A Brand New Ashtan

Reiloch

This means that we don't have to have pretensions about not being bad guys any more, right?

Good.

Ahmet

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

Atalkez

Ahmet said:

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

How is making Chaos a nearly-factionalized entity not interesting? 

It's one of the "Three" mythos and it never had a true "home". It does now.

I find the change extremely interesting, personally.

Titonus

Ahmet said:

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

This kind of opens their door to create their own interesting things. Chaos doesn't require an active divine to cause havok.  I think this is pretty cool, too, and I'm not even A-team.

Ayami

Ahmet said:

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

What does this even mean? I personally feel this is the most exciting thing that could ever have come out of Ashtan, and something I felt was just a silly dream since I made my Occultist. This is amazing for roleplay, the Chaos worshiping part of Ashtan has for as long as I've played there been indisputably the most interesting and deepest part of the city.

I feel like you're letting your IC feelings for Chaos kind of get in the way of  it, since I vaguely remember you being anti-Chaos, and that's kind of silly! Maybe I'm wrong, obviously, but I don't understand how you could find this not amazing otherwise.

Ahmet

Titonus said:

Ahmet said:

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

This kind of opens their door to create their own interesting things. Chaos doesn't require an active divine to cause havok.  I think this is pretty cool, too, and I'm not even A-team.

Suppose so, but Ahmet didn't come to Ashtan to support Chaos, he came because it was a city of freedom where you could pursue your own goals, not those of Chaos. Personal bias aside, it seems like a decent direction for the city, but I'm certainly not the only one unhappy with it. 

Skye

forum arrpee tiem,

As far as I'm concerned, even as far back as Bal'met (which actually wasn't that long ago), this state of affairs has been the reality of Ashtan for years now. The only difference between then and now is that it's now quite literally set in stone and there are no more illusions or leeway about it being anything but Chaosland. 

In any case the whole 'city of freedom' deal was a slick Erisian construct. Which basically still put Ashtan under Chaos' thumb anyway. 

Atalkez

Ahmet said:

Titonus said:

Ahmet said:

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

This kind of opens their door to create their own interesting things. Chaos doesn't require an active divine to cause havok.  I think this is pretty cool, too, and I'm not even A-team.

Suppose so, but Ahmet didn't come to Ashtan to support Chaos, he came because it was a city of freedom where you could pursue your own goals, not those of Chaos. Personal bias aside, it seems like a decent direction for the city, but I'm certainly not the only one unhappy with it. 

Honestly, that's fine. Cyrene sounds like a great place for you. As far as I know, they don't give a shit what you do as long as it doesn't reflect badly or cause repercussions to the city as a whole.

Apathy was such a huge issue in Ashtan. We have/had too many people that use the banner of the Bastion to get free place to AFK with nearly no fear of anything happening to them because of our military. The way it is (assuming here) going to be now, if you're not wanting to follow Chaos then you don't have to. You won't be allowed to shit all over Chaos and what we're trying to accomplish though. You'll get ousted and enemied for that. 

The city is moving in a unified direction, which is an immensely better situation that was it was previously. The entire concept of lolFreedom was just weird to me. Cyrene already offers you that by being neutral as long as you follow their (albeit long) list of rules.

Aodfionn

Thank the sweet baby jesus, this is awesome. Hopefully this will lead to fewer 'lol but freedom tho' conversations. 

Morro

I'm so giddy right now. I think my favorite denizen is dead, but I'm still so happy about all of this.

Ahmet

Morro said:

I'm so giddy right now. I think my favorite denizen is dead, but I'm still so happy about all of this.

Which denizen?

Sarapis

Ahmet said:

Titonus said:

Ahmet said:

I'm honestly disappointed that nothing more interesting than going full-out Chaos happened. 

Rip Ashtan, long live the Nihilist puppetshow.

This kind of opens their door to create their own interesting things. Chaos doesn't require an active divine to cause havok.  I think this is pretty cool, too, and I'm not even A-team.

Suppose so, but Ahmet didn't come to Ashtan to support Chaos, he came because it was a city of freedom where you could pursue your own goals, not those of Chaos. Personal bias aside, it seems like a decent direction for the city, but I'm certainly not the only one unhappy with it. 

