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PvE Adjustments

AesgarAesgar
edited April 2016 in North of Thera

ANNOUNCE NEWS #4538                                     (04/07/2016 at 16:39)  

From   : Tecton the Terraformer

To     : Everyone

Subject: Hunting/PVE balancing changes.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our next round of Hunting/PVE balancing has just been loaded up! As you can recall, we recently 

brought a lot of the denizen attacks in-line with each other, this was a great first step, but did 

cause some disparity, as it lead to situations where classes with high damage mitigation and health 

recovery were at a massive advantage.


With this latest change, we've gone through and applied a modifier to the normalised damage based 

off how resilient the class is. We chose this method to provide variety in hunting, and not 

homogenising everything to a bland state. This way, we'll have classes that are fragile, but can put 

out high damage, tanky classes that put out lower damage, and classes that sit at different points 

in-between.


Keep in mind that these values are determined from attacks from denizens, and only affect damage 

done to denizens.


Here's brief summary of the changes to the various classes:


Alchemist    -   No change

Apostate     -   Damage decrease (Small)

Bard         -   Damage increase (Medium)

Blademaster  -   Damage increase (Large)

Druid        -   Damage decrease (Tiny)

Dragon       -   Damage increase (Small)

Infernal     -   Damage decrease (Large)

Jester       -   Damage increase (Medium)

Magi         -   Damage increase (Small)

Monk         -   Damage increase (Large)

Occultist    -   Damage decrease (Tiny)

Paladin      -   Damage decrease (Large)

Priest       -   Damage decrease (Large)

Runewarden   -   Damage decrease (Large)

Sentinel     -   Damage decrease (Small)

Serpent      -   Damage increase (Medium)

Shaman       -   Damage increase (Large)

Sylvan       -   Damage decrease (Large)


* Note: Weaponmastery classes (Infernal, Paladin, and Runewarden) have varying modifiers for Sword 

and Shield specialisation and all others.


There it is. How are you finding the changes so far?
«134567…10

Comments

  • FrederichFrederich
    Monk seems to have gotten about a.. 10% increase?  Maybe 12.5%  It seems pretty decent right now and i'm, at the least, liking it.
  • AesgarAesgar
    @Tecton

    Main reason I started this thread is I wanted to ask you about xp/hr. How does it compare now to before battlerage's implementation?
  • SzanthaxSzanthax San Diego
    Hmmm wonder if it was I'm place when I did my hunting this morning.



  • TaelTael
    Bard was already one of the best, knights got nerfed, and it got an increase. So bard is the best now then?
    My Nexus Scripts
  • AesgarAesgar
    All the classes should be pretty close now. Each one will be better off in different spots which will be interesting.

    I'd like to see a new dragon record made!
  • AesgarAesgar
    edited April 2016
    Tael said:
    Bard was already one of the best, knights got nerfed, and it got an increase. So bard is the best now then?
    Yeah I was wondering about that? Maybe they noted it wrong in the announce. 

    Edit: It does need an accuracy boost for novices though
  • DortheronDortheron
    When I'm able to jump on I'll have to test it out and see if I can 1-shot more stuff now #MonkOP4EVAR
    You know, that one thing at that one place, with that one person.

    Yea, that one!
  • SzanthaxSzanthax San Diego
    Small medium large.. and tiny.



  • AntoniusAntonius
    Tael said:
    Bard was already one of the best, knights got nerfed, and it got an increase. So bard is the best now then?

    It's based on how tanky the class is (before artefacts are factored in, I believe) . Bard takes a lot more damage than Knight classes do. Bard is also losing the benefit of Canticle for itself in this round of classleads, so it's going to be dropping a fair amount of DPS when that happens.

    Results of disembowel testing | Knight limb counter | GMCP AB files

  • SzanthaxSzanthax San Diego
    Heh tankiness and dragons got an increase? I know I'm doing it wrong but I do Dragon all the time



  • AntoniusAntonius
    I imagine the dragon buff was to account for the (over)nerf a while ago. Likely the same reason a few other classes got buffs the size that they did.

