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Ideas for gold sinks and IG credit prices

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  • ValkynValkyn Member Posts: 734 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Being forced to hunt in dragon only places would suck, I prefer to hunt in serpent (and hunt much, much faster than in dragon) and can't tank them. Areas like Dun, Quartz Peak and Moghedu are not dragon only, but dragon friendly and much better.

    Shirszae
  • KayeilKayeil Washington StateMember Posts: 2,824 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Valkyn said:
    Being forced to hunt in dragon only places would suck, I prefer to hunt in serpent (and hunt much, much faster than in dragon) and can't tank them. Areas like Dun, Quartz Peak and Moghedu are not dragon only, but dragon friendly and much better.
    Oh yeah. Not proposing a restriction at all, just explaining why it won't make sense to restrict dragons and not anyone else.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • XadenXaden Member Posts: 2,315 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    With the recent change to quests I can only see things getting worse for the midbies. Why spend the extra minute going from Moghedu to Tenwat when I can go 5 rooms to quartz peak and get the exact same amount of gold?
         He is a coward who has to bring two friends as backup to jump people hunting.

    MamiPenwize
  • SarathaiSarathai Member Posts: 2,139 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited March 2016
    Valkyn said:
    Being forced to hunt in dragon only places would suck, I prefer to hunt in serpent (and hunt much, much faster than in dragon) and can't tank them. Areas like Dun, Quartz Peak and Moghedu are not dragon only, but dragon friendly and much better.
    As a note on this, the dragon AREAS list could probably do with some modification. Recommending a just-reached-99 dragon to go bash LHG and/or the Fissure probably isn't going to end well in a lot of cases.

    Or just give us high-end bashers the ormyrr-occupied Shallam ruins that we've been wanting.
    - (Eleusis): Ellodin says, "The Fissure of Echoes is Sarathai's happy place."
    - With sharp, crackling tones, Kyrra tells you, "The ladies must love you immensely."
    - (Eleusian Ranger Techs): Savira says, "Most of the hard stuff seem to have this built in code like: If adventurer_hitting_me = "Sarathai" then send("terminate and selfdestruct")."
    - Makarios says, "Serve well and perish."
    - Xaden says, "Xaden confirmed scrub 2017."



    KayeilAtalkezBoosteya
  • KayeilKayeil Washington StateMember Posts: 2,824 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Sarathai said:
    Valkyn said:
    Being forced to hunt in dragon only places would suck, I prefer to hunt in serpent (and hunt much, much faster than in dragon) and can't tank them. Areas like Dun, Quartz Peak and Moghedu are not dragon only, but dragon friendly and much better.
    As a note on this, the dragon AREAS list could probably do with some modification. Recommending a just-reached-99 dragon to go bash LHG and/or the Fissure probably isn't going to end well in a lot of cases.

    Or just give us high-end bashers the ormyrr-occupied Shallam ruins that we've been wanting.
    Hell, I still don't hunt the Fissure. lol. I die every time I go there. Might not be too bad if I figured out the proper strategy, but meh.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • MinifieMinifie Member Posts: 2,372 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Kayeil said:
    Sarathai said:
    Valkyn said:
    Being forced to hunt in dragon only places would suck, I prefer to hunt in serpent (and hunt much, much faster than in dragon) and can't tank them. Areas like Dun, Quartz Peak and Moghedu are not dragon only, but dragon friendly and much better.
    As a note on this, the dragon AREAS list could probably do with some modification. Recommending a just-reached-99 dragon to go bash LHG and/or the Fissure probably isn't going to end well in a lot of cases.

    Or just give us high-end bashers the ormyrr-occupied Shallam ruins that we've been wanting.
    Hell, I still don't hunt the Fissure. lol. I die every time I go there. Might not be too bad if I figured out the proper strategy, but meh.
    Sarathai hunts it for his Gleam and pygmy addictions.


