House Renaissance

Kresslack

The question I have is...

Khaibit

So far the change in Cyrene's houses doesn't give me much faith in the change of the rest of the city houses. Talking to cyrenians, more people seem unhappy than pleased with the changes, it seems like it was rushed a little too much. No one knew what was happening with the House halls (I assume someone knows, but not the general populace) no one knew what was happening to the House stuff like shops, ships, master crystals etc. 

It just seems like a poorly executed rush because of the possibility in the future of multiclass, rather than for any reason that will help the game, the players or the general sense of RP. 

Anyway...lets see what happens to the next poor bastards I suppose. 

Melodie

Well, I imagine the shops will revert back to the city, and the city (knowing Cyrene) will return one each to the Houses, and take the fourth to do... something with. Perhaps rent it out, Cyrene's fond of that.

The Master Crystal, along with the milking room and other such things, will be moved into a location (I believe where the Kindred area is) where all Cyrenians will be able to reach it, and it will become a sort of central "resources" place.

As for the rest of the estates, I imagine they'll either get repurposed or simply added to the city in some way. Cyrene has some fairly creative minds, I expect there's some neat plans along that vein.

While I agree it may seem (and probably is in some manner) rushed, I highly doubt that means Cyrene won't be looked after. I am a bit concerned about leadership for everything, but I suspect there is no set leaders in place, and rather people will earn it via virtue of hard work (at least, that's how I would do it). I think any naysayers just haven't been giving it enough chance, yet. I do agree with some of the complaints that the actual roleplay of it could have been much better, but at the same time, with so many cities and Houses waiting, I am uncertain if it would have been much better. But that point I'll leave alone, as I do agree in general there was room for improvement.

tl;dr, give it time, things are getting figured out, have a little faith, lets see what happens moving forward.

Jamethiel

@Melodie The master crystal and such are only for those in Cyrenian Houses. NOT for all Cyrenians...there's a subtle difference.

Jamethiel

Oh and:  ...

Jukilian

PUBLIC NEWS #19492                                      (06/19/2014 at 09:00)
....
that were announced in the latest announce post
....

Iocun

Nim said:

Iocun said:

Nothing changed, except that the house commands no longer work

Technically, house commands exist ICly. If nothing else, house channels are very real things, but I'd personally believe even things like HWHO are very real telepathic networks that house members can tap into for information. House scrolls as well.

Not saying that house commands have no IC relevance, but it is questionable whether they're the actual core of what makes up a house.

Nim

I'd say they're the only things making it a house versus some other type of organization. In other words you could argue that the Mojushai still functionally exist, but not that they're still a house. Given that houses have a shaky definition beyond that, though, I'm not sure it matters much.

I'd keep roleplaying as Mojushai if adequate reason to stop doing so doesn't seem to exist. Then again I'm one of those crazy hardcore roleplayers.

Silas

Somebody c/p the three Cyrene House help files?

Nellaundra

Let's hope the forums don't argue.

The Vashnarian Shield

                       [HOUSE LEADERSHIP]

          Leader of the Shield: (nobody)

                        Patron: (empty)

             Head of Newcomers: (nobody)

                    [CURRENTLY IN THE REALM]

                Newcomer aides: (nobody)

                Able to induct: (nobody)

Charged with the safety and preservation of Cyrene, the Vashnarian Shield is a

fellowship of warriors who, like the stalwart mountains that surround Cyrene,

are unwavering in their dedication and unyielding in their defense of the city.

Foremost in the mind of a member is ever the security of the city and those who

are sheltered by her walls. They are bound by duty to defend against any threat

to Cyrene, and are often the first to rush to the aid of their fellow citizens

at the first sign of danger.

To ensure their readiness to meet this charge, members of the Shield

continually push themselves to improve their skills in combat, working both in

and out of the arena to test their mettle. Additionally, they take upon

themselves the responsibility of ensuring all Cyrenians are capable of rallying

to the city's defense. By training their peers in combat and furthering their

martial education, they raise the city as a whole to a higher level of

preparedness against those who would threaten their way of life.

                       [HOUSE LEADERSHIP]

        Leader of the Virtuosi: (nobody)

                        Patron: (empty)

             Head of Newcomers: (nobody)

                    [CURRENTLY IN THE REALM]

                Newcomer aides: (nobody)

                Able to induct: (nobody)

Creativity reigns in the House of the Virtuosi; they welcome all who endeavour

to bring artistry and elegance to their chosen professions. An assembly of

sophisticates dedicated to creative expression, the Virtuosi continually

endeavour to improve and advance the culture of Cyrene. Something is always in

progress within the house, from masterful works of art and grand performances

to skilled crafts that transcend mere function.

The Virtuosi place high value on innovation and originality, believing them to

be the basis for growth and greatness. Through mentorship, collaborative

productions, and individual tutelage, they guide their members' talents and

prepare them for the next step in becoming true masters. Their training extends

beyond the House itself, as well: many a Cyrenian, and even some non-citizens,

have spent time studying with the Virtuosi.

