Memorable quotes

Kafziel

I mean these people got all the way to dragon, they should know about the Dragonbow thing. It's not like they're little 20 year olds or anything

Cooper

Someone who gets dragon at 20 should know how to evade a gank without dying.

Cynlael

I feel like none this complaining would've have happened if it was like... Anyone but Proficy that killed them. For once, I actually agree with Cooper, no one who reaches Dragon is gonna be oblivious as to what their skills do. It's a conflict game, not a hand holding, happy rainbows game.

Also their 'losing of dragon' could've easily been prevented, simply by gaining 1-2% before doing their ceremony. Which doesn't take long. At all. I find it odd how none of the two mentioned are here on the forums complaining about their deaths. Maybe it's because they can sort things out IG, I guess. Hmmmm.

Jeslyn

Proficy is hardly innocent! This is one of the guys that trolls novices in Manara. Of course people would complain if it was him. :P

Edit: Back when I was Cyrenian, I got enough complaints from novices that I ended up just placing monoliths all over manara to give them a break. Because what novice knows how to keep cloak/mass up.

Kayeil

Not everyone knows about relics, especially if they weren't here for the events, and the same people are always holding them. If someone came back from dormancy or started out after the relic events it's pretty easy for them to just be entirely oblivious to the relics, or at least not know how they work. If you get any of the good ones, you're gonna get jumped by one of the people who always has 'em, so most people don't even try.

Also, it's just generally poor form. So what if people are AWARE of the dragon abilities? It doesn't mean they coded a whole set up beforehand, and not every dragon is a PKer that knows how to fight offensively or defend themselves. Just let someone enjoy. Unless they've leeched their way to dragon, they've put in a lot of hours, give 'em a break to enjoy the result of it.

Plus there's just no excuse for anyone getting stuck with Lifegiver randomly after dying, especially young characters. Usually people are oblivious that they even have it when that happens. You already died once, maybe twice if bursted... no need to die two more times because a PKer wants it.

Jhui

Jeslyn said:

Proficy is hardly innocent! This is one of the guys that trolls novices in Manara. Of course people would complain if it was him. :P

Edit: Back when I was Cyrenian, I got enough complaints from novices that I ended up just placing monoliths all over manara to give them a break. Because what novice knows how to keep cloak/mass up.

Wtf does this even mean. I can't even picture in my head what you're claiming he did.

Cynlael

Here's an idea: Stop complaining for other people. If the person being affected by deaths aren't complaining about, why do you feel the need to? Not everyone cares about dying as much as you do, and practically all of the ones who do, are capable of handling things in-game instead of immediately running to the forums.

Believe it or not, Proficy does talk to people.

Skye

In other news... my mystery box carts collapsed. Thanks to @Chris and @Drefan for emptying the 50k cart.  I've unpacked the remaining prizes from the 5k boxes and this is what I had leftover:

You take an enamelled plate of fried duck hearts from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take an enamelled plate of fried duck hearts from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take an enamelled plate of fried duck hearts from a gaily decorated gift box.
You get 10000 gold sovereigns from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 lobelia seeds from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 hawthorn berries from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 coal pieces from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 100 rawstones from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a crotcheted sky blue headband from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a chocolate birthday cake from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a sweet jalebi pastry from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a glazed vase of bright white speckled with lazuline from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a pair of glasses from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a fluted redwood vase from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a scroll possessing the firelash enchantment from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 25 platinumores from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 25 silverores from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a pert black maid's dress from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 goldenseal roots from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 pieces of kelp from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 pieces of bayberry bark from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 echinacea roots from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 skullcap flowers from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a sweet jalebi pastry from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a bowl of raspberry stuffed jellyfish with cream from a gaily decorated gift box.
You take a group of 1000 ginger roots from a gaily decorated gift box.
You get 2500 gold sovereigns from a gaily decorated gift box.
You get 200 gold sovereigns from a gaily decorated gift box.

Next one will be better I hope, provided I can get my hands on some exciting prizes

Dunn

Jhui said:

Jeslyn said:

Proficy is hardly innocent! This is one of the guys that trolls novices in Manara. Of course people would complain if it was him. :P

Edit: Back when I was Cyrenian, I got enough complaints from novices that I ended up just placing monoliths all over manara to give them a break. Because what novice knows how to keep cloak/mass up.

Wtf does this even mean. I can't even picture in my head what you're claiming he did.

Can't help but notice you're not online, friend. Less foruming, more driving back to your house.

Jeslyn

Just because you can't picture it, doesn't mean it didn't happen! You were not there! You didn't have your novice (who was Targossian) summoned from you and ganked. It seriously left a bad taste in my mouth because this guy was new and excited/ then quit soon afterwards.

Edit: I'm sure he is a nice guy, I don't know him, I just know what I saw.

Tristyn

She's not making it up, I was one of the Targossian novices he decided to summon and kill on February 21st, just a month into joining. Check my logs. I posted it on that date. Hahaha. I've gotten over it by now.

For memory sake!