    Results of disembowel testing | Knight limb counter | GMCP AB files

  • SzanthaxSzanthax San Diego
    Ahh. Interesting didn't know that



  • AerekAerek East Tennessee, USA
    I think Bard was also only "the best" when omni-artied. I never really heard unartefacted Bards talking about how great their hunting was.

    I'm interested to try out the new numbers. I don't mind S&B taking a nerf, it was the best Knight hunter bar none, but I'm hoping DSL and DWB didn't get hit. Hunting as those styles was already painfully slow, even if they were tanky AF; hoping they got buffs, rather than nerfs.
    -- Grounded in but one perspective, what we perceive is an exaggeration of the truth.
  • AhmetAhmet Wherever I wanna be
    Aerek said:
    I think Bard was also only "the best" when omni-artied. I never really heard unartefacted Bards talking about how great their hunting was.

    I'm interested to try out the new numbers. I don't mind S&B taking a nerf, it was the best Knight hunter bar none, but I'm hoping DSL and DWB didn't get hit. Hunting as those styles was already painfully slow, even if they were tanky AF; hoping they got buffs, rather than nerfs.
    Unartied bard is a pain.
    Huh. Neat.
  • SenaSena
    edited April 2016
    These changes seem to be based on the assumption that the previous round of changes (bringing all the classes to about the same level of DPS) was successful, which it very much was not, the previous round of changes still seemed half-finished to me.

    Apostate, for example, already had below-average damage which their tankiness already didn't make up for, but they got nerfed further. Bard already had well above-average damage (above-average unartied, one of the best classes by far with a Soulpiercer and a couple defensive arties) and got buffed further.

    Edit: I missed the upcoming canticle change, so the bard change might be fine after that.
  • SzanthaxSzanthax San Diego
    Sena said:
    These changes seem to be bases on the assumption that the previous round of changes (bringing all the classes to about the same level of DPS) was successful, which it very much was not, the previous round of changes still seemed half-finished to me.

    Apostate, for example, already had below-average damage which their tankiness already didn't make up for, but they got nerfed further. Bard already had well above-average damage (above-average unartied, one of the best classes by far with a Soulpiercer and a couple defensive arties) and got buffed further.
    It's fun... I dunno..I suppose no matter how much we use statistics from our side we dint see everything.



  • RyzethRyzeth
    edited April 2016
    Shaman seems okay-ish. Better than it was, needed improvements in tankiness though honestly, not more damage. Even with garon/daina bound (best combo now imo, with alternating jinx/curse) it still goes squish easy
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, Florida
    edited April 2016
    I admit I am fairly skeptical about the apostate bashing. It already was not that fantastic, and slow, to begin with.

    I'll do some testing later to get some better details, but I don't really understand the logic behind nerfing them further, while alchemist (which is tankier due to robes) remains the same, Occultist got a tiny increase, and Shaman got a large increase (these are the most similar classes hunting-wise to Apostate, but there are still some differences of course).

