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Fixing Player Housing

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  • ReysonReyson Posts: 502Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Sure, but your OCD drove you to pay for the upgrades and thus literally opt in to getting trackable rooms, yes? 
  • TreyTrey Posts: 4,629Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Skye said:
    Reyson said:

    In terms of role-playing, you can call any room an outdoor room without adding outdoors to it.
    My OCD will not allow me to create a room that claims to be outdoors when the room title clearly states '(indoors)'. :(

    I only walk around the gardens to harvest tho, so whatevers I guess.
    One word solutions - Greenhouse. Solarium.

    (depending on your aesthetic desires, this may not suit your needs, but it's a potential wavehand fix while waiting to see what else we can come up with!)

    Gawi
  • KyrraKyrra Sanctum of the SkyPosts: 4,626Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I have an atrium :)
    (D.M.A.): Cooper says, "Kyrra is either the most innocent person in the world, or the girl who uses the most innuendo seemingly unintentionally but really on purpose."

  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaPosts: 4,788Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    While that wouldn't work for a courtyard, I do like the idea in general I admit.
    "You have had an extraordinary adventure, my dear. Extraordinary! One that few people could ever imagine. Treasure it. Keep it safe and secure, tucked away in some special place in your heart. 

    But... don't spend the rest of your days chasing a ghost."
  • AtalkezAtalkez Posts: 4,691Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I find it highly amusing people are complaining about the cost of the housing upgrades. Unless you want a sprawling mansion to display wealth, a two room house with no prism upgrade is roughly the cost of a new windcutter is it not?. Throw a door between the rooms, drop a flamed eye and a monolith, boom impenetrable room. Don’t give anyone perms to the door but you.

    Its already been stated by several people that the whole sigil upkeep is a bit silly, and that area is room for improvement to not hurt people that go dormant. It’s also been largely agreed upon to have better containers to store things in. 

    Ya’ll got way off topic which most of this stuff was hashed out and discussed on page 1-3.

    Please stop reaching for any excuse to keep things the same. The cost is not a true barrier unless you want it to be. You saved up ~2 million gold for that strider or whatever it costs, but don’t want to buy a no prism upgrade? That’s an absolute joke. While ships exist in their current state, no it’s rather dumb to buy it instead of a ship. When that is no longer the case, I don’t believe cost is a real issue.


    You hug Aurora compassionately.
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaPosts: 4,788Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited January 26
    Try a thirty-one room manor (with plans still to build on) in OoS (which doubles the building cost).

    :)
    "You have had an extraordinary adventure, my dear. Extraordinary! One that few people could ever imagine. Treasure it. Keep it safe and secure, tucked away in some special place in your heart. 

    But... don't spend the rest of your days chasing a ghost."
    LennShimi
  • AtalkezAtalkez Posts: 4,691Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Well yeah the second part is an issue, agreed.

    The first part is you being extra though :sunglasses:


    You hug Aurora compassionately.
    Lenn
  • MinifieMinifie Posts: 1,902Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I have a house. It's a cardboard box I carry with me. People prism the other direction when I roll into the burbs :sunglasses:


    (Mhaldor's Next Top Model): Taryius says, "Oops, thats not a foray. Thats two novices going at it in the wilderness."
    Gawi
  • CailinCailin Posts: 186Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Minifie said:

    *lockable containers in furnishing for owners
    *display ability for people to display stuff safely without paying for non decay and resetting
    *OoS houses having access to greater security

    These things seem to be commonly agreed as good changes, can we focus on potentially more things to help housing?
    *No-track upgrade 
    *Permanent eye sigil upgrade, or delete souls through doors
    *HOUSE RETURN
    *Org-owned housing
  • ReysonReyson Posts: 502Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    All rooms are already indoors, though. Unless you want a room you can't fly out of, but not into, in which case I vehemently disagree.
  • JurixeJurixe Where you least expect itPosts: 1,640Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Reyson said:
    All rooms are already indoors, though. Unless you want a room you can't fly out of, but not into, in which case I vehemently disagree.
    I want to add that there is a significant benefit to getting a room made outdoors. You get ambient and weather messages, which is important to me in creating a sense of realism. I don't see why outdoor rooms can't have a non travel upgrade - why offer the upgrade if it's a security risk and no one will use it? Unlike prism, track is instant. There's no way to stop it.
    If you like my stories, you can find them here:
    Stories by Jurixe and Stories by Jurixe 2 

