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Comments
1. You find a lode, let's say it's a medium rawstone lode.
2. This is your first time mining, you know nothing. So you go ahead and put a medium mine on it, max miners.
3. Take note of the date you started the mine. Take not of MINES GOLD DRAINS.
4. Wait.
5. Take note of the date the mine collapsed. Count how many hours it took from start to finish, multiply that by the MINES GOLD DRAINS. Add in the gold cost of the iron and stone you spent on it, and the cost to deploy miners in the first place. Congratulations, you have the overall cost now.
6. Count how many raw stones you got. Divide it with the cost to get your cost per commodity.
7. Do not sell it for less than that cost per.
Ta da! Eventually you will get a feel for what size of mine goes best for what size of lode, etc. The only guessing you really need to do is "Hmm, how many comms are in this lode?" as that's a random number within a range, given a lode size.
Try to be a little more understanding that there are a lot of people that play Achaea, and maybe not everyone is as good at statistics as others.
And I don't think it's so much an addiction @Greys as the fact that the admin added honors lines, and many people like to go after those (and some houses Consortium use mining as advancement options).
As a long time player, I am unhappy with the design philosophy that I've been seeing on Achaea in the last year or so. It is not my intention to derail the subject of this thread by opening up conversations on other topics, so the examples of my dissatisfaction will be necessarily brief.
I understand the need to tweak the economy, particularly in the face of the recent credit market hike. However it seems to me that the activities players most enjoy, that bind us into the game, have been quietly and progressively made less and less rewarding and more and more bothersome.
The gold cap on bashing is one example. More recently, the removal of same-harbour gold ship trades. This has tacked on about 5-6 hours of back n forth sailing to an already tedious and risky task. I haven't had a reason to participate in seafaring for months, other than seamonstering (which I'm dead sick of). It even seems like gold rewards for old quests have been significantly reduced. My gem of cloaking has been made worthless. Now the activity of mining is on the economic chopping block, and it was already a major gold sink for most players.
I don't know how you intend this new system to work or what you are building towards. All I can see from the document is 20,000 gold per real life day just to participate in a resource system that was already costing an arm and a leg to participate in, to say nothing of the risk of losing ones army due to invasion. It also makes the investment of my home much less valuable as I can no longer use it for storage, which was frankly 90% of the reason why I had it.
I feel like alterations to the game are happening on every front in terms of how much time I as a player have to invest in order to see any kind of payoff for my work, or to maintain what I have already earned, with what I have earned becoming less valuable with each new change. More to the point, I'm experiencing little to no sense of payoff for my time and I'm not having fun.
This post is not meant to bash your new system. I simply wish to point out that this direction of reductionism is killing the game for me personally, and I find I have less motivation to log on because core activities like bashing, seafaring and mining, are becoming unrewarding and prohibitively time consuming. I'm not willing to spend massive sums of gold (play time) just to maintain ships and commodities that I'm not actively using. If all this game can offer me is an endless grind to reach a goal post that is being moved ever further away, then you are going to lose me as a player and as a potential customer.
With that being said, I sincerely hope the new warfare system you are designing is a success and I am very much looking forward to seeing what you come up with.
As with many other aspects of the game, if you want to be top-tier (or even mid-tier), you have to do the leg-work. If you want to make a profit from mining, you have to do the boring parts, eg how long a lode will take to mine out, the average number of comms, so you can know which lodes will generate a profit. It's not fair to expect those people who have invested their own time into working these things out just give them away for nothing. People will give advice here and there, but no-one is going to just hand over their work so you can become a direct, more effective, competitor.
I'm interested to see what happens with this additional cost for storage, as it doesn't just affect miners, but also harvesters, gatherers and extractors. I have a lot of minerals stored in a house because even with max rift expansion, I still need to keep stockpiles for when people want to buy in bulk. It takes too long, even under the new system, to gather 2500 - 5000 of a mineral to sell.
Cascades of quicksilver light streak across the firmament as the celestial voice of Ourania intones, "Oh Jarrod..."