What you describe isn't a direction for a city. It's just a bunch of people doing their own thing without any central purpose, in which case why be part of a factionalized city?

Trevize

Daeir said:

I think what he's getting at is Ashtan wasn't overtly factionalized a la every other city except Cyrene before this change.

Now it is, and he isn't particularly happy with it because the old niche of "hey do w/e you want" no longer exists for him, and it suited his character and playstyle plenty fine.

This tends to be what happens when you change things - some people like the changes, and some people don't. I don't understand this constant urge that people have to downplay or discredit other people's opinions just because they feel differently about how things have gone.

Morthif

This is a great change for everyone. No more 'but Freedom!" bs, and with Hashan embracing Darkness Cyrene's identity as Neutral gets even more legit.

Jonathin

Having spent a good amount of time in Ashtan, I can honestly say that the change in direction from on-high is quite refreshing. I was there championing the whole 'anti-Babel pro-Freedom' thing for a while because lolHashan and while it was fun fighting people like Imyrr and Amunet, it really did divide the city into two camps.

As terrifying as a unified Ashtan is in my head, I'm glad to see it moving forward away from the stagnancy it was often plagued with because of people like me.

Jinsun

I am more surprised at the people who are surprised by this change. I think for a long time we have struggled under an apathetic banner of "Do whatever we want." "Why?" "Because we can?" I do think that a lot of people do need to chill out, read the accords, and focus for a bit. This is still pretty new, and I am already fielding conversations about forced "destruction" and not being for it. It's still early to tell how dense the new theology will be, or even if required participation will be a thing. I do think it's the direction that will work best for us and will breed the most in-depth RP. For awhile, I thought it would be cool if the Nihilists fought those who wanted Ashtan to be free, but maybe we do not have to. Either way, I am excited. If anyone doesn't want to lose Ashtan, though. Give the new stuff a chance, talk to me in game, but please do not draw out how much you hate the new changes and expect Jinsun to coddle you into staying. If you really hate it just because you wanted a place to do wherever you want, go hang out in the Brass Lantern.

Kasya

New Ashtan came and rekt Targ and it was really fun once we actually started fighting. I'm pretty excited to see how this all plays out.

Jonathin

They can come to Hashan. I heard that I'm a riot. They can hang out with me and we can all bitch and moan about how Ashtan is a shadow of its former glory or something and crack jokes and drink rum while Targossas blows up random rooms and we roll the forums looking for Amranu rage posts.

Kayeil

I'm more curious to see what this means for the Orders whose Divine are citizens of Ashtan, and if any of those Divine will depart the city or not.

Kyrra

Given that Vastar aligned for Chaos (and made a public post about it no less) a while ago, I don't really see anything changing for his followers. The Tetrahedron and the tenets were discarded about a real life year ago, and whilst Freedom is a sort of Utopia that was strive for (our end game instead of Oblivion for the Nihilists), the teachings are focused on the Sky and Storm.

If anything, this is a really fantastic change because it forces people to actually get on board instead of sitting around and doing eff all, which has been the case now for an extremely long time. Vastar's teachings fit right alongside those of Chaos, and since the primarily aspect of his teachings is to be ambitious and to achieve your own goals and better yourself, there's no reason for Him to depart.

As a Farethi, I am so freaking excited that there's now a million reasons to be even more motivated than before. There's so much to do and so much to be a part of, and so much to look forward to. And all the people that have been dead weights and have contributed to the apathy, they're all going to end up leaving. It's fantastic for Ashtan.

Kind of wish that Vastar was active, but I don't see much changing at all.

Sybilla

I, too, am with the near-vomiting-with-excitement camp. There's no real need to rehash what others have said before me, I just want to gush about how I'm also so looking forward to being involved with what comes next, and I'm finally really really happy with the direction as it opens up soooo many avenues for things to get stuck into. 

What I would like to touch upon is the percentage of the population that now feels displaced. Without being disparaging, I-as-a-player can recognise that this is a game people play for fun, and I am (genuinely, unsarcastically) sorry if you are a player that is no longer able to have fun in Ashtan after the changes. It sucks, I wish you could see what the optimistic amongst us see, but I am not going to malign you (ooc) for not feeling it. If at all possible, it would be preferable to graciously stand aside and let the ones on board get to work with establishing a coherent, strong identity and improve the city, rather than keep detracting from it after the (unanimous!) decision.