The Discurean Outriders

                       [HOUSE LEADERSHIP]

Leader of the Discurean Outrid: (nobody)

                        Patron: (empty)

             Head of Newcomers: (nobody)

                    [CURRENTLY IN THE REALM]

                Newcomer aides: (nobody)

                Able to induct: (nobody)

The city of Cyrene has long since grown beyond its isolationist foundations,

and since its rediscovery has faced an increasing obligation to embrace her

position on the world stage. Rising in response to this need is the House of

the Discurean Outriders: worldly travellers, historians, and pursuers of

knowledge.

Educated and adventuresome, each Outrider is both an academic and an explorer,

seeking answers to the questions of life from the abstract to the concrete.

Many are widely travelled and strive to understand the different cultures of

the world, and they are welcomed by many distant communities as traders of both

goods and knowledge. They are inquisitive and well-read, looking critically at

the past and applying its lessons to all aspects of life.

Formatting fucked up a bit, but meh, it's passable.

Jurixe

The concept of those three Houses seem to go well with Cyrene, although the concept of Outriders from a city historically isolationist is somewhat paradoxical; then again, cities and ideologies evolve and change over time just like any other. I have no idea how they were implemented so won't comment on that, but the Houses themselves seem cool.

Vayne

Iocun said:

Nim said:

Iocun said:

Nothing changed, except that the house commands no longer work

Technically, house commands exist ICly. If nothing else, house channels are very real things, but I'd personally believe even things like HWHO are very real telepathic networks that house members can tap into for information. House scrolls as well.

Not saying that house commands have no IC relevance, but it is questionable whether they're the actual core of what makes up a house.

http://wiki.achaea.com/Oversoul

Sunny

Yeah a simple "We deem the current estates unfit because of this prophetic scroll we found and there for disbanded everyone. We have created three new houses to replace them though." Wouldn't have killed anyone ic to do..oh well. Also really messed up that everything seems to be for those who join a house only..seriously though what if we don't fit into any of the houses? So much hope flushed down the drain because they told everyone we needed change and then they shove the same messed up leadership into founders positions of the new houses...so much for change.

Kerria

While it sounds contrary, The Outriders is a great idea that fits Cyrene perfectly. Yes they tend to lean toward isolationism, but there has always been overwhelming curiosity for the world around them and the knowledge brought into the city from that which surrounds them.

Iocun

Sunny said:

Yeah a simple "We deem the current estates unfit because of this prophetic scroll we found and there for disbanded everyone. We have created three new houses to replace them though." 

Well, I'm quite glad that they didn't make it appear as if the gods created the new houses, but at least gave the impression that this was done out of an adventurer incentive, to at least retain some semblance of self-determination.

I also would have severely disliked any use of "we" in the explanation. The Garden is no unified entity IC. They pretty much never work together on a common goal (fighting Bal'met is probably the closest we got, and even then not all worked together). Tecton has no fleshed-out IC persona to begin with, Maya is gone, Sarapis is busy tending the flame, and the other gods follow their own, individual agendas. Any mention of "the Garden" bringing forth some change thus automatically reeks of a veiled OOC explanation. Someone even just saying "the Garden" without referring to the physical Garden of the Gods already rings my alarm bells.

I like @Vayne's mention of the Oversoul. I think stressing the fact of houses sharing an actual spiritual core and basing the Renaissance around a disruption of said cores would have been a sensible way to approach the issue. That's pretty much the RP I'm leaning towards at the moment as well: knowing that the members, the ideals, the estate are still there, but having an inexplicable feeling of a lost link between the members. While that doesn't explain why it happened, at least it can act as an explanation of what happened. I just wish the admins had actually considered this and based the house dissolution on raising awareness of a concept like this, while coming up with some backstory of what might cause a dissolution of metaphysical connections like that. They can still do that retrospectively, of course, but the longer they wait, the longer dodgy semi-OOC explanations will keep permeating IC conversations.

Achimrst

Asmodron

Nim said:

Iocun said:

Nothing changed, except that the house commands no longer work

Technically, house commands exist ICly. If nothing else, house channels are very real things, but I'd personally believe even things like HWHO are very real telepathic networks that house members can tap into for information. House scrolls as well.

And then you wake up to find your telepathic connection to everyone else snipped. Cyrene's sudden reaction upon waking up and finding it gone:

Tecton

Khaibit said:

So far the change in Cyrene's houses doesn't give me much faith in the change of the rest of the city houses. Talking to cyrenians, more people seem unhappy than pleased with the changes, it seems like it was rushed a little too much. No one knew what was happening with the House halls (I assume someone knows, but not the general populace) no one knew what was happening to the House stuff like shops, ships, master crystals etc. 

It just seems like a poorly executed rush because of the possibility in the future of multiclass, rather than for any reason that will help the game, the players or the general sense of RP. 

Anyway...lets see what happens to the next poor bastards I suppose. 

House halls and old house resources were covered at the Cyrene meeting last night, perhaps ask the Imperiate!

Khairt

Achimrst

Khairt said:

Mizik

Iocun said:

Still not much of an IC explanation though...