    (Mhaldor's Next Top Model): Taryius says, "Oops, thats not a foray. Thats two novices going at it in the wilderness."
  • NataliiaNataliia Member Posts: 385 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    @Kayeil ;I wasn't actually serious about forcing dragons to hunt in only dragon level areas. I've been playing IRE for far too long to believe that's even a realistic thought. And, in most of those games I have been end game at least once. Sarcasm text fail. q

    There's no way around really fixing the issue of 'midbies' needing gold and having a rough go at getting it, and end game having all of the tools to get it a little too easily, without punishing the whole playerbase by doing gold drop nerfs and that sucks for everyone. Aetolia did that, and it's one of the big reasons I chose not to make my new character in Aetolia, just to be blunt.

    I mean, if Achaea made a bashing "instance" like Aetolia did, that was on a cooldown of when your character entered it, that was an attainable hunting ground in the mid to late 80's, that would be epic. It would guarantee everyone in that range actually got a shot at 1) Having some guaranteed experience without having to trudge around the world to find a decent bashing spot that isn't cleared, and 2) Guarantee some gold for hunting there. I don't think I'd go so far as to make the cooldown every hour or so like it was in Aet, because that would create a huge influx of gold, but maybe once an IG month, where it reset on the serenade so that it catered to everyone's play times, would be awesome. (Even better would be adding two. One that catered to the 60-80 level range for when gnolls are just not cutting it any more, then one for 80+.)
  • FrederichFrederich Member Posts: 1,243 @ - Epic Achaean
    Good lord would I love a hunting zone for myself, as a Monk, that actually had denizens I could properly fight.

    Because let me tell you a thing.  I know Runewardens are bullshit with how much damage they can take...  Monks are worse though. I can numb, walk in, get two combos off, then walk out.. Sit around to numb again.  Rinse and repeat ad nauseum until the thing is dead.
  • KayeilKayeil Washington StateMember Posts: 2,824 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Nataliia - my bad! There was a discussion on this recently on another thread where some people sounded serious about making dragons hunt in certain areas.

    That really sucks about the changes to Aetolia. Since it has a smaller playerbase, one of the draws for me there was that I could hunt decent amounts of gold pre-Logosian and still buy things. Of course my nature is to collect fun things and I had several minipets both times I tried Aetolia (they were so much cheaper there than they are here), and since they have a lot more crafting going on there were always fun things to buy. If that's harder to do now, I'm not even sure what I'd do to amuse myself while just spending time alone in Aetolia if I ever returned.

    I remember that instanced hunting ground in Aetolia. I got to follow much higher ranked players there sometimes, and it was pretty cool. Really wouldn't mind something like that with certain limitations here.

    Not directed at anyone in particular: As for this entire thread though? Wasn't it already stated they don't want ideas for sinks and stuff because there are things to the economy of Achaea that we can't possibly know? Just wondering why this still persists with more ideas that likely aren't even being heard anymore because we really don't know the impact of how they will alter this game. I'd be all for posting other ideas on another thread, some that may be introduced to exists gold sinks, or whatever. I know I have a huge list of submitted ideas, some that would be part of gold sinks.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • DochithaDochitha Member Posts: 1,413 @ - Epic Achaean
    edited March 2016
    Delete hunting. Each char gets a set amount of gold gen per second, increases over levels. If you want more, but 12 hour boost or 24 hour boost. Or buy those credits and convert into gold. #farmvilleisback

    On that note, please bring back discontinued SOW stocks and artefacts, price them in absurd amount of gold. Thing is, it still won't sink the gold, people just generate more gold to afford them, right? Yeah.

  • ValkynValkyn Member Posts: 734 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    @Nataliia this is getting a bit off track, but something you might not realise is that with the battlerage changes, places that are considered 'dragon areas' are often too strong for unartied dragons to solo, or dragons in lesser unless they're particularly tanky.

    The places for midbies to hunt kind of suck. Too squishy and you're stuck in level 60 places till 85+ and the gold is disgusting. Too tanky and you're competing with dragons for places like moghedu which as I said is perfect for a lesserformed dragon.

