Quick Combat Questions

Atalkez

Kenway said:

Is there anything outside of my target being off of salve balance or a long balance that is enabling me to get 5 twist impales? I am getting them somewhat consistently and I have a feeling it's either latency or an svof bug on their end but just wanted to make sure I'm not missing something obvious as I tend to do (like discern being usable off balance #lifechanger)

Imp > twistx5 or imp > twistx4 > imp > twistx1 ?

Kenway

Atalkez said:

Kenway said:

Is there anything outside of my target being off of salve balance or a long balance that is enabling me to get 5 twist impales? I am getting them somewhat consistently and I have a feeling it's either latency or an svof bug on their end but just wanted to make sure I'm not missing something obvious as I tend to do (like discern being usable off balance #lifechanger)

Imp > twistx5 or imp > twistx4 > imp > twistx1 ?

Dunn

That seems odd off a double leg... hm. 

Atalkez

It shouldn't be five off a single impale unless they're slow writhing or the bug is back.

Austere

Atalkez said:

It shouldn't be five off a single impale unless they're slow writhing or the bug is back.

Impale might just be bugged in general.  I missed two dsbs on Jadys last night due to her writhe speed. Everything queued, both legs broke into impale- dwc.

Dunn

@Makarios we may be dealing with the impale bug again 

Antonius

Seemed fine when I was screwing around with BM earlier. I don't know if @Xaden uses server-side or svof's client-side curing though.

Atalkez

For BM vs proper curing it should always be:

Impale>twist x4 on a double break. If you push salve balance or use ice to drop tree, you get time for another impale and twist combo, and assuming they didn't tumble or go off balance they will writhe after the twist. Should never get more than 5 twists in a single setup unless they made a mistake.

Xaden

Antonius said:

Seemed fine when I was screwing around with BM earlier. I don't know if @Xaden uses server-side or svof's client-side curing though.

I use a mix. Can't remember off-hand which side handles impale though.

Omor

Pretty sure you've got ss handling impale, looking at logs and whatnot.

Dochitha

Most DWCs seem to be using Scimitars, are the axes good stuffs too? Not sure how it plays into DWC's strategy...

Dunn

Meh. Not super worth it, IMO. You could use axes for burst damage but you sacrifice affliction speed for that. 

Kogan

Dunn said:

Meh. Not super worth it, IMO. You could use axes for burst damage but you sacrifice affliction speed for that. 

Concuss is 1.7s balance. Undercut is also .2s faster than dsl balance. So if they're off tree balance could concuss then impale for single leg break disembowels.

Edit: I did mean prep with scims for the record. I don't think axes are the way to go for the whole fight.

Anedhel

Nairat being guaranteed if prone makes it a decent option. Break both legs with scimitars and switch to nairat axes to break the arms and you can get 2-3 axe dsls in before they can shield, since they have to cure freezing and one arm to do that. If you get lucky with shivers, they can end up in a fair bit of trouble. This won't work on high resistance targets though, sadly, unless your axes are good or your strength is nuts.

Nazihk

Axes aren't a reliable kill method because they can be blocked by the SoA. All it takes is a proc or two and your momentum is shot.

Dochitha

Nazihk said:

Axes aren't a reliable kill method because they can be blocked by the SoA. All it takes is a proc or two and your momentum is shot.

Scimitars can't be blocked by SoA whole access are blocked? That sounds like a bug to me.

Kenway

Dochitha said:

Nazihk said:

Axes aren't a reliable kill method because they can be blocked by the SoA. All it takes is a proc or two and your momentum is shot.

Scimitars can't be blocked by SoA whole access are blocked? That sounds like a bug to me.

He just means you get more hits with scims so if SoA blocks a hit or two you don't lose out on as much as you would if it blocked axes.

Anedhel

Hmm. SoA makes it a nuisance, yes. Now that armour can carry it, I suppose it's hard to see, too. Bummer. 

Dunn

I would rather just keep hammering away with scimitars/sensitivity. 

Kogan

Dunn said:

I would rather just keep hammering away with scimitars/sensitivity. 

I agree, but I think there may be some merit to hiding impale behind concuss (blackout) for single leg setups. Just haven't played with it much. If anyone does and gets some logs I'd love to see. If not Ill see what I can do with it across the next week to see how viable it is. Concuss blackout is 8.5s which is plenty of time if you can get their tree out of the equation. I know the line where you impale is hidden by blackout and I'm fairly certain the line where you body shudders on the end of the weapon is as well? Though I don't believe you'd get that until after blackout ends anyways. So you have until they try to stand before they even start writhing. 

Dochitha

Kogan said:

Dunn said:

I would rather just keep hammering away with scimitars/sensitivity. 

I agree, but I think there may be some merit to hiding impale behind concuss (blackout) for single leg setups. Just haven't played with it much. If anyone does and gets some logs I'd love to see. If not Ill see what I can do with it across the next week to see how viable it is. Concuss blackout is 8.5s which is plenty of time if you can get their tree out of the equation. I know the line where you impale is hidden by blackout and I'm fairly certain the line where you body shudders on the end of the weapon is as well? Though I don't believe you'd get that until after blackout ends anyways. So you have until they try to stand before they even start writhing. 

Not to mention Axes break extremely quick.

Kogan

Dochitha said:

Kogan said:

Dunn said:

I would rather just keep hammering away with scimitars/sensitivity. 