Tristyn said:

Got my first death today while hunting on my phone during breakfast. La, la, la wandering around Manara, killing gnolls brainlessly, near the end of my hunt my phone starts spazzing out. Oh shit! A ranked 9th Mhaldorian. Okay, well I don't have any aliases. I'm going to try the old deliver trick. Starts begging the city, and find out there is a monolith sigil. Fuck, it's flamed and I can't move. So I start shielding and like a moron I forget about refuge. By the amount of time it took for him to kill me, which was surprisingly a long time, I could have been sipping cocktails in my Nirvana. Ah, well, lessoned learned. Just need to put a refuge button on my phone.

Jacen

It sounds pretty reasonable to me for a dragon achiever to not know a bit about PvP, especially a young dragon. You probably aren't investing much time in PvP if you're getting dragon at 20, unless you're autobashing and can code and such while you bash.

Tvistor

I'm pretty sure I saw her doing lessons in some stuff last night, so she wouldn't even be tri-trans against Captain Artefact. (I think he had tons of arties?)

For the record, I don't care much either way, but am surprised he evidently got away with the random killings for so long.

Shirszae

Cynlael said:

Here's an idea: Stop complaining for other people. If the person being affected by deaths aren't complaining about, why do you feel the need to? Not everyone cares about dying as much as you do, and practically all of the ones who do, are capable of handling things in-game instead of immediately running to the forums.

Believe it or not, Proficy does talk to people.

I think the point she is making is that people -did- complain about it. And just because people, and specially novices, are not complaining on the forum doesn't mean they are okay with it. Thats pretty poor logic, since not everyone in the game visits the forums. 

Fendrel

I love you guys but seriously stop being such special snowflakes.
That girl already had the dragon bow before she got dragon, and when Proficy jumped her she was with Xaden. If she was allowed to grind all the way to dragon I'm sure she had to do a few previous requirements to know at least that holding a relic makes her game for everyone.
Don't be so quick to judge a situation without getting the entire picture.

Cooper

Tvistor said:

I'm pretty sure I saw her doing lessons in some stuff last night, so she wouldn't even be tri-trans against Captain Artefact. (I think he had tons of arties?)

For the record, I don't care much either way, but am surprised he evidently got away with the random killings for so long.

While Proficy isn't the most amazing player or rule-follower in the game, he doesn't do much against the rules. The "newbies" he kills are generally people that delivered someone out of a fight or attacked him in a group battle. Not saying this is the case 100% of the time, but he's been around long enough that if he was actually griefing/breaking rules as frequently as the recent posters suggest, he would have been a shrub 10 years ago.

Tvistor

Aren't the new rules "Don't be a jerk"? I'm pretty sure they were implemented ages ago, and the cases on the last page seem pretty clear-cut (as well as being as recent as February).

Cynlael

Killing people who're holding relics (knowingly or not) seems like it's pretty well within the rules, then.

What do you want Proficy to do? Say, 'Hey, you know you're holding a relic, right?' before he kills them?

Fendrel

Tvistor said:

Aren't the new rules "Don't be a jerk"? I'm pretty sure they were implemented ages ago, and the cases on the last page seem pretty clear-cut (as well as being as recent as February).

Relics and PK

-------------

Without exception, those holding a Relic or who were holding a Relic when first attacked, puts them at risk of being attacked by anyone, for any reason - or no reason at all. This also applies to the original dig sites of the Relics: should you enter, be prepared!

That was clarified way long ago.

Tristyn

Are you seriously kidding me right now? I was completely new, not enemied to Mhaldor yet, and had not interacted with any Mhaldorians. He was doing this for FUN the whole month of February. Just because I got over it (until people are now sweeping it under the rug), doesn't mean the other novices he harassed did not. Stop making excuses for him. All of the novices he picked off were under level 50 at the time and had not participated in battle.

Ryzeth

Dortheron arrives from the west.     oh hi
You get the sudden urge to go hunting with Dortheron tagging along for free experience while he writes stuff up. Strange...    *suspicious*
Dortheron nudges you suggestively.         *halp*
You roll your eyes.
Dortheron says in a deep, almost purring voice, "Dooo eeet."
Dortheron says in a deep, almost purring voice, "Follow your feelings, regardless of the source."
Dortheron nudges you suggestively.
You say in a calm voice, "Pff, what do I get out of it."
Dortheron says to you in a deep, almost purring voice, "You get to bath in my charm. Plus I get closer to Dragon at the same time I get work do."
Dortheron says in a deep, almost purring voice, "Done."
You stick your tongue out and wetly go, "Pffhhttt!!"
Dortheron sniffles softly.      *you're our HoN! Don't be sniffling!*
You say in a calm voice, "Not in a hunting mood right now."
Dortheron slumps down dejectedly.
Dortheron says in a deep, almost purring voice, "Darn, my plan failed."
Dortheron says in a deep, almost purring voice, "But just for good measure, he's a bit of my charm to get you going."    *please dont...*
Dortheron rubs up against you affectionately.
Dortheron winks knowingly.
"Flee! Fly like the wind!" Dortheron cries out, making for the nearest exit.
Dortheron leaves to the west.