    Borran
  • KlendathuKlendathu Eye of the StormMember Posts: 3,178 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Moghedu so dull, there's a whole world out there!

    Tharos, the Announcer of Delos shouts, "It's near the end of the egghunt and I still haven't figured out how to pronounce Clean-dat-hoo."
    SobriquetShirszae
  • ValkynValkyn Member Posts: 734 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    I know! I've explored almost all of it. Still find the biggest areas the best though, for time spent getting there and around for gold.

  • NataliiaNataliia Member Posts: 385 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    @Valkyn I have done plenty of hunting in Achaea pre battlerage and post battlerage to know that it has changed things. I do think it would be great if there were areas that catered a little bit more to non-artied 90-dragon lvels that weren't as scaled as the dragon level places are now.

    But! We only have one Garden team, and they're doing the best they can I'm sure. So, if new areas get put in that help with those issues or places that got insanely hard get tweaked to be just a little more survivable, fantastic, I'm sure a lot of us will be doing the happydance. 
  • SobriquetSobriquet Member Posts: 2,422 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    We have hundreds of hunting areas with rich character and room descriptions, and quests. I personally don't see it as a dire need for more areas at all (I hunted Meropis last night with Chris for over 2 hours and think only saw one other adventurer) I think we need those areas to more accessible. I find it hard to see why we have such amazingly built areas that you can only get to by spending millions on a ship,thousands of credits on unique wings or funding enough MC to get a pebble. Even the need for 800cr on a stick or having a friendly serpent around is a tad frustrating. Klendathu made the point of Moghedu being boring, and it is now, but it's SO much easier for me to hunt there, Quartz and Dun than try and get to Meropis. There are also areas I've never been to because I physically can't and don't have the ability to without harassing someone to go sailing.
    image
  • KayeilKayeil Washington StateMember Posts: 2,824 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    To be fair, the walk to Meropis isn't that bad, people are just lazy. Once you learn it, it's pretty fast. Annoying, sure, b ecause you can't auto-walk to it like most everything else... but plenty of people hunt the north with no problem and that's a slow walk unless you have dash, gallop, flying, or those retired artie boots that make it faster to walk in the wilderness.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • ElipiseElipise Member Posts: 378 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    It has been mentioned to me a few times "iron membership is affordable and will help you advance"
    affordable that is one of those words that mean something different to everyone else.... I have twins on the way, affordable to me is maybe $5 a month... Maybe.

    the only way for me to catch up with others is for me to hunt gold, I've taken a more "non combat" role because of this. Sure, I'll eventually figure out enough to get me into group combat.. But artifacts exct are generally out of my reach.

    all the talk about gold sinks makes me nervous, I like the game because it was still obtainable through gold to become like the others who have the spendable cash... 
    Torinn Chiragh, Herald of Fire says, "Good, darn it."
    Talamond Averial says, "You are the least charming siren ever."
    Anaria
  • PenwizePenwize Member Posts: 1,541 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Elipise said:
    all the talk about gold sinks makes me nervous, I like the game because it was still obtainable through gold to become like the others who have the spendable cash... 
    It shouldn't, the idea behind gold sinks is to add additional things to spend gold on, not to force everyone to have to spend more gold.  Things like ships and mining are examples of gold sinks: things that remove gold from the economy on a voluntary basis in exchange for entertainment, advantage, cosmetics or profit (of the non-gold variety).
  • TreyTrey Member Posts: 4,797 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Honestly, Mayan Crowns being able to be purchased bound with a ton of gold would be interesting, I think. I could see an interesting development forming where sometimes unbounds sell for less than bounds, then other times more depending on supply available. Keep it high enough though, and those desperate for those last few crowns for their item will be willing to shell out a bunch if the unbound supply dries up like it tends to at times.

