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Comments
I want Seafaring to be lucrative. Personally, I think it is lucrative if you go out and hunt big monsters; I'm just learning that apparently some folks feel that 30-40k/hr is "not worth it", which blows my mind. Seafaring is already an activity where a level 60 with enough Seafaring to shoot a weapon can make as much as Dragon hunting. (As much as I make hunting anyway, but apparently I'm a pleb) I don't think it's a reasonable expectation to want Seafaring to be an activity where that level 60 can make as much as someone looping Annwyn with several thousand dollars of artefacts in tow. I'm not going to say the Admin can't do that, I'm just saying you shouldn't hold your breath.
I'd love to see L2-L4 monsters' gold buffed. I'd love to see the 20min cap on L1s removed, just so I can go Cutter hunt them without getting bored, even if the gold's not great. I'd love to see other ways to earn gold at sea that attracted people to sail. That's all great. I just don't want to "lucrative" to mean "effortless farming", because that just encourages people to AFK fish or solo-grind Mysia, instead of embracing the team aspect of sailing.
Comparing gold generation at level 80 to seafaring simply because a level 80 can jump onto a ship and do it is silly. To expand upon the things Cooper listed, there is maintenance costs for weapons, supply costs, ammo costs, crew pay, tokens, maps, flags, equipment, lesson costs, factions you have to learn about and deal with... the list goes on and on. And if you want to own your ship for regular seamonstering, that is going to be 5-10 million, before the cost of ship equipment and ammo.
Then there is also the very real risk of getting plundered and sunk.
Anyone who makes that sort of investment deserves to earn more than mid level bashing for their trouble. It also gives a purpose to city ships and *gasp* city navies. It brings more people out to sea, thus giving the pirates more people to attack and the pirate hunters more pirates to fight. It is win/win for everybody.
(As an aside to Ahmet, I've dumped more money into my ships over the last year than the cost of a few low level dragon bashing arties, and I have already said I agree that fully decked out dragons should earn more. This includes a 500cr bait bucket and a 200cr ammo rack to achieve the rather lowly level of profits I was getting pre-change, which was well below dragon).
It's not just gold (though that is a primary motivation, personally) but experience and essence, too, which makes hunting more attractive. I earn (far) more on all three counts hunting than I suspect I ever would killing sea monsters. There's also the ease of starting and stopping when I'm hunting. I can get everywhere I want to hunt in under a minute, and if I need to afk, leave entirely, or handle something else, I can do that immediately without worrying. Seafaring is too large a commitment to doing one single activity without a large enough reward to make it personally worthwhile.
Results of disembowel testing | Knight limb counter | GMCP AB files
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Related question: Is it legit to plunder a ship, sink it, then go back to salvage it, then repeat the cycle? Specially if the owner of said ship is actually dormant? Seems like a broken way to gain swashucklers experience. @Nicola, @Makarios.
And you won't understand the cause of your grief...
...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.
A ship that had long been at the bottom of the harbour has seemingly-permanent swashies on high alert.
Exp gained from plundering is virtually nonexistent (Not really a bug, just kinda sucky)
No way for the ship firing hookshot to untether (no tethers to chop) and SHIP DISENGAGE does not work as it is still based on the grapple mechanic.
SHIP DISENGAGE does not work alongside a ship because it is still based on the SHIP GRAPPLE mechanic.
All in all, I tried it on a couple of downed ships, and only was able to plunder one because of the high alert issue, and I made 50 gold off of it and no exp.
Regardless, this is something that needs a proper fix since the honour system really doesn't work. How about when a ship is salvaged with salvageops it is returned to its last harbour directly, instead of it being raised on the spot that it sank? This would be particularly helpful for people who don't have shipreturn set, since forceboarding is no longer an option, and it would make salvageops in a seamonster zone viable.
Not that I disagree with making salvaged ships move automatically to the nearest harbour or something.
And you won't understand the cause of your grief...
...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.
Also, if Ship Extend Plank was working properly (it presumably will be after bug fixes), you don't need forceboard to salvage and board a ship that you have perms on.
Lastly, as to the presumed rule, this has become kind of a problem in Achaea. There's been many "rules" that aren't listed in help files or news announces but are talked about, taken as common knowledge, and sometimes even enforced on issues (That part still boggles my mind). Granted raising a ship ad nauseum to sink it, like I said. would be obvious griefing. However, if it's a rule not to salvage an enemy ship to plunder -at all- it needs to be actually written somewhere that people can see before it is openly talked about or enforced. I think it's a fine rule, it just needs to actually be a rule and not hearsay.
I am in complete agreement with the this statement and I also find it profoundly frustrating.
A lot of these seafaring problems people are having seem to have a simple, common answer. Have friends.
Tl;dr: Don't be a dick.
ETA Clarification: ^ In response to Jinsun's "mind boggling" rules bit, since I got ninja'd.
We break shit, we report it, it gets fixed. Put the pitchforks away kids.
edit: enforced not in forced. It's early, I'm tired.
Edit: edited to fix mobile copypasta
A Cutter being able to salvage anything else but a Cutter is bloody ridiculous. How is that even managed? There's not enough bulk of the ship to provide the buoyancy, nor the capable crew size to accomplish such a thing. Galleys should be able to salvage any ship, Striders should be able to salvage Striders and Cutters, and Cutters should be able to salvage Cutters.
Additionally, with tethers working to slow ships dependent on certain situations, it would be great to have the ability to salvage and then tow a ship to a harbour.
Also, there are a couple of ships which have eternally been housed at the sea floor, dredged up when necessary for testing or training purposes. They were used well before the time of the Sea Arenas and until their owners rise from their watery graves to claim them once more, there is no reason why these ancient and abandoned vessels can't still be put to some use in the meantime.
It's easy enough to say "get a friend with another ship and test things out", but it's much more difficult to orchestrate in game with variance of play times and a general lack of interest in seafaring, which frankly is something that has always plagued Ashtan, and every city in varying degrees. At the end of the day, sometimes you have to make due with what you have instead of waiting for someone to come along and show as much interest as you.