..
..
You tell Dortheron, "I need an adult."
Dortheron tells you, "Please, I'm a Raja. We rub ourselves on places to mark our territory and ownership."
Dortheron tells you, "You're my toy now. Dance, puppet, DANCE!"

Tvistor

Fendrel said:

Tvistor said:

Aren't the new rules "Don't be a jerk"? I'm pretty sure they were implemented ages ago, and the cases on the last page seem pretty clear-cut (as well as being as recent as February).

Relics and PK

-------------

Without exception, those holding a Relic or who were holding a Relic when first attacked, puts them at risk of being attacked by anyone, for any reason - or no reason at all. This also applies to the original dig sites of the Relics: should you enter, be prepared!

That was clarified way long ago.

I think there must be a miscommunication here. I'm also talking about Tristyn and Jeslyn's posts. I don't know what a relic is, but I suppose that's fair enough in the one instance of the dragon. I guess it's still a bit of a jerk move, but he had every right to do it. The other instances sound inexcusable.

Also I have to go beat a friend at Shogun 2, peaceout

Fendrel

Oh I honestly have no idea about what happened in February, I was too busy to log in at the time.
I'm just clarifying about what happened in this particular case.

Aerek

I feel like the discussion got a little off-base here. In the beginning, I don't think anyone was complaining about relics, getting ganked, or Proficy himself. People were eye-rolling at a tacky move that's happened many times now, and wondering why the game specifically enables/encourages ganking someone at the moment they reach one of the game's crowning achievements, at a moment where they are least-able to fight back, by giving them a relic without explanation or notification. Then folks started burning strawmen on both sides and now we can't read through all the smoke.

One death isn't a big deal, Dragon isn't hard to re-attain, relics are not a blight on society, Proficy isn't really that bad of a guy, and most people do know about the Dragonbow and yield it. But none of that touches on the heart of the matter, which is that there's no reason you should be silently handed the D-Bow in the first place, and no one arguing in favor of it has really offered one. It's not a part of some get-Dragonhood quest, Sycaerunax doesn't mention it in the ceremony, and it's the worst relic that does nothing for you even if you wanted it. All it does, the sole addition to the game the mechanic brings, is ganks on new dragons and the frustration/bad blood that brews. So why?

It is what it is, and we've all adapted to it or dealt with it, but that doesn't mean it makes any sense.

Tahquil

To be honest if I didn't know you got dragonbow when you got dragon until this topic. Had I gotten dragon and not known about relics I would have thought it was just a normal 'achievement' reward.

On the topic of relics and Pvp etc. PvP is very much an optional part of Achaea like roleplaying, PvE, questing, politics.. and so on. A player can theoretically play their character without being involved in PvP in any way and when they are taking part  of PvP it is usually by choice. Kinda sucks as you're not given a choice to refuse to take the dragonbow or lifegiver when it is presented to you.

Rohai

Broadly speaking, there's two ways to make a decision about whether or not to do something in-game. You can ask yourself, "Will this provide net overall enjoyment to the players involved?" or you can ask yourself, "Can I be shrubbed for doing this?" Someone can easily skate by indefinitely asking only the latter, but that doesn't make it any less puerile.

Cynlael

If things only happened in game, where -everyone- got enjoyment all the time from things happening, the game would likely be very dull and probably dead by now. There'll always be something that will be displeasing/unfun to some, such is the nature of the game. Death just happens to be one of these things.

Dairon

I was dormant when relics were first introduced and by the time I hit dragon after my return, I still didn't know what the Dragon-bow was. Thankfully, I had @Atalkez tell me to yield it. It would have sucked HARD if I died to someone as soon as I finished the ritual. Especially since, as a non-com, one of my major goals of the game was dragonhood itself. It should be when I feel good about my achievements, not feel like shit because I didn't yield something I'd never seen before. 

I would compare it to League of Legends.. imagine if you finally get to diamond league and end up losing it because you weren't told to click a certain button on a menu that you had no idea about. 

Tibitha

I'm sure Proficy's a bundle of fun and joy if he's on your side or if you're open PK already, but he has a history of picking on Targ novices. And if they ask why the hell they've been killed they're either convinced by him that they need to stop being cowards and he's within in his right to kill them or told by other people to just suck it up because "nothing will ever get done about him".

Example reasons that have been used by him for killing people (after you slog through the abuse for daring to ask):
- Delivering someone out of combat, four weeks ago.
- "Teaming" him when he was defiling a shrine solo (again, any time up to three weeks ago).
- "Teaming" him when he attacked your hunting party of three in Underworld with a Deathknight in tow.
- "Teaming" him when he raided Targ, once again, up to three weeks ago.

I'm sure you're getting the idea. Pretty much any combat situation that you didn't go into solo makes you open pk to Proficy for the next few weeks.

So yeah, I'm sure he manages to tread some weird kind of legal grey line, but I know of at least two novices who have just quit the game because of him and countless others who don't want to get involved in PK because they don't randomly want to get jumped when they're hunting some weeks from now. And for what? Killing some 18 year old who's barely managed to figure out their hunting aliases. Well done, I guess?

Aegoth

TBF, using Deliver on anyone is grounds for being open PK anytime, anywhere, for however long.