    AereidhnaBoosteya
  • ElipiseElipise Member Posts: 378 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Penwize said:
    @Elipise said:
    all the talk about gold sinks makes me nervous, I like the game because it was still obtainable through gold to become like the others who have the spendable cash... 
    It shouldn't, the idea behind gold sinks is to add additional things to spend gold on, not to force everyone to have to spend more gold.  Things like ships and mining are examples of gold sinks: things that remove gold from the economy on a voluntary basis in exchange for entertainment, advantage, cosmetics or profit (of the non-gold variety).
    I'm very confused now, because I thought the term gold sink was being used for quests being reduced and gold drops as well??
    Torinn Chiragh, Herald of Fire says, "Good, darn it."
    Talamond Averial says, "You are the least charming siren ever."
  • XadenXaden Member Posts: 2,315 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Sarapis said:
    Elipise said:
    Penwize said:
    @Elipise said:
    all the talk about gold sinks makes me nervous, I like the game because it was still obtainable through gold to become like the others who have the spendable cash... 
    It shouldn't, the idea behind gold sinks is to add additional things to spend gold on, not to force everyone to have to spend more gold.  Things like ships and mining are examples of gold sinks: things that remove gold from the economy on a voluntary basis in exchange for entertainment, advantage, cosmetics or profit (of the non-gold variety).
    I'm very confused now, because I thought the term gold sink was being used for quests being reduced and gold drops as well??
    Those are gold faucets. Faucets produce gold. Sinks consume gold.
    Exactly @Elipise They've shut down the gold faucets. Not added gold sinks, you're grand, don't worry about it. It's everyone who bashes predominantly for gold who's been fucked, not you.
         He is a coward who has to bring two friends as backup to jump people hunting.

    Elipise
  • AnariaAnaria Member Posts: 184 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    edited March 2016
    Do gold sinks really matter though? The eleven pages worth of this thread seem to indicate that nobody is really hoarding gold. The price of credits isn't over 7300 and rising because gold is worth less than it was. Credits are skyrocketing because the market just can't support the demand created by multi-classing. There will never be a point where a player stops needing credits, even at max level.

    Gold sinks seem like speed bumps to the rising prices, not actual solutions. Once the rich player has the extra stuff she needs gold for, she'll go right back to buying credits, or using the ones she buys for cash.

    I also don't see credits for cash as affordable. It simply takes too many credits to get anywhere that feels remotely meaningful.
  • KietKiet Member Posts: 3,263 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Gold sinks do matter, as evidenced by the fact that ships and the gold auction visibly tanked CFS prices. The problem is adding gold sinks at a regular pace requires a lot of admin work.
    PenwizePatroklos
  • MinifieMinifie Member Posts: 2,372 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Kiet said:
    Gold sinks do matter, as evidenced by the fact that ships and the gold auction visibly tanked CFS prices. The problem is adding gold sinks at a regular pace requires a lot of admin work.
    Pretty much, I could definitely see a benefit in consistent gold sinks being added, but maybe they are looking into it but first tightening the faucets? Hopefully not, since that'll let people who can easily afford the next gold sink get in (unless it is an unlimited sink like ships?)


    (Mhaldor's Next Top Model): Taryius says, "Oops, thats not a foray. Thats two novices going at it in the wilderness."
  • KayeilKayeil Washington StateMember Posts: 2,824 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Sarapis said:
    Medi said:
    I notice a lot of people putting forth effort trying to generate ideas for revenue or content for game, only to be told that it's not really a focus at this point in time, or flat-out not something that will be considered. I wonder, if people are going to be so persistently helpful, what are some general areas that the admin feel Achaea could use some brainstorming?
    Class leads, ship leads, and of course there's the ideas command in-game!

    The thing is, ideas are easy. Everybody has a thousand of them. It's combining a deep understanding of what you're talking about with ideas born from experience where they start to have some value. So, for instance, things like usability fixes tend to be good things to suggest, because they're something you guys have intimate experience with. Same with classleads, where you have more intimate experience with it than most of us do (well, those of you that know combat really well), or even just talking about things you'd pay for.

    However, none of you really have much visibility into