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Comments
ETA: Yep. There's the post.
For me, while I don't care if we win or lose, I just don't feel like losing would be impactful either way because it doesn't feel like anything has been at stake for either side in this. We went to war over the curse, and it got resolved like 2/3 days in, if that. Since then it's just been a lot of drudgery on both sides, from what I've seen.
ETA: I should say, Stheno's weird post outlining enslaving Sothantos or everybody else as her terms for defeat doesn't change my mind on this. Feels like a bit of a bizarre afterthought that still has no real impact. Not Stheno's fault, obviously, but this war system very much still leaves a lot to be desired, and hasn't fixed any of the problems of previous wars, in my eyes.
You don't like the story you... didn't contribute to? You don't like the system? You don't like engaging with or fighting Mhaldor? No one (but your CL) is forcing you to do these things. If you make a declaration of war, and another faction engages you in good faith, don't waste their time lecturing them on why loss is good and meaningful, and then try to spin why this loss doesn't count for you. You just made fun of Eleusis for this.
If you don't like the contents of my post, talk to Sothantos. We've been drafting terms for a while.
Reaching down with a massive hand, Sartan lifts your head and draws a taloned finger across your throat, the wound closing as He does so.
Aegis, God of War says, "You are dismissed from My demense, Astarod. Go forth and fight well. Bleed fiercely, and climb the purpose you have sought to chase for."
The terms have only been discussed OOCly by leadership from what I understand, and brought up in the middle of the war. I've found it super weird from the start and it really just seems like an attempt to make something meaningful out of the last month... but that's just it, the last month has been absolutely miserable for most people involved. Why try to make it more important? Why magnify frustrations with bugs and everything else?
Take what you want from the war, but the players that are not in leadership positions are not OOCly obligated to play along, nor are we somehow not allowed to voice disapproval at something we weren't involved in. Of course we're going to discuss the system, the story, and what fighting with your IC faction has been like. Of course we're going to try to minimize the loss IC, especially with so many bugs and how the war's been played. Personally I find the torture stuff to be extremely distasteful, so I have absolutely no interest in that vein of RP.
Do what you have to to make the game fun for you and people you play with - whether that's dismissing the war entirely and just screwing around, being proud of the victory, or whatever. Above all else this is a game. Let's try to remember that and have fun, ideally not at the cost of anyone else's fun.
Reaching down with a massive hand, Sartan lifts your head and draws a taloned finger across your throat, the wound closing as He does so.
You're 0-1 without me, babe.
My issue is with the blandness of the war system and the lack of impactful anything that we've seen because of it over the last 3 weeks.
Mhaldor played this war better than Targossas - there's no denying it. But the system itself is still fundamentally flawed.
That's not on you, so I'm not sure why you'd choose to take it personally. I just wish war in modern Achaea meant something and had something other than bragging rights at stake for both sides. It could be a tremendously cool thing, but this current iteration is just a boring points-scoring exercise. I'd rather have just had a two city CTF and finished it off in a couple of hours.
Reckonings all came and went, no biggie in the day-to-day, Third Black Wave came and went, apart from Cyrene's reconstruction phase, no big change in the day-to-day. It's always been the player reaction and the direction shit goes in after the event that really makes the big changes in Achaea, from what I've seen, so this war system is absolutely in keeping with that philosophy, from the admin's point of view. At least it's consistent with other event types.
And this, I think, is why I'm rubbed the wrong way with the whole 'PR win is better than a real win,' thing. If the team you're playing as or against can't find it in them to transition the outcome into a real IC repercussion, then it actually IS a waste of a month. And the admins are always saying to embrace loss, and take it on the chin, some people on both sides have been very vocal about how everyone should be willing to take it in stride. The thing hasn't even finished, and the team that thinks it's going to lose is already trying to lay the groundwork for a 'lol nothing matters' resolution, one week away.
Edit: Sorry, there's no reason to be a dick to Cyrene.
It's not even like all our newbies are being ground into dust and begging for the war to end like during the Ashtan-Shallam war, or like we've been decisively smashed in any statement raids like we did when we ended the Mhaldor/Ashtan wars when I was Dawnlord. It'll just be like, welp, hard luck guys, the two years is up and we didn't quite [Ictinus-approved IC interpretation of overturning war points deficit]. Better luck next time!
This system needs major work before the next war. It's worse than it was previously.
I get that you don't like it, and you don't find it interesting, but it's not like Targossas hasn't tried everything it can to win, just like Mhaldor has. If we lose, you better believe S will take us to task for losing (we already get jabbed for not defending even if we're super outnumbered), and if there's nothing like that coming from your Patron, then it's on your CLs to create the atmosphere where it's acceptable and desireable to not treat it as an OOC flaw with the system and therefore impossible to reconcile with IC repercussion. If our situations were reversed, wouldn't you tell us we're putting OOC attitudes before a viable IC avenue?
ETA: Not to say that the system is perfect, and that I wouldn't really prefer a rework before we go into the next thing. But ultimately, almost all of combat is OOC in nature, in Achaea. If my character went around discounting everyone I suspected of automation as not being a good fighter, despite getting my ass kicked, you'd treat my character as a lunatic and me as a bad roleplayer, right?
ETA2: I don't always love having to go against long odds, but man, I do like that Sartan makes everything feel important IC through the constant presence and consistency of the Godrole. Big, big props there.
Just feels too game-y and not at all war-y.
-We need a war system
- Given war system
-We should have gotten this.
-Admin: you need to use this first
-Use.
- Bitch (for better or worse)
- Offer ideas for new system
-New system w some offered ideas
Rinse/repeat
Honestly? Totally feels warlike. You don't have to directly consider mechanical numbers for the ingame so much as looking at the damage done between the cities, death count, etc as an analogue.
Needless to say, without a mechanic like this, you're usually going to have the losing side constantly fighting and never "giving up". I've seen this across multiple games and the ONLY games not having a mechanical quantifier in are the ones where you can actually destroy a faction which isn't something that would really work in this game.
The best thing to do is to just accept it, fit it into RP in a way that makes you feel better as a player, and move on. The system itself hasn't felt terrible, the timeframe has just gone on too long and it could use some expansion.