    MelodieShimi
  • KietKiet Posts: 2,830Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Can we add no telepathy to no prism tho.
  • AlrenaAlrena Posts: 637Member @ - Epic Achaean
    Kiet said:
    Can we add no telepathy to no prism tho.
    Or privacy upgrade, if it doesn't do that already. It's a really expensive upgrade and it should stop mind sapience at the least!
    image
    JurixeReysonShimi
  • ReysonReyson Posts: 502Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Jurixe said:
    Reyson said:
    All rooms are already indoors, though. Unless you want a room you can't fly out of, but not into, in which case I vehemently disagree.
    I want to add that there is a significant benefit to getting a room made outdoors. You get ambient and weather messages, which is important to me in creating a sense of realism. I don't see why outdoor rooms can't have a non travel upgrade - why offer the upgrade if it's a security risk and no one will use it? Unlike prism, track is instant. There's no way to stop it.
    Hmm. Fair enough, I suppose. I don't really like all benefit and no risk solutions, but if there's a legit reason to have it one way but not the other, I guess I don't have a good argument why that's a bad thing.
  • TorinnTorinn Posts: 914Member ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    What about locked chests that serpents can unlock in five minutes of working at it?  Gives the home owner plenty of time to get backup to oust the cretin, it makes things not 100% safe, and will notify the owner and/or people in the room with ambient messages so people know something is going on.  Five minutes of sitting there is a pretty large deterrent to basically anybody (just see how many wormholes are sitting about)
    Deucalion says, "Torinn is quite nice."
    Cailin
  • KietKiet Posts: 2,830Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Alrena said:
    Kiet said:
    Can we add no telepathy to no prism tho.
    Or privacy upgrade, if it doesn't do that already. It's a really expensive upgrade and it should stop mind sapience at the least!
    I'd be equally annoyed by some jackass trying to radiance or blackout or w/e but I guess no veil makes that harder.
  • MindshellMindshell Posts: 247Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Privacy upgrade does prevent mind sapience from generating any output. You can be sapienced, it just doesn't show your commands.
    KietMelodieRomAlrena
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaPosts: 4,788Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited January 26
    It takes 160 room credits to build a privacy upgrade for a single room in OOS, which translates to 32,000 wood (which has gotten harder to get ahold of now) and 16,000 stone.

    At the lowest of wood prices and around 90 gold per stone (I'm trying to be generous and use low prices), you're looking to spend around 25 million gold, or 250 credits, per room of privacy. That's generally at the very lowest. Same goes for stables, and a few other room upgrades.

    :unamused:

    Edit: I have been sitting on this particular grievance for a long while.

    Idea #   : 169
    Filed by : Melodie.
    Filed on : 2015/01/28 08:36:51
    Approved : NO
    Idea text:
    For out of subdivision homes, remove the double cost of upgrades, while retaining the double cost of building rooms. Building an out of subdivision house is already extremely prohibitive, but to make upgrades cost twice as much (so 400 credits for no-prism instead of 200), on top of paying so much extra for the land itself, seems excessive. This at least keeps it an expensive venue without making it outrageous.
    "You have had an extraordinary adventure, my dear. Extraordinary! One that few people could ever imagine. Treasure it. Keep it safe and secure, tucked away in some special place in your heart. 

    But... don't spend the rest of your days chasing a ghost."
    LennGawiShimi
  • KietKiet Posts: 2,830Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    those prices are a bit absurd...
  • AtalkezAtalkez Posts: 4,691Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Gross.    


    You hug Aurora compassionately.
  • JurixeJurixe Where you least expect itPosts: 1,640Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Yeah I don't envy those of you who have made OOS dwellings your home - cool thematically, but right now, double the risk and cost for very little reward. It's still worth it for me right now because my OOS housing is all public facilities, so I don't worry about privacy too much, but nearly every room of my in-city house is no prism because I want people to feel safe enough to use it.

    Wood being generated more would be great, or maybe all the prices just lowered to the same. 
    If you like my stories, you can find them here:
    Stories by Jurixe and Stories by Jurixe 2 

  • CailinCailin Posts: 186Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Question #1: What about upgrades having a high cost initially, but after say, the first 10 rooms, it's free or at least much lower? That way it doesn't cost an insane amount to no-prism an entire mansion.

    Question #2: I don't understand beds. Suppose Ana and Elsa, after the extreme awkwardness of that visit from Hans, still want to sip tea together, but decide they really have to have some privacy. They agree to stockpile their resources and invest in this but, uh... they don't want to get in bed together. That would be really weird. 

