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So I leave for a weekend concert series, and I can't be a priest in Cyrene anymore?
It's not an in-game mechanic for the players of the leaders of good to act irresponsibly and haphazardly. It's the immaturity of text-stardom that has perpetuated this advance of "Good's" radicalization.
From what I can tell, this has been going on for a few RL years. It will only result in the maximum marginalization of playing a character who is good or even sympathetic to good.
This is furthered by the players behind @Aurora and @Deucalion - what are you guys doing? It is almost as if you don't care if anyone wants to play on the side of Good. At this point, it is barely possible to play Good in a game heavily based on Good vs Evil vs Chaos. What. The. Hell.
Where is the substance? How does this promote RP of good? How does it improve the game to have such absurd restrictions? I don't want to play another alignment. Where is my place in this game?
Please don't even give me the argument "play good alignment from a different class." I already bought credits and class-specific artefacts. Yeah, I read the disclaimer about the class. I get it. But I don't get the total absence of recognition of the magnitude of this fact by the leaders of good, both divine and mortal. Sure, excommunicate me for killing priests or blessing occultists, but don't give me this crap for playing a priest in CYRENE.
While it will be stupid to play a character with 5 abilities, at least my character will be far more brave and realistic than any of yours.
From what I can tell, this has been going on for a few RL years. It will only result in the maximum marginalization of playing a character who is good or even sympathetic to good.
This is furthered by the players behind @Aurora and @Deucalion - what are you guys doing? It is almost as if you don't care if anyone wants to play on the side of Good. At this point, it is barely possible to play Good in a game heavily based on Good vs Evil vs Chaos. What. The. Hell.
Where is the substance? How does this promote RP of good? How does it improve the game to have such absurd restrictions? I don't want to play another alignment. Where is my place in this game?
Please don't even give me the argument "play good alignment from a different class." I already bought credits and class-specific artefacts. Yeah, I read the disclaimer about the class. I get it. But I don't get the total absence of recognition of the magnitude of this fact by the leaders of good, both divine and mortal. Sure, excommunicate me for killing priests or blessing occultists, but don't give me this crap for playing a priest in CYRENE.
While it will be stupid to play a character with 5 abilities, at least my character will be far more brave and realistic than any of yours.
15
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I'm sorry, but Cyrene flags itself neutral, period.
That's DIRECTLY from Cyrene's Ethos. Stop talking about things you know nothing about.
I'm not going to lie, I saw this coming way back when Cyrene gave millions of gold worth of commodities to Targ and the response was 'oh that's nice, screw off' (basically how I saw it, not saying that's what was said, but that's what it seemed like)
@Vastar call occultists back to Ashtan plz?
Let me make this WHOLE thread easy. The TL/DR
"If your politicians RP being stubborn and blameful, then the city itself has to deal with those RP choices."
Plain and simple. There's no argument about it. Be MAD, but aim that anger at those who caused it.
"You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else."
-Albert Einstein
From the sounds of it, a lot more people will be changing class instead of moving to Targossas. It'll certainly be interesting to watch as this continues to unfold.
- With sharp, crackling tones, Kyrra tells you, "The ladies must love you immensely."
- (Eleusian Ranger Techs): Savira says, "Most of the hard stuff seem to have this built in code like: If adventurer_hitting_me = "Sarathai" then send("terminate and selfdestruct")."
- Makarios says, "Serve well and perish."
- Xaden says, "Xaden confirmed scrub 2017."
Sounds healthy to me?
I really hope everyone runs with this and that both cities come out better for it.
Eta: phone typo
I understand you're upset by this turn of events, but this is something that apparently Cyrene wants. This isn't Verrucht or Aldair (or incidentally Aurora or Deucalion) telling everyone what's going to happen, this is entirely player driven. There are also entirely player driven ways to avoid this - running to the forums is an interesting strategy but the in-game referendum is probably a better idea. If you can't (or don't want to) turn it around, then you're correct, you can't be a Cyrenian Priest without facing excommunication. You can, however, join Targossas.
Honestly if you want to play the Good faction, that's what you should have done a long time ago. If you don't want to, then having half skills in another class would be far more beneficial to you than stubbornly clinging to Priest without devotion (or your angel, since you need devotion to summon your angel).
I'm sorry that you personally don't like it, but this is some great posturing by Cyrene. They're trying to stand up for themselves and not let themselves be bullied, in their perspective. In Targossas' perspective, we're following the Bloodsworn, who were insulted by Cyrene's new law forbidding Targossians from preaching in Cyrene. Cyrene has been given fantastic opportunities for character development, and especially their devotionists.
More of that please.
- With sharp, crackling tones, Kyrra tells you, "The ladies must love you immensely."
- (Eleusian Ranger Techs): Savira says, "Most of the hard stuff seem to have this built in code like: If adventurer_hitting_me = "Sarathai" then send("terminate and selfdestruct")."
- Makarios says, "Serve well and perish."
- Xaden says, "Xaden confirmed scrub 2017."
Sure, we don't like Evil, and we don't like Chaos, but doesn't add up to a "good" (or "Good") designation.
