Miscellaneous Maths/Testing II

Eld

Sena said:

The script would probably be useful, though from that it sounds like a flat amount of damage is unlikely.

The reason I was wondering about it is that Tecton said it "adds a small bonus to the damage before it is multiplied by the critical modifier, so it gets better the higher your critical strength." If it was a multiplicative bonus, it wouldn't matter (aside from slight differences due to rounding) whether it was applied before or after the critical modifier.

In case you (or anyone else) want to play around with it, I packaged up the relevant bits of code and added some comments, to make it hopefully clear what's going on. I didn't do any testing after the cleaning up and packaging, but it should be fine. It only has damage values for drawslash (old ones, from before the bashing changes), but it should be pretty obvious how to add in other attacks. The list of denizens for which I got semi-accurate health numbers to use is also pretty small, so if you happen to have more (or more accurate) data on different denizens' max health, it would probably help.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0Bxhnkqe60WzXTUZqOGUzcHB2LUk/edit?usp=sharing

Razha

@Sena, can I see the current charts for DPS by class?

Sena

I don't think there have been any changes since I posted them earlier in the thread.

Synbios

@Sena, question: How big of a theoretical difference in bashing DPS would be if blademasters had either one of the following:

1. An added off-hand attack
2. Re-adjusted stance damage values

Sena

Without more specific information: it would make their DPS somewhere between infinity and negative infinity.

How much would the extra attack do and how would it work? How would the stance damage values be adjusted?

Atalkez

@Sena what if multislash was made available for bashing?

Not around to help test

Sena

Same answer. Without more specific information: it would make their DPS somewhere between infinity and negative infinity.

How much damage would each multislash hit do, and what would the accuracy be like (if it could miss)?

It doesn't really make any difference what the method is. Whether you change base drawslash damage, change stance modifiers, allow striking denizens, allow infusions to give bonuses against denizens, allow burst and drawslash to be comboed, allow twoarts attacks besides drawslash to be used on denizens, give blademasters a bonus to crit rate, or any of a dozen other possible changes, it doesn't matter, all that matters is the specific details and numbers.

Nim

@Sena: What if instead of Arash matching standard DPS, some other stance matched the standard DPS? Eg. some other stance did the same damage Arash currently does. Would Sanya or Thyr damage become particularly crazy if unstanced became the new standard? If Sanya or Thyr became the new standard, would Arash be particularly crazy? Is there ever a scenario where Doya becomes useful? How would Mir perform in these scenarios? How would bands scale the damage?

Sena

Changing drawslash to be balanced around Sanya instead of Arash would probably be the simplest way to fix it. That would make them on par with the other classes (except the overpowered ones using forged/artefact weapons). Arash wouldn't be too strong, because you're taking  ~25% (I think) more damage in exchange for dealing ~15% more damage.

The only way I can think of to make Doya useful without directly buffing the stance is to add a second attack that can be comboed with drawslash, and give that attack a balance/eq cost of 3s, unaffected by stances. Then any stance other than Doya or Mir will mean wasted damage because drawslash recovers early, while Doya and Mir match it perfectly (in that case, Doya will be better for offence and Mir will be better for defence). Bands complicate that, but I can think of two possible solutions: Bands modify the balance on the second attack, so it stays the same relative to drawslash, or the second attack is 2.5 seconds, which means without a band it matches up with unstanced/Sanya, and with a L3 band it matches up with Mir/Doya.

Synbios

Sena said:

How much would the extra attack do and how would it work? How would the stance damage values be adjusted?

Was thinking of damage values similar to either sternum strike or pommelstrike. 

Darklyre

Daeir said:

I really like Mizik's suggestion to add sternum strike and potentially even shin generation to bashing. BM bashing would probably quickly go up to being one of the best in the game again, which honestly, is where it sort of belongs.

BM bashing should be slash/strike anyways, if only so novices have a reason to learn how to strike.

But no shin. You add shin, you'd better give monks kai!

Mizik

Honestly, with Health Trans being balance less, it's probably better that attacks don't generate shin.

Just let Binding work on denizens without shin.

That all being said, I'm bashing in Mir right now with a 62/xxx/237 dagger and it's f'king amazing. We might not need shit! 

Just gotta swap all the novice files to learn weaponry first and save 100 lessons for prof.

Hasar

Anyone have numbers for mana and health regen rings?

Jhui

Hasar said:

Anyone have numbers for mana and health regen rings?

Planning ahead for year 2020?

Cynlael

Mizik said:

Honestly, with Health Trans being balance less, it's probably better that attacks don't generate shin.

Just let Binding work on denizens without shin.

That all being said, I'm bashing in Mir right now with a 62/xxx/237 dagger and it's f'king amazing. We might not need shit! 

Just gotta swap all the novice files to learn weaponry first and save 100 lessons for prof.

I'd ask for numbers... But that'd probably result in it getting nerfed >_>

Sena

Synbios said:

Sena said:

How much would the extra attack do and how would it work? How would the stance damage values be adjusted?

Was thinking of damage values similar to either sternum strike or pommelstrike. 

There are no damage values for sternum or pommelstrike against denizens. PvE damage and PvP damage are entirely unrelated. That's why I'm saying that it could literally be anything.

Cynlael

Could have it similarly to monks, wherein sternum strike would do ~1/2-2/3 of the damage that drawslash does.
So rather than it being like:
Orc Health: 100
 -Drawslash-
Orc Health: 93%

It would be more like:
Orc Health: 100%
 -Drawslash-
 -Sternum Strike-
Orc Health: 89-90%


edit: Mir/Sanya damage. Not Arash.

Razha

Is there any info on classless bashing? Most effective weapon proficiency, etc.

Sena

Not exactly. I have the damage formula for rapiers, but not other weapon types, so I don't know which weapons are best.

Sena

Haven't had a chance to look at it yet. I can test it now if any blademasters are around to help.

Mizik

Sanya feels solid.

I just jab with a 62/154/237 dagger if I need to Mir. DPS is like a thyr drawslash, except I can tank.

Eld

Shin healthtrans heals .5% of max health, rounded down, per point of shin used. Sanya cuts the cost by 10% as usual, but doesn't allow you to heal more than 50%, e.g., healthtrans 50 heals 25% of max health and costs 45 shin, and so on.

Synbios

@Sena: Got new numbers for post-classlead blademaster bashing?

Sena

Not yet.

Payne

got the new Tekura Limb damage numbers?

Sena

I don't really have any limb damage numbers, old or new.

Klendathu

Payne said:

got the new Tekura Limb damage numbers?

12, 4 and 96.

Eld

Klendathu said:

Payne said:

got the new Tekura Limb damage numbers?

12, 4 and 96.

That's Numberwang!

Klendathu

Eld said:

Klendathu said:

Payne said:

got the new Tekura Limb damage numbers?

12, 4 and 96.

That's Numberwang!

Sena

While we have Anarchaea with free trans skills, is there anything that needs to be tested?