Not even to mention that only those few who were present when it happened got this. For the others it was just... login - hwho - "You have no house."

IC, Iocun still doesn't even have a good reason to believe that the house no longer exists. The estate is still there, the people are still there. Nothing changed, except that the house commands no longer work and that there were some weird prophecies and symbolical smoke in the air. But no person, no power actually dissolved the house in any form that could be observed and understood.

Melodie

Khairt said:

SHUT UP I CAN CARE AS HARD AS I WANT AND YOU CAN'T STOP MEEEEEE.

@Jamethiel, subtle difference noted. Also very much agreed with @Kenia, it at least was something I tried to promote often as a previous citizen. Outriders make me very happy overall, I can't wait to see what they do.

Sena

Iocun said:

I like @Vayne's mention of the Oversoul. I think stressing the fact of houses sharing an actual spiritual core and basing the Renaissance around a disruption of said cores would have been a sensible way to approach the issue. That's pretty much the RP I'm leaning towards at the moment as well: knowing that the members, the ideals, the estate are still there, but having an inexplicable feeling of a lost link between the members. While that doesn't explain why it happened, at least it can act as an explanation of what happened. I just wish the admins had actually considered this and based the house dissolution on raising awareness of a concept like this, while coming up with some backstory of what might cause a dissolution of metaphysical connections like that. They can still do that retrospectively, of course, but the longer they wait, the longer dodgy semi-OOC explanations will keep permeating IC conversations.

This also has the advantage of being able to work for every city, so there's no need to have five unique events.

Silas

I find it a little disappointing that there's not much of a deeper ideal explored in the House helps than combat and exploration. The arts is a fine base for a House, and they'll presumably pick up where Ty Beirdd left off; but I would've liked to see Cyrene given an agenda if they now have an outside focus. Why not base the combat House around earth magic and runes and whatnot, and let them propagate something to the masses?

Also, do they allow Devotionists?

Tecton

Silas said:

I would've liked to see Cyrene given an agenda if they now have an outside focus. 

What's to say they don't? You'll have to wait and see!

Aerek

We have an outside focus? I don't think "Outriders" is meant to be taken literally. They may travel to explore and collect knowledge, but that doesn't mean that we're suddenly less isolationist. (If a Swiss archaeologist travels to Giza, that doesn't make Switzerland less neutral) Personally, I'm glad that the Houses were kept general at their inception, which allows the players to form their own deeper ideals, rather than be spoonfed what we're supposed to be roleplaying for the next age. If the Shield (which will be a majority of ex-Wardens, I'm sure) wanted to add some earth magic flavor to themselves, the door is open to that. I'm sure the Garden isn't going to come down and say "No, no, be less creative."

Devo classes are welcome in all the Houses to my knowledge. That ball's kinda in your court.

Vayne

i·so·la·tion·ism

[ahy-suh-ley-shuh-niz-uhm, is-uh-] Show IPA

noun

the policy or doctrine of isolating one's country from the affairs of other nations by declining to enter into alliances, foreign economic commitments, international agreements, etc., seeking to devote the entire efforts of one's country to its own advancement and remain at peace by avoiding foreign entanglements and responsibilities.

They way terms like "neutral" and "isolationism" are incessantly misused and misapplied in this game is a pet peeve of mine.

Iocun

Sena said:

Iocun said:

I like @Vayne's mention of the Oversoul. I think stressing the fact of houses sharing an actual spiritual core and basing the Renaissance around a disruption of said cores would have been a sensible way to approach the issue. That's pretty much the RP I'm leaning towards at the moment as well: knowing that the members, the ideals, the estate are still there, but having an inexplicable feeling of a lost link between the members. While that doesn't explain why it happened, at least it can act as an explanation of what happened. I just wish the admins had actually considered this and based the house dissolution on raising awareness of a concept like this, while coming up with some backstory of what might cause a dissolution of metaphysical connections like that. They can still do that retrospectively, of course, but the longer they wait, the longer dodgy semi-OOC explanations will keep permeating IC conversations.

This also has the advantage of being able to work for every city, so there's no need to have five unique events.

Yeah, one might well construct some kind of explanation of those Oversouls being driven by a certain spiritual resource which is now running out, causing one house to collapse after another, yet some new form of coherence is discovered, which is under control of the cities of Sapience, but still rather limited, so each city can only afford to sustain three new houses without exhausting themselves. And somehow Targossas realized this before all the other cities and started their houses in that new form already.

Might still seem a little bit contrived, but it would work reasonably well to explain why this is something that happens to all the former houses of Sapience, why there still will be new houses, but why the old houses still can't just be recreated in the same number and fashion. And no player/god would have to take blame for anything like that.

Scarlatti

I think it is natural Cyrene's Houses have started off without huge specificity. They are based on a vague prophecy, and the city doesn't have a Theological top-down power giving Divine commandments. We talk about the game being shaped by players, and what better opportunity than this?

Looking forward to seeing what Cyrene does.

Asmodron

Cyrene should transform into a hoarding safe where they send their outriders into the land to grab random items from people's homes and cities before rushing back to place it in their isolationist society.