The Bal'met event

Sabiru

Yeah, I don't really envy the two or three people who might otherwise be capable of producing something cool out of this, were it not for that impressively uninspiring majority. Guess the best you three(?) can hope for is a heavy-handed Deucalion, and even that's not quite as fun as if you had a shot at doing it on your own (you don't).

Sylvance

Genuine question here; I wasn't awake for the event and haven't had a chance to properly catch up yet:

1) Where has the knowledge that the Shallamese are getting a new City come from?

And, now, a not-so-genuine question:

2) Why would it take the wholesale destruction of Shallam for folks to start deciding how to fix Shallam?

Silas

To respond to 2): Lots of reasons.

Jonathin

1) Why wouldn't Shallam get a new city? Are they just going to leave the people in one of the biggest axes of conflict displaced with nowhere to go? We have clan for the refugees of Shallam and each House. I realize that it may be mindless hoping, but it also wouldn't make sense to shaft so many people like that. It also wouldn't make any sense IC to not rebuild the city.

2) Shallam was so far stuck into the status-quo that anything less would not have worked to get people to change things. The admin tried to impose change (however big or small) on the organization and people fought it every step of the way.

Achilles

Sylvance said:

Genuine question here; I wasn't awake for the event and haven't had a chance to properly catch up yet:

1) Where has the knowledge that the Shallamese are getting a new City come from?

And, now, a not-so-genuine question:

2) Why would it take the wholesale destruction of Shallam for folks to start deciding how to fix Shallam?

1) Well its assumed, otherwise Cyrene will soon have have to move from neutral-good to good.

2) Like a obsolete company with huge pensions, rising healthcare costs (insert 2012 election talking points here) Shallam needs to go through bankruptcy to clear up a lot of the malaise it has built up over time.  A fresh start, a opportunity to give the younger players a chance to take on bigger roles as well as giving people who aren't interested in being involved in a lot of conflict a chance for a clean break.

Silas

Yes and no.

The three Codices (incl. the Primary) in about four years did a lot more to harm Shallam than the people. The promotion of the wrong attitude was a major factor too.

Things were turning around in Shallam, but it was slow, and it'd always be limited. Killing the Te'Serra wipes away the Primary, sensibly, and so long as they don't just reimpose Old Shallam's leadership over New Shallam, there could well be a legit chance to make Good awesome and cool. Still on something of a knife edge, though, with all the little things that need to be weeded out.

Time will tell, etc.

Asmodron

Silas said:

I would've liked a little time between Shallam going boom and the revival of Deucalion. Even just a few hours to allow for people to feel at least some doubt would have added a lot to the atmosphere of being a refugee an Orphan.

Sylvance

Silas said:

Yes and no.

The three Codices (incl. the Primary) in about four years did a lot more to harm Shallam than the people. The promotion of the wrong attitude was a major factor too.

Things were turning around in Shallam, but it was slow, and it'd always be limited. Killing the Te'Serra wipes away the Primary, sensibly, and so long as they don't just reimpose Old Shallam's leadership over New Shallam, there could well be a legit chance to make Good awesome and cool. Still on something of a knife edge, though, with all the little things that need to be weeded out.

Time will tell, etc.

I think that IGly (as well as IRL) people will more likely vote for a name that they recognise and dislike than a 'Who?' candidate.  Happy to be proved wrong but, as has already been said, short of a fundamental change in the fundamental principles of Shallam, this will simply be a rerun.

I would rather see a new City emerge from this disaster than a New Shallam.

Sylvance

<double post>

Asmodron

I think if Shallam was to rebuild a new city that they change their take on the concepts of "good".

Firstly they can move into a more justice and righteous theme rather than the "dont harm innocent creatures" and "must follow this holy book" themes. A militant idea isnt bad and has worked several times in other games, simply the concept of "A City that stands for Truth, Enlightenment and Salvation" can very easily work. They can see cities like Ashtan and Mhaldor not a "sin because they have occies and necroes" but perhaps more of a threat and taint that -must- be removed.

Anyway there are loads of ways they can take this new path, my concept is only one of an aggressive  militant state that seeks to place the continent under their "stable" reign.

Sylvance

Asmodron said:

I think if Shallam was to rebuild a new city that they change their take on the concepts of "good".

Firstly they can move into a more justice and righteous theme rather than the "dont harm innocent creatures" and "must follow this holy book" themes. A militant idea isnt bad and has worked several times in other games, simply the concept of "A City that stands for Truth, Enlightenment and Salvation" can very easily work. They can see cities like Ashtan and Mhaldor not a "sin because they have occies and necroes" but perhaps more of a threat and taint that -must- be removed.

Anyway there are loads of ways they can take this new path, my concept is only one of an aggressive  militant state that seeks to place the continent under their "stable" reign.

I'm genuinely confused as to how that would be practically different from Shallam 1.0?

Aerek

I think it really depends on how long the refugees have to wait. If it comes about too quickly, then yeah, we might just get a re-run. The longer they have to wait, though, the more people who want a city will move on to other places, and leave the "devoted few" behind. Also, how they handle letting new "citizens" in if/when they ever do build up a new city is important. I hate to sound elitist, but they'll need to be picky about who they induct in the formative years, because precedent, once it's been set, is really hard to overcome in Achaea.