    Beds already exist as a place where people can go, so why do they have to be beds? Why couldn't they be a house upgrade, costing the same amount? Or just change their name to Secret Room, but really Ana and Elsa would prefer to sip tea in their cozy living room and not have to go to  a different room. Perhaps no-prism + privacy does = about the same thing as beds, but I'm really fuzzy about the specific details, so clarification would be nice.
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaPosts: 4,788Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    1) I don't see spending 2,500 credits/gold worth of stuff to reach that point being very reasonable.

    2) Beds are actually another single-room "plane" (so similar to say, Annwyn), and you cannot see them on qw, or anything like that. Even the new veil can't farsee into a bed. 
    "You have had an extraordinary adventure, my dear. Extraordinary! One that few people could ever imagine. Treasure it. Keep it safe and secure, tucked away in some special place in your heart. 

    But... don't spend the rest of your days chasing a ghost."
    Lenn
  • LennLenn Posts: 123Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    edited January 26
    Minor correction: 2.5 million gold not 25 million. Credit amount was correct, just neglected a decimal point. :)
  • SkyeSkye The Duchess BellaterePosts: 2,723Member, Seafaring Liason @@ - Legendary Achaean
    The gold isn't even the biggest problem tbh. A lot of people are more than happy to fork out the gold or burn credits for gold, but we're also bottlenecked by the wood production that is tediously slow to generate.

    And yes, I don't like the current bed option partly because it's tied to a bed which is just plain awkward. The upgrade should be based on the function, not the item. Since the bed upgrade essentially adds a room exit to "ENTER BED", you should be given an option of other things to enter like office, or atelier, or workshop.


    CailinLennShimi
  • KoganKogan Posts: 401Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    edited January 26
    Torinn said:
    What about locked chests that serpents can unlock in five minutes of working at it?  Gives the home owner plenty of time to get backup to oust the cretin, it makes things not 100% safe, and will notify the owner and/or people in the room with ambient messages so people know something is going on.  Five minutes of sitting there is a pretty large deterrent to basically anybody (just see how many wormholes are sitting about)
    noty. Gotta be all or nothing on this one. I dont care to play minigames with serpents who for the most part don't try to be interesting at all. Most of the people I see talk about wanting their conflict try to rob our novices and run the very moment I even show up and do the hi emote. Much less attack them. That's what is hilarious about most of this.


    Edit: Then they run back to their house/ship/city or phase afterwards just to come to this thread later and post saying how I shouldn't be able to do the same if I need to let my dog out outside and step away for 30 seconds just so they can use something that cost them a few inks to take things that cost others years to collect. Lol.

    Aegoth said:
    You have about as much "right" to say no as aggressors have a right to bust your shit in at their whim and fancy. There are no "rights" here. You can do your best to -avoid- conflict, before/during/after it starts, but to say that you have a "right" to that, and to assume you need to be consenting, is laughable at best


    Going back a bit, but in terms of "busting someone's shit" at your whim and fancy help pk says otherwise. Hard concept for some of those on the isle at times I know. I suppose it will remain laughable as long as we continue only enforcing rules that only involve gold or credits though. 
    Zbaco
  • TorinnTorinn Posts: 914Member ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited January 26
    The chest thing is a compromise.  If they flee then good.  Look at how they got in there in the first place and fix it.  But at least it gives you the chance to retaliate and makes it risky for the infiltrator.  If you need to go afk for any extended period of time you really should qq or journal.  I learned that the first week of playing.  You aren't rping when you're afk, you're not doing anything.  There is no benefit to staying logged in people can send you messages if they really need.
    Deucalion says, "Torinn is quite nice."
    Cailin
  • KeorinKeorin Posts: 526Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    I just don't understand what the supposed value to house prisming is. It's completely one-sided, relying on catching a person AFK, without good code, and without the credits for noprism. It's banal and unpleasant for the recipient, while being only fun for the person who gets to interrupt, steal or whatever. It essentially never produces interesting interaction, and instead interrupts what may well have been a fun moment before the prismer unilaterally decides to interrupt.

    This whole thing reminds me of the theft debate, where the people who use the mechanic to the detriment of other players are the ones defending it, trying to spin it as punishing people who haven't paid for/coded appropriate countermeasures (because the average player should have to shell out or code just to have a private spot to roleplay with someone).

    And personally, I think beds/noprism push things too far in the opposite direction, in general, bringing us back to nearly impenetrable defenses. Beds are almost as secure as ships for hiding from repercussions in, and a noprism room with a monolith is safe from everything but a few area attacks. It should not be as easy to hide out from consequences as it is to have a bit of uninterrupted roleplay. 
    TorinnZbaco
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