Ultimately, the Renaissance sought to address just this problem of split camps within cities. It hurt the game to have cliques serving their own agendas and not the whole, and Houses were no longer working in unison for the direction of the city's mission, but instead doing their own thing. This all the more so in Ashtan! "Freedom" just isn't a direction; any ideology that requires the presence of something to rile against can't be strong and self-sufficient when it doesn't have its own foundation. Couple this with the fact that everyone interprets it as they want, to further serve their coterie's interests, it just makes for a whole mess of things.

This is a positive direction. For years the people who wanted to play chaotic could do so only at arm's length. Yes, they were tolerated, yes they had varying level of influence over time, sure they were still given plenty of attention/events/leeway etc. but ultimately they were made to feel as outsiders in their own home. Every time something goes down, (that I have read/seen in my experience), the Occultists had to churn out a PR campaign to get the city to support whatever, or at least stand down. How is that useful for inter-state relations? Your own home shouldn't have to be convinced that you are still part of them and work in their interest (whether that's been true or not over the years is another matter).

Look at it from our perspective - you may feel disillusioned now that there is no longer space for you, but it is only how we've felt when everyone else had a place to go and we did not. Even Mhaldor got rid of Occultism, so we didn't even have the evil-chaotic route available as backup anymore.

The Chaos faction finally has a home, it's a momentous occasion, and it's really good for Ashtan to finally factionalise and display a strong direction. I'm sorry, again, if you can't or won't be a part of it, but frankly, there are still plenty of other options for you whereas we finally got our only one legitimised at last.

Kinilan

The small faction that has been controlling Ashtan for real life years has managed to sieze complete  and open control? How sudden and unforeseeable.

Tahquil

      

Jinsun

Kinilan said:

The small faction that has been controlling Ashtan for real life years has managed to sieze complete  and open control? How sudden and unforeseeable.

Like that time we set up a court system staffed almost entirely with people affiliated with that faction....

Achimrst

Jinsun said:

Kinilan said:

The small faction that has been controlling Ashtan for real life years has managed to sieze complete  and open control? How sudden and unforeseeable.

Like that time we set up a court system staffed almost entirely with people affiliated with that faction....

@Jinsun like srsly though, we are just supposed to hug each other. Why do you have to be mean like that Jinsun.

Also, I remember that court! They braziered me and I got in trouble and stuff! Good times! :pleased: 

Jinsun

Achimrst said:

Jinsun said:

Kinilan said:

The small faction that has been controlling Ashtan for real life years has managed to sieze complete  and open control? How sudden and unforeseeable.

Like that time we set up a court system staffed almost entirely with people affiliated with that faction....

@Jinsun like srsly though, we are just supposed to hug each other. Why do you have to be mean like that Jinsun.

Also, I remember that court! They braziered me and I got in trouble and stuff! Good times! :pleased: 

This was a newer court. A moar different court

Achimrst

Jinsun said:

Achimrst said:

Jinsun said:

Kinilan said:

The small faction that has been controlling Ashtan for real life years has managed to sieze complete  and open control? How sudden and unforeseeable.

Like that time we set up a court system staffed almost entirely with people affiliated with that faction....

@Jinsun like srsly though, we are just supposed to hug each other. Why do you have to be mean like that Jinsun.

Also, I remember that court! They braziered me and I got in trouble and stuff! Good times! :pleased: 

This was a newer court. A moar different court

Is it a make friends and hug court? Because all cities need to be a make friends and hug court, unless you're Mhaldor I guess. Although these days I'm starting to wonder  

Exelethril

Congrats, Ashtan May your days be filled with tentacles and pretty women.

Elazar

Exelethril said:

Congrats, Ashtan May your days be filled with tentacles and pretty women.

Sounds like a porno

Antonius

@Elazar It's only a porno if the pretty women are filled with tentacles.

Atalkez

Maybe I'm old fashioned but pretty women and tentacles aren't synonymous.