Conflation of good with Good was a huge problem in the game for well over a real-life decade. That single problem created more heartache and bad blood than probably any other in the game. Escaping that dynamic was a large part of why Shallam was destroyed and Targossas was founded with a much clearer version of Good. And it's true, "alignment"-based conflict is a huge part of the Achaean landscape, but that's exactly why Targossas being more hardline has been an improvement - it can finally be Good vs Evil vs Chaos. Previously, "Good" was a degenerate faction - one of the largest, but almost completely without direction and with constant insistence that no one had the right to determine what did and didn't constitute "Good". In terms of factional conflict, it was a disaster and almost everyone knew it.
It's worth pointing out here that this is a problem pretty much unique to the Good faction. Notice that no one is saying that even though the Evil faction is incredibly radicalised and has settled on a very, very specific and narrow notion of what constitutes Evil, pretty much no one goes around arguing that it's too radicalised and has too narrow a definition and is pushing too many people away with it. And while Evil factions get a handful of people who want to play psychopathic mass-murderers with no respect for what Evil means in Achaea, they're relatively few and no one ever really suggests that they have some inherent claim to determining what constitutes Evil in the game. The fact that the Good faction faces these issues is probably due to the fact that most people in real-life consider themselves "good", while very few think of themselves as "evil" and consequently want the game to recognise their conception of what it means to be "evil".
If you think that this radicalisation of Good is the result of "stardom" or "immaturity", you are severely lacking in perspective. The radicalisation is a direct result of the fact that, prior to radicalisation, things didn't work. To the extent that there were glimmers of hope for the faction prior to Targossas, they were almost exclusively from subsets of players who were themselves more radical.
You say that this hardline version of Good is going to alienate all of the players who want to play characters who are good or sympathetic to good as though that's a bad thing. That is very much the intention, and for good reason. Characters who are "lower-case good" or sympathetic to that kind of good are not a good fit for factional conflict. Being a generally moral, decent person doesn't really lend itself well to a call to war. A group of people whose primary simarity is that they all agree you shouldn't be a huge asshole doesn't make for a particularly interesting or engaging faction. Aurora and Deucalion are purposefully alienating those people because trying to combine people who were good with people who wanted the factional conflict that comes with being Good didn't work well and didn't make a lot of sense either, since there is already a city for people who want to be lower-case good: Cyrene (and arguably most of the others - most people in Ashtan, Hashan, and Eleusis are more or less lower-case good).
I do agree that you have something of a point with respect to priest becoming a faction-exclusive class. Given that you were warned about some of the RP-based restrictions on playing a priest, but weren't warned about this particular problem, I think you have a legitimate grievance here - which I think remains true even if you think priest being exclusive to Targossas is ultimately a good move for the game (which I think it is). I'm not sure what could really be done about it, but nevertheless I think you have a point that this is somewhat unfair to you.
But if you think the problem is the radicalisation itself that lead to this, you really need to take a step back and look at the bigger picture, or maybe go back and read some of the reams and reams of posts in the archive about all of the messy problems Shallam was contending with for years and years.
And if you think that changes like this shouldn't be made because it's "not an in-game mechanic", you are playing the wrong game. The fact that the game's landscape is dynamic and somewhat player-controlled is usually considered one of its primary draws. If player-directed factional RP developments like this couldn't happen and we simply relied on "in-game mechanics", I think an awful lot of people would be an awful lot interested in the game.
(i actually agree with the above point, not just on a Cyrenian level, but on a grander scale of what bashing even means in Achaea)
Playing this way will only earn good more losses than its desecrated history already has. How could it ever be surprising that 99% of Cyrenian Devotion-users have and will change class? We didn't choose to be Cyrenian for nothing. We don't want to play good your way.
To the argument that this game is player driven - yes it is, but not in all aspects. This is an issue of balance as important as balancing abilities in classes. Not to mention, there are so many aspects of this game that are protected against bad decisions of players. This, as an aspect of balance, is bad for the game. That's my argument.
I will agree, though, that as depressing as this is, it is a good opportunity for RP in Cyrene. It will inevitably lead to an even more boring atmosphere lacking vital interaction, but Aminah will remain. There is no other class and no other alignment that fits her story.
Anyone familiar with even the basic RP of being a devotionist in Cyrene would know that being a Cyrene devo user was a tenuous thing liable to be cut off at any time.
If you didn't want that 'risk', then you had literally years to not be a cyrenian devotionist.
That said, anyone half paying attention to international relations knew this was an inevitability, given trends in factionalization. And while I tend to agree that said trend is probably good for the game overall, sometimes it can feel very claustrophobic when the first choice you get in the game is which cities do you want to be banned in (or from talking to, if you're in Targossas).
-Join Targossas
-Pick a different class.
This was the intended functionality all along. Cyrene was never supposed to have devotionists, but it was a hold-over from the distant past.
The fact that these changes had to be made, instead of being right from the start is unfortunate, but it's better to move forward with things how they should be, despite the fallout.
Edit: Went back and read your OP. Nobody here was acting irresponsibly or haphazardly. This has been a change that's been on the backburner for years. Cyrene was going to have devo stripped. Period. This wasn't an impulse.
Cyrene was not confirming to the ways of "Good".
Have you considered that your definition of "Good" may differ greatly from what it actually is in Achaea? Perhaps you are letting your OOC thoughts on what "Good" should be colour your opinion on what "Good" actually is in Achaea?
It will be interesting to see where this leads.
Just like Hashan did, right?
I mean, they wouldn't leave a whole third of the playerbase out on something like that, right?
Right?