I agree, but I think there may be some merit to hiding impale behind concuss (blackout) for single leg setups. Just haven't played with it much. If anyone does and gets some logs I'd love to see. If not Ill see what I can do with it across the next week to see how viable it is. Concuss blackout is 8.5s which is plenty of time if you can get their tree out of the equation. I know the line where you impale is hidden by blackout and I'm fairly certain the line where you body shudders on the end of the weapon is as well? Though I don't believe you'd get that until after blackout ends anyways. So you have until they try to stand before they even start writhing. 

Not to mention Axes break extremely quick.

With longer balance the time to break probably works out about the same. Not sure since you don't see anyone running around with a level 3 axe really. You could do some slick stuff where you afflict with scims and swap to axes when paralysis or illness is guaranteed to bypass parry. That would most likely be the go to way if you wanted to use axes to prep but would require a bit of time to get setup on the tracking. 

Dochitha

Kogan said:

Dochitha said:

Kogan said:

Dunn said:

I would rather just keep hammering away with scimitars/sensitivity. 

I agree, but I think there may be some merit to hiding impale behind concuss (blackout) for single leg setups. Just haven't played with it much. If anyone does and gets some logs I'd love to see. If not Ill see what I can do with it across the next week to see how viable it is. Concuss blackout is 8.5s which is plenty of time if you can get their tree out of the equation. I know the line where you impale is hidden by blackout and I'm fairly certain the line where you body shudders on the end of the weapon is as well? Though I don't believe you'd get that until after blackout ends anyways. So you have until they try to stand before they even start writhing. 

Not to mention Axes break extremely quick.

With longer balance the time to break probably works out about the same. Not sure since you don't see anyone running around with a level 3 axe really. You could do some slick stuff where you afflict with scims and swap to axes when paralysis or illness is guaranteed to bypass parry. That would most likely be the go to way if you wanted to use axes to prep but would require a bit of time to get setup on the tracking. 

can't figure out if it's efficient, cos axe too slow they may cure illness... so it takes more time to stick illness with scims to get axes to limb hit again...

Kogan

Dochitha said:

Kogan said:

Dochitha said:

Kogan said:

Dunn said:

I would rather just keep hammering away with scimitars/sensitivity. 

I agree, but I think there may be some merit to hiding impale behind concuss (blackout) for single leg setups. Just haven't played with it much. If anyone does and gets some logs I'd love to see. If not Ill see what I can do with it across the next week to see how viable it is. Concuss blackout is 8.5s which is plenty of time if you can get their tree out of the equation. I know the line where you impale is hidden by blackout and I'm fairly certain the line where you body shudders on the end of the weapon is as well? Though I don't believe you'd get that until after blackout ends anyways. So you have until they try to stand before they even start writhing. 

Not to mention Axes break extremely quick.

With longer balance the time to break probably works out about the same. Not sure since you don't see anyone running around with a level 3 axe really. You could do some slick stuff where you afflict with scims and swap to axes when paralysis or illness is guaranteed to bypass parry. That would most likely be the go to way if you wanted to use axes to prep but would require a bit of time to get setup on the tracking. 

can't figure out if it's efficient, cos axe too slow they may cure illness... so it takes more time to stick illness with scims to get axes to limb hit again...

Yeah, you're losing quite a bit of time this way. I'd have to sit down and chart it out. I think if anything Ill be looking at forged axes for concuss but thats likely it for me. Not sure how much faster level 3 axes are for dsl but I imagine not enough to matter.

Gero

Just curious if metawake would have saved me here or not, what else did I miss?

If I cured properly, there any counter play options as a DW?
https://ada-young.appspot.com/pastebin/ZgVkhg0e

Taryius

That.. Doesn't look right. To be able to play pipes/command golem in retardation.

Other than that... Cube sigils? Beckon out of retardation.. Just don't fight in retardation if she comes in to embed retardation you can usually get the first blow, something like paralysis or sleep and build up afflictions from that..

I thought they stopped being able to queue up multiple commands in retardation like whisper wyvern/play pipes/golem thingy attack..

Edit: Oh yeah, and pray that you don't get a crappy amnesia proc from the pets :P

Ryzeth

Shouldn't be able to play pipes like that and command golem in the same prompt, no. That was, indeed, meant to be fixed, and should definitely be BUGged.

Atalkez

If you already have the alias defined serverside, all you're sending is queue add equal X. So unless you need to change that (which takes the retardation knock), you can just queue it like normal.

Beyond that, metawake would have helped a lot, though she can strip that and put it on a cooldown. Tumble more, prioritize insomnia

Gero

Thanks for the tips everyone, I can see that I also did this:

Imbuing your voice with power, you intone, 'Morudai'
Which set the location instead of escaping, but that just slowed my escape.

But, if I did managed to tumble out and escape, if said person constantly went back into Ret and I have to fight through it is there anything I can do? My offense requires stacked affliction pressure, so would need to hit quite a few times to get anywhere. I cannot see a way around this at all.

Aegoth

the bug with command stacking in ret is knownnto @Makarios, and he's stated it's a problem that he has to dig -really- deep into the code for.

as for pipes/golem, that isnt a bug: pipes are balance, and golem can be used offbal since its eq. Thats not to say it shouldn't change bc lolol, but its not mechanically a bug afaik with golem mechanics