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Curing

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  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,154 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Cool 
  • StrataStrata United States of DerpMember Posts: 1,753 @ - Epic Achaean
    Any class that relied heavily on illusions is now soon to be truly cookie-cutter. I kind of feel like I should just trade in all my stuff and go monk or runie now. And just mash 1 key until opponent is dead. Yaaaaaay fun.
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    CooperJovoloAustereBluefIsaiahWessuxSeftin
  • NimNim Member Posts: 2,015 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Iocun: Hopefully, other avenues for creativity in combat will open up as a result of this one closing, then!

    One can hope and dream, anyway!
  • KafzielKafziel Member Posts: 658 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    How do you get guaranteed sensi bites with no illusions and randomised dcurse??
  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,154 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Didn't know dcurse was changed to be randomised, wha? #nodragon4life

    Well naturally that makes it harder.
    Bluef
  • AntoniusAntonius Member Posts: 4,737 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Dragoncurse isn't randomised if you specify a delayed affliction. Not sure what @Kafziel is talking about, maybe he'll explain.
  • DunnDunn The great Buffalo tundraMember, Secret Squirrel Posts: 6,062 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    ...randomized?

    dragoncurse Exelethril sensitivity 3 will give you sensi if you're undeaf after 3 seconds. Not random.


  • DunnDunn The great Buffalo tundraMember, Secret Squirrel Posts: 6,062 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Brought up the biting through sileris for all but camus when this was being tested. A chemical compound in the berry coating nullifies the camus venom. Ez.


  • IocunIocun Member Posts: 3,506 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Strata said:
    Any class that relied heavily on illusions is now soon to be truly cookie-cutter. I kind of feel like I should just trade in all my stuff and go monk or runie now. And just mash 1 key until opponent is dead. Yaaaaaay fun.
    Well, "cookie-cutter" is an exaggeration. Apostates, for instance, aren't exactly "mash 1 key until opponent is dead". But it's certainly a loss in versatility and makes some classes less exciting.

    Nim said:
    @Iocun: Hopefully, other avenues for creativity in combat will open up as a result of this one closing, then! One can hope and dream, anyway!
    Perhaps, but in the end all kinds of abilities that are very open and allow for much creativity are potentially troublesome when it comes to new game developments that serve to make it more accessible and convenient. It lies in the nature of open-ended abilities that they are used in ways the coders didn't anticipate, which makes them hard to balance, potentially griefy, and potentially buggy. It is thus not surprising that the more "developed" a game becomes, the more the various abilities become constrained and clear-cut.
    KeiDartega
  • KafzielKafziel Member Posts: 658 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    About a month ago I noticed gare and curse were randomised about half a second. Either I'm bugged or its changed. Not at home so can't test but curse paralysis 4/shatter a few times and see if they still hit on/near the same prompt. A little while ago it changed from always on the dot to +/- half a sec or so for me
  • DunnDunn The great Buffalo tundraMember, Secret Squirrel Posts: 6,062 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited April 2014
    I noticed the gare randomisation, but not the dcurse one. Will have to test.

    I know @Makarios worked on some backend changes with delayed skills like that. Any word, Mak?


  • StrataStrata United States of DerpMember Posts: 1,753 @ - Epic Achaean
    Terra said:
    Strata said:
    Kafziel said:
    How do you get guaranteed sensi bites with no illusions and randomised dcurse??
    How do you benefit from faster bite speeds if you can't illusion/flay sileris to keep it down longer than 2-3 bites?

    Flay illusion is a pretty good example of an important illusion that worked pretty well pretty often. Hopefully there'll be other changes to make bites easier to use (see: biting through sileris with everything but camus!) to make up for that.

    That illusion is an example of one that has and will very likely always work regardless of how advanced client side curing becomes. With server side curing, that illusion no longer works because the server knows if you truly have
    the defence up or not. I use this illusion in every fight to keep sileris down as much as possible. Not so I can get more bites - but most often so I can get bites in at crucial times without having to waste time flaying sileris.

    There are other examples of illusions that present unique challenges for client side curing simply because the systems can't easily test if they're real or not. I really think the garden listened to the "find a system breaking illusion, abuse it, it gets patched, find another system breaking illusion..." crowd too much. @Iocun has never been of that mindset and I can probably say I haven't been of that mindset since overcoming the first few months of learning serpent.
    It's about creativity, as he said. If anything, "nerfing" illusions takes away one of the most interesting things about combat and was easily over 1/2 of the reason I went with serpent. Hopefully the classleads to come will provide an adequate replacement for this huge loss.

    The future of Achaea everyone:
    "I am a serpent. I can BITE."
    "I am a monk. I can BREAK BACK."
    "I am a priest. I can SMITE."
    "I am a runie. I can RAZE SLASH."

