS, in which case a monk off-eq trying to radiance is a hindrance to be left behind. If you do INT*2, 24-36 room range is a city, anyhow, so nothing changes. 

    If Telepathy is changed to LoS only (like doppleganger) then at that point, its true utility comes in spamming mind paralyse when the group is in the room with you. Unless you can still mind lock from anywhere in the area and only use certain abilities LoS, but unless a group is attacking, they are not going to sit in your LoS to let you use your ranged abilities. 

    So, at that point, why even keep radiance? It is a cool thematic insta-kill, but if it requires LoS or for your target to be less than 10 rooms away, its only application will be ganking afk people in cities. 
  • Require people using Radiance to not be standing on mono (since they're throwing their mind at them)

    Require the monk to be standing outside (rather than inside)

    There are a lot of ways to go about it, that still keeps its general use whilst hampering it's ability to do it without any ability of recourse.
  • Just because they need to be closer doesn't make it any less effective. 
    Deucalion says, "Torinn is quite nice."
  • Prythe said:
    I can put an end to the Monk thing by taking on the class.

    (Is there a limit to how many classes one may have?)
    There isn't a limit, no. I'm pretty sure @Antonius is every class that is allowed in Targossas.
  • If the Monk has to not be standing on a monolith, then you screw your entire raid party by requiring they, too, not stand on a monolith. And if there is no Alchemist to displace you or another ranged  movement ability, then we have the same issue that is being complained about. Only outside? Then we run into the same issue as the defending/attacking group chooses an outdoor room and we have the same complaint, except now flying away and breathrain is an option when it comes time to attack.

    Torinn said:
    Just because they need to be closer doesn't make it any less effective. 
    I agree entirely that being closer doesn't make it less effective. My point is this: If you have to be within six rooms, the defending party will stand seven rooms out while they strategise and decide when to rush. If you make it more, then nothing is changed as the monk who is using radiance will still be behind a locked room or in a group, doing nothing but making the monk's laughter easier to hear. If you combine the 'closer with no monolith' approach, then everyone will still stay out of range until someone with a ranged movement ability joins, or just stay out of range until they are ready to rush. And you still have the same problem of walls/large groups/doors. The only change in annoyance is that the defending group can choose to stand one room more than your range. In which case - radiance will never be used as no one (competent) will ever keep their group in range. All you're doing, then, is shrinking your area, not removing its ability to annoy everyone in that area. So instead of 'duanathar' we go 'e' instead. 

  • My idea was to incorporate a way to combat radiance in particular. Batter/impatience should probably be LoS base s like most everything else, but radiance has to work area wide for it to be what it is.

    It would be kind of cool if it was an actual combat within combat. Radiance has a certain length before it completes, and it has stages. So adding an active way to reduce the stage of radiance would be neat. Steel mind or compose or something. So you could stand there and combat it the entire time, leave area to break lock, or have someone else lock you. If you choose to actively fight it, the command would obviously take eq, and would be just fast enough to beat radiance but slow enough to make the person completely occupied with that.




    Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
  • Just need another way to break radiance than simply leaving the area. As it stands you can heavily skew a fight just by starting radiance as your group rushes, forcing one (or more) key fighters out and putting them at a loss with ZERO effort or risk.
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