Additionally, some things that were historically gold sinks have been removed. Blacksmiths used to constantly forge with commshop bought comms. With the smithing rework there is much less reason to constantly forge because 1) Artefact weapons are always better than forged and 2) getting legendary blacksmith is the only reason to forge more than what you need and it is a one time thing. The comms you use are also now produced at around the same price by mines, but the percentage of gold that leaves the economy has gone down.
The admins are trying to tune this by the look of the changes. They put a gold cap on to reduce the incoming gold, they made this change to increase the amount of gold siphoned by mining (as well as to reduce server load). Yes it will feel bad when your cash cow is slaughtered but it is bad for the economy to have that much gold sitting around. Currently if you aren't one of the rich as god people IG you are completely priced out of many of the one time only things because some people have tens (or hundreds) of millions of gold sitting around to waste on anything that comes up. Even buying credits to sell for gold doesn't mitigate this much because for stuff like auctions if you don't win you are stuck with gold you can't do anything with and for the other things it is relatively hard to get the gold fast enough to buy it before someone who didn't have to convert it buys it out.
The gold cap is 170k a day or something, a War Galley costs around 15m to commission and kit out and that is the biggest gold sink in the game. In 3 months you can get there if you gold cap every day. Then you are done, you don't need to cap gold anymore because what are you going to spend it on? Yes it might be unreasonable to expect one person to cap every day, but there are many people bashing and getting that gold and you can't tell me there is a new galley every month. The money gets transferred to people through sales of herbs or clothes or enchantments or whatever and the materials from those also appear out of nothing. So gold pools and pools and when something new and fun comes in it is priced so high to try to get some of that gold out that people who haven't been accumulating gold get shafted.
I don't know what the answer is, but I can identify the problem when it has been pointed out many times over the years. Yes earning less gold for the same work sucks, but we have been earning far too much gold for a long time.
A lot of comms are a negative when it's all said and done.
(Price of mine comms) +( gold upkeep)
(Price of coal mine) + (upkeep for coal mine)
Is the real cost of the comm
Let's just say the average price of an iron ore *just to use this one for example* to mine out is around 28gold per ironore... and that is a GENEROUS mining per comm value... it is not selling for even what 20 per on the market as it is.
We call these troop leveling mines... you take them just to level squads knowing your taking a gold loss...... that's why those small irons are always open and being passed up and that new announce is thankfully going to let them fade. On the flip side, other comms are well worth the effort in mining and make it all the rage.... as how it SHOULD be...... by no means am I complaining about drop or spawn rates... if anything it would be nice to see more use of comms, besides housing and city improvements. Even though every city following mhaldors suit and getting an orb did boost the market some.
Anyways not even sure where I started with this post... early morning rant I just started cause I saw @Melodie tag me in... but your doing a great job team! @BehindTheSceenCrew just... hurry!!!! My old heart can only hold so much anticipation and excitement
1. Help Smith's out, make armour and weapons decay faster or need reforging(wear and tear) to get Smith's busy again. This will cause more people to want that trade skill as well.
2. Have cities have a comm cost to rebuild city rooms when destroyed
Just a quick few ideas to get them in use a bit more.
Again I am all for this system, trade ministries use a lot of gold and need some way to make money so I'm all for this leasing system... but the people using the leasing system need some sort of incentive as well... already hard enough to keep people mining, 9 out of 10 miners now only mine cause 1 person is paying them so they can stockpile more than there two mines can get alone.
Most people do share the information you asked for Nataliia. Mhaldor, for example, has a mining clan and that information regarding cost/profit is posted there. No way in hell I'd share that with other factions though - that is terrible RP and poor business.
And you won't understand the cause of your grief...
...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.
Only thing this slows down is people hoarding comms, which is what is rising the market now to begin with... so @Shirszae let's hope your worries are wrong... only time will tell
* keep speculating that this is for some reason dramatically change despite people being now disincentivized to do so and now pay a gold upkeep for the speculation
* cash out