    That wasn't meant to rhyme... But this is our future, ladies and gentlement! Say goodbye to complexity and uniqueness. The only thing that will differ is the lines you see on your screen.
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    SybellCooperAlexandreBluefAradorWessuxSaibel
  • DunnDunn The great Buffalo tundraMember, Secret Squirrel Posts: 6,062 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Oh, stop. The cynical drama show predicting a stormy future of Achaea doesn't help anyone. You haven't even test anything.


    AlexandreTrillianaVithincusArador
  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,154 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Lmao what an exaggeration.
    AlexandreArador
  • StrataStrata United States of DerpMember Posts: 1,753 @ - Epic Achaean
    Dunn said:
    Oh, stop. The cynical drama show predicting a stormy future of Achaea doesn't help anyone. You haven't even test anything.
    I only did it because I love how much you like the poetry from the Cyrene babies on public news boards :P
    image
    CorrUtianima
  • NimNim Member Posts: 2,015 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited April 2014
    Strata said:

    Dunn said:

    Oh, stop. The cynical drama show predicting a stormy future of Achaea doesn't help anyone. You haven't even test anything.

    I only did it because I love how much you like the poetry from the Cyrene babies on public news boards :P
    I'm the only Cyrenian who posted poetry in public, yo.
    TrillianaUtianima
  • StrataStrata United States of DerpMember Posts: 1,753 @ - Epic Achaean
    Jovolo said:
    Lmao what an exaggeration.
    You haven't noticed I'm one of those doomsday prophets yet?! Sheesh Jovolo. Pay attention.
    image
  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,154 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Strata, Devourer of Light (male Atavian).

    :O Darkwalker!
    StrataAlcinae
  • SybellSybell Member Posts: 6
    Strata said:
    That wasn't meant to rhyme... But this is our future, ladies and gentlement! Say goodbye to complexity and uniqueness. The only thing that will differ is the lines you see on your screen.
    While I am no way close to being a combatant in Achaea, I could draw from my experience in Imperian. Yes, server-side curing did close up certain avenues of combat (illusions, aeon/retardation), but combat was revamped (is being revamped) and new ways were presented, which filled up the 'loss' of the complexity provided by illusions/aeon/retardation.

    I'm excited to see what the Achaea team has planned for the future of combat.
    Alexandre
  • StrataStrata United States of DerpMember Posts: 1,753 @ - Epic Achaean
    I just hope it's done right is all. One of the biggest things that makes Achaea so unique (and I know many of you non-artied peasants will disagree with this) is that it is one of the very few games out there where the majority of your success in the game comes from your ability to be diplomatic and work with others to solve complex problems in many aspects - and as far as combat goes, your skill and ingenuity as a player. When the in-game abilities move further toward the clear-cut I think it becomes less about player skill and more about character abilities and artefacts.
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    RipBluef
  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited April 2014
    The amount that I hate this change will depend on the quality of the curing itself, although when I read this, my instinct was to wish that I could unspend every minute and dollar I've put into Achaea.

    The reason for this is because I have long noticed a trend from IRE of dumbing the game down, not just for newbies, but for everyone. This change, regardless of the quality of the curing system or how much it is used, shows that IRE wants to be less like a fine restaurant, and more like a McDonald's. Not because McDonald's is better, simply because it is more profitable.

    One of my favorite parts about Achaea is that each of the classes has a level of difficulty, some being far easier than others (sylvan, monk). Other classes require an artists touch, serpent being the epitome of this. You literally have to spend years learning every possible detail about not just combat, but curing systems, AIs, and combat psychology, to ever hope to beat an above-average curing system. I saw a huge chunk of this go away this morning as I read Tecton's post, and I saw the trend of turning Achaea into pre-processed twice frozen beef-flavored meat cookies take a big leap forward.

    I get what @Iocun is saying, and I agree to an extent, but I have to say, if I wanted to play WoW, I'd at WoW. Please stop trying to make Achaea into it. I love Achaea because it is complex, and takes years to become a good player. Stop taking away the one thing I love most about the game: its complexity.

    "Our lives are not our own. We are bound to others, past and present. And by each crime and every kindness, we birth our future."


          Manda  |  Godzilla  |  SLC
        Rip
      1. NimNim Member Posts: 2,015 @@ - Legendary Achaean
        Why do people keep saying WoW is dumbed down? There's a ridiculous amount of theorycraft that goes into WoW - most people just don't have to do it because it's already been done (much like most people don't have to program their own system because SVO exists).
        KuyShirszaeUtianimaDaeir
      2. AlexandreAlexandre Raleigh, North CarolinaMember Posts: 89 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished

        This is a great change not only for the current playerbase of Achaea, but also for the new players that join in the future. As far as restricting PK less... Not so sure about that.

      3. EdorenEdoren Member Posts: 21 ✭✭ - Stalwart
        I think this is going to be a great change for newer players. I've always felt it was a little ridiculous to expect people to know how to code to survive in combat right from the beginning. Vadimus/etc are probably the only reason anyone who didn't know how to code complex curing systems stuck around. With integrating this, it makes it so that people are better able to handle themselves and less prone to worry about being combat proficient.
        Jhaeli
      This discussion has been closed.