Obviously, though, the answer is to move to Meropis and re-found Seleucar.

Delphinus

@Blujixapug: http://www.achaea.com/chronological-order, ctrl+F "oversoul"

Veldrin

Aerek said:

I think it really depends on how long the refugees have to wait. If it comes about too quickly, then yeah, we might just get a re-run. The longer they have to wait, though, the more people who want a city will move on to other places, and leave the "devoted few" behind. Also, how they handle letting new "citizens" in if/when they ever do build up a new city is important. I hate to sound elitist, but they'll need to be picky about who they induct in the formative years, because precedent, once it's been set, is really hard to overcome in Achaea.

Obviously, though, the answer is to move to Meropis and re-found Seleucar.

Stop revealing our plans, bugger!  [-X

And gimme back my house denizens, kinda need em!

Sylvance

@Jonathin Might wanna recallibrate your mouse; you seem to be hitting the button to the left of the one you're aiming for in response to each of my posts.  Either that or you're trolling me, not sure which.

Eld

Sylvance said:

@Jonathin Might wanna recallibrate your mouse; you seem to be hitting the button to the left of the one you're aiming for in response to each of my posts.  Either that or you're trolling me, not sure which.

Or he just...doesn't agree?

Sylvance

Eld said:

Sylvance said:

@Jonathin Might wanna recallibrate your mouse; you seem to be hitting the button to the left of the one you're aiming for in response to each of my posts.  Either that or you're trolling me, not sure which.

Or he just...doesn't agree?

Which part of my '<double post>' post do you think he disagreed with..?

Jonathin

Disagreeing with the double post was an accident. Disagreeing with your opinion in general on this topic is legitimate. That being said, I'm done with the forums for a while because I'm just getting snippy and dumb.

Sylvance

I don't know how you accidentally do that, but thanks for having the maturity to unclick it. As a gesture of goodwill, I will 'Like' your previous post.

Eld

Sylvance said:

Eld said:

Sylvance said:

@Jonathin Might wanna recallibrate your mouse; you seem to be hitting the button to the left of the one you're aiming for in response to each of my posts.  Either that or you're trolling me, not sure which.

Or he just...doesn't agree?

Which part of my '<double post>' post do you think he disagreed with..?

Ah, I think he'd removed that disagree by the time I saw the post. Anyway, enough posts on that topic; sorry for my part in perpetuating it needlessly.

Wilhelmina

Aren't we ultimately just going to have a Good-Mhaldor? That sounds boring.

Mishgul

or are we going to have a good shallam for once.

Tvistor

Guys.

If you all apply for Mhaldor we can probably take Ashtan.

You know you want to be able to go up against them on an even footing just this once.

Sylvance

Wilhelmina said:

Aren't we ultimately just going to have a Good-Mhaldor? That sounds boring.

Where is this coming from? This goes back to my original point:  Nobody even knows for sure that there's going to be a new City.

Wilhelmina

I'd be surprised if there wasn't a new city, really.

Even if there isn't a new city, the Good faction isn't just going to vanish. Whether it's a city or a high clan, something will emerge and I imagine it will be more militant and less tolerant of alternate styles of play than Shallam.

Synbios

Tvistor said:

Guys.

If you all apply for Mhaldor we can probably take Ashtan.

You know you want to be able to go up against them on an even footing just this once.

Nonsense. You already have the ormyrr. Anyone else joining would be underqualified.

Arlanda

Tvistor said:

Guys.

If you all apply for Mhaldor we can probably take Ashtan.

You know you want to be able to go up against them on an even footing just this once.

Go post on public that applications are welcome. Though people would want to wait and see first, just in case Deucalion smashes Mhaldor

Siena

Asmodron said:

Silas said:

I would've liked a little time between Shallam going boom and the revival of Deucalion. Even just a few hours to allow for people to feel at least some doubt would have added a lot to the atmosphere of being a refugee an Orphan.

If we were all Shallamese orphans would that mean we get all the presents under the Logosmas tree???? :O

Ellodin

maybe the royal shallamese navy can go diving in the ruins

Blujixapug

Calling it now: Shallam settles Zanzibaar after the island's king finds enlightenment in the fire-bright purity of Deucalion. Templars breed horse-sized tigers and ride them into battle. Dawnstriders eschew serpenthood and adopt mongoose companions, training them specifically to kill death adders, rattlesnakes, cobras, and vipers. Crystalline Circle employs a complex new enchantment to bind turtle steeds with air elementals. Sentaari, on a mission to Judgment Mountain, rediscover the long-lost tiger stance. Empyreal Assembley get some bitchin' henna tats. Eradicating the eastern seas of pirates, and waging such fervent war on the barbaric tritons of the region that they are sued for armistice, this reborn city of the south-east seas now casts its mighty fleet westwards, flying flags of retribution as they sail upon Mhaldor.

It's the obvious next step. If this doesn't happen, I will upload footage of myself eating a hat to youtube, so literal is my incomprehension of how events could unfold in any other way.