    We'll see.
    And I love too                                                                          Be still, my indelible friend
    That love soon might end                                                         You are unbreaking
    And be known in its aching                                                      Though quaking
    Shown in this shaking                                                             Though crazy
    Lately of my wasteland, baby                                                 That's just wasteland, baby
  • KayeilKayeil Washington State
    I haven't tried out shaman with the changes, but I'm glad it got a damage increase. It really needed it since the class got squishier, so happy for any shamans still using the class. Also pretty happy about the (small) damage increase for dragons. Any little bit helps! Not sure about any of the other classes, but will be interesting to see how this all plays out.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • LucianusLucianus
    Just tried Blademaster again. I died twice to stuff I normally cheese through with Runewarden and Bard. Putting Blademaster back on the 'Not for PVE Content' shelf. >_>
    That is not an ordinary star, my son. That star is the tear of a warrior. A lost soul who has finished his battles somewhere on this planet. A pitiful soul who could not find his way to the lofty realm where the great spirit awaits us all.
  • LucianusLucianus
    As for the Bard buff. It's cause Canticle got nerfed (or will get nerfed after that classlead got finalized). It doesn't give us Bards a speed boost anymore (only affects allies now).
    That is not an ordinary star, my son. That star is the tear of a warrior. A lost soul who has finished his battles somewhere on this planet. A pitiful soul who could not find his way to the lofty realm where the great spirit awaits us all.
  • TolanTolan
    Lucianus said:
    As for the Bard buff. It's cause Canticle got nerfed (or will get nerfed after that classlead got finalized). It doesn't give us Bards a speed boost anymore (only affects allies now).
    I would rather have canticle than a damage buff
  • AntoniusAntonius
    Currently have both, Canticle hasn't been nerfed yet.

    Results of disembowel testing | Knight limb counter | GMCP AB files

  • LucianusLucianus
    Tolan said:
    Lucianus said:
    As for the Bard buff. It's cause Canticle got nerfed (or will get nerfed after that classlead got finalized). It doesn't give us Bards a speed boost anymore (only affects allies now).
    I would rather have canticle than a damage buff
    pretty much screws over every bard with level 2 rapier.

    Hey! Wanna have the same speed you used to have? Aww... too bad. You'll have to buy a level 3 rapier now.
    That is not an ordinary star, my son. That star is the tear of a warrior. A lost soul who has finished his battles somewhere on this planet. A pitiful soul who could not find his way to the lofty realm where the great spirit awaits us all.
  • TolanTolan
    Antonius said:
    Currently have both, Canticle hasn't been nerfed yet.
    Yes! And bashing is teh awesome!
  • AntoniusAntonius
    At least you have the option of upgrading to get the speed back. Bards with Soulpiercers are the real victims here!

    Results of disembowel testing | Knight limb counter | GMCP AB files

  • LucianusLucianus
    Antonius said:
    Currently have both, Canticle hasn't been nerfed yet.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Submitted by: Anonymous      Status      : Finalised
    Skill       : Harmonics      Ability     : Canticle
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Problem:
    1.5s Soulpiercer jabs are neither necessary for Bard to be successful nor enjoyable to fight against. Pre-Jinx Shaman showed
    us that afflictions delivered at herb balance speed is not a good dynamic, especially given Bards'/Soulpiercers' impressive
    damage potential. Soulpiercers are likely fine, it's Canticle that pushes the jab speed over the top.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Solution #1:
    Make Canticle affect Bards' allies, but not the Bards, themselves, thus capping Soulpiercer jabs at ~1.7. If Canticle is
    deemed "necessary" for Bards with forged gear, then forged rapier speed could be adjusted up to compensate.
    Solution #2:
    Reduce Soulpiercer speed slightly. Queued 1.5s jabs without latency beat herb balance with simulated latency. Not even
    Serpents do that.
    Solution #3:
    Something I haven't thought of.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Decision:
    Agreed, I do not believe self enhancing canticle is necessary anymore. To become allies only.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    It's coming. :(

    That damage increase isn't even that great.


    Meh! I'm neutral about it. Since I got a bajillion other classes.
    That is not an ordinary star, my son. That star is the tear of a warrior. A lost soul who has finished his battles somewhere on this planet. A pitiful soul who could not find his way to the lofty realm where the great spirit awaits us all.
  • TolanTolan
    Yeah, but as @Antidas said, you can at least upgrade your weapon. Me on the other hand, I'm stuck being slower and not being able to regain that speed.
  • KafzielKafziel
    edited April 2016
    My three classes:

    Dragon       -   Damage increase (Small)
    Serpent      -   Damage increase (Medium)
    Shaman       -   Damage increase (Large)

    B)
  • SzanthaxSzanthax San Diego
    You can trade in rapier,buy alvl2 and get credits...



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