House Renaissance

Amarillys

Think of it less like a top down approach to change in an organisation, and more like the admins are giving select people capital to make a new organisations and working with them to ensure that said capital is not wasted. Not everyone is going to prove worthy of the investment, but you can't give everyone that capital, there just isn't enough to go around.

Achimrst

Amarillys said:

Think of it less like a top down approach to change in an organisation, and more like the admins are giving select people capital to make a new organisations and working with them to ensure that said capital is not wasted. Not everyone is going to prove worthy of the investment, but you can't give everyone that capital, there just isn't enough to go around.

I always thought this was exactly what the gods were for.

Amarillys

I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or not... Where's Fry when I need him.

Achimrst

I have to agree or disagree?

Amarillys

No, but your post is ambiguous enough that it seems like it is either agreeing with me or telling me I am entirely wrong. I don't get it!

Achimrst

Amarillys said:

No, but your post is ambiguous enough that it seems like it is either agreeing with me or telling me I am entirely wrong. I don't get it!

I don't agree or disagree, I have just always thought that the gods were the ones who sort of dictated or pushed RP in a certain direction through their actions. Such as, Eris and Babel. They have completely different approaches to chaos and Babel pretty much wiped out most things about Eris and make chaos his own. I know the revolutionaries were a big part of it I think but that's sort of what I mean. So I'm neither disagreeing or agreeing I'm just stating that I have always thought that the gods were the ones who directed RP in their "Realms" that's all.

Jacen

Asmodron said:

Sarapis said:

Bluef said:

People who are leading Houses now are only one small iota of the playerbase -- and  I can't grasp why their input is more important than anyone else's. Achaea, to me, is still operating in silos (Leaders, ACC, etc. - basically insular units) when collaboration and teamwork could and should be encouraged. Just my two cents.

Collaboration with players is exactly what is slowing the Renaissance process down so much, as the more people that are involved in a decision-making process, the slower it goes. We could have simply dictated and gotten this done much more quickly. Adding more players to the mix would compound the problem. We involve the leaders because you, the collective playerbase, have elected them as your representatives in matters relating to Houses and Cities, which is what the Renaissance is about. 

Problems agreeing on the new floating crystal city concept of Hashan?

Its funny (and satisfying) that absolutely none of the delays thus far have been because of Hashan.

Jovolo

That's exactly what a dark walker would say.

Melodie

Jovolo said:

That's exactly what a dark walker would say.

Ohhh, are we playing this game again? It's been a good handful of years.

Time to start picking out darkwalker talk randomly among the forums!

Malorn

Please, it's going to be floating crystal underground city Hashan.

can't forget the bit about the cavern it gets to float in.

Arador

Malorn said:

Please, it's going to be floating crystal underground city Hashan.

can't forget the bit about the cavern it gets to float in.

Then fill up the hole...... 

Sarapis

Amarillys said:

Think of it less like a top down approach to change in an organisation, and more like the admins are giving select people capital to make a new organisations and working with them to ensure that said capital is not wasted. Not everyone is going to prove worthy of the investment, but you can't give everyone that capital, there just isn't enough to go around.

It's more that the more people involved in a conversation, the less efficient it is, pretty much universally. There's nothing to be gained by involving all or even a substantial chunk of our players in planning discussions unless what we really want is for everything to take 10x as long. I can't think of a single successful company or organization in existence that targets consumers and that does that. Heck, most of the Garden isn't even involved in most of the Renaissance discussions for that reason. Big groups when planning anything = terrible.

Synbios

@Sarapis: I suspect the adage 'Too many cooks spoil the Renaissance' would be a fitting encapsulation of your statement?

Sarapis

Pretty much, yeah.

Asmodron

hmm, my original comment about crystal floating Hashan was deleted...

The darkwalkers are real.

Synbios

Sarapis said:

Pretty much, yeah.

@Sarapis: YOU OFFSPRING OF AN OUTER BEING, I WANTED TO POST THAT!

Addama

BUT THEY FILL OUR HEARTS WITH SO MUCH, SO MUCH LOVE.

Rangor

Well. You got few cooks that you didn't pick. Best hope their dish is to your liking.

Herenicus

Rangor said:

Well. You got few cooks that you didn't pick. Best hope their dish is to your liking.

Asmodron

Herenicus said:

Rangor said:

Well. You got few cooks that you didn't pick. Best hope their dish is to your liking.

Is it just me or is she attacking the child at the end...

Bade

just wondering, so is Mhaldor completely done and you're working on Elusieus now, or are finishing touched being made with Mhaldor?

Jukilian

I would think that the players (for the most part) are heading things there now, with some admin assistance when necessary.

Discussions with Eleusis will likely have already started or will be soon, I would wager.

Tael

I got the impression that discussions were already started with every city.

I've been looking and I can't find exactly where the idea that this was all happening one at a time came from, even though I keep seeing it brought up.

Achimrst

Tael said:

I got the impression that discussions were already started with every city.

I've been looking and I can't find exactly where the idea that this was all happening one at a time came from, even though I keep seeing it brought up.

The thread has in it an order that was release by....@Tecton I think it was having Eleusis next and then Hashan and Ashtan. I think that's where the "happening one at a time" thing comes from.

Bade

Achimrst said:

Tael said:

I got the impression that discussions were already started with every city.

I've been looking and I can't find exactly where the idea that this was all happening one at a time came from, even though I keep seeing it brought up.

The thread has in it an order that was release by....@Tecton I think it was having Eleusis next and then Hashan and Ashtan. I think that's where the "happening one at a time" thing comes from.

Yeah that's where I got the idea, didn't realize that was release order.

Melodie

It should be noted that Mhaldor had started talks and there was a brief break for some reason. Then talks started with Eleusis. These talks got put on hold when Mhaldor was ready to keep moving forward, and as far as I understand it (this is in no way official, just my understanding), our houses are mostly complete, at least on the Tecton/Sarapis admin angle (there's still plenty to be done in general).

So Eleusis should be resuming their talks once more. I assume this is where the frustration is at.

Asmodron

Im going to go on a wild guess here and foresee that eleusis' setup will become:

Tenders: These individuals have the growth of nature first and foremost as their mission in life, and seek to make sure its bountiful gifts continue to flourish. Building a deep bond with the forests, they listen to the voice of the forests' spirit and seek to fulfill its wishes.

Sentinels: Brave individuals that watch the forests from the treetops and defend it with their lives against invaders and corrupt necromancers.

Prythe

Asmodron said:

Im going to go on a wild guess here and foresee that eleusis' setup will become:

Tenders: These individuals have the growth of nature first and foremost as their mission in life, and seek to make sure its bountiful gifts continue to flourish. Building a deep bond with the forests, they listen to the voice of the forests' spirit and seek to fulfill its wishes.

Sentinels: Brave individuals that watch the forests from the treetops and defend it with their lives against invaders and corrupt necromancers.

That might not be horrible, although you would have to have t third group who studies and records the histories / events. This would create scholars who study the issues of any given day, with a wealth of information to review in order to make informed decisions and/or just learn for the sake of learning.

As for what might be slowing down Eleusis, talk to any two Forestals and get three opinions.  One of the nicest things about Forestals is that the RP has always had a wide range of belief as to what is "Service to Nature" (and sometimes even "What is Nature?" itself).

It is part of what makes it fun - and also infuriating when a wave of "This is the only way" marches in. I've seen "this is the only way" at least half a dozen times over the past decade, and of course, those "this is the only way" of X year is totally the opposite of Y year and several other bits of inconsistency which tend to drive far too many good people away.  

There is a reason Sentinels, and then Sylvans, broke from Druids, and why so many have left all three.

Druids remains the "purest" of the bunch, and I will be sad when that which makes Druids special is gone.

But all that said....

There is an underlying lack of respect for what has been in the hurry to shape that which is to come.

When the oldest voices are called traitor, cast out, or removed from positions of influence.... 

Well, who could really be surprised when there is resistance to "Can't we all just get along? [or else you're the next to go]" - when one voice thinks they know more than three others combined?

It wouldn't hurt for the Garden to get feet on the ground and talk with the people who never have anything to say (which does not include me, obviously) and present clear choices and ask for real input - not of the "push poll" variety, but the real deal.

Not just the people *in* the Village, but those in the Houses / Classes which will be affected by whatever the end result looks like.

Deborah
for herself
not for Prythe
Prythe is busy

Arador

You missed the forestall orgy house. Or is that included in the "Building a deep bond" part? 

Arador

Also, based on those descriptions, are they going to be "The Gardeners" and "The Scarecrows"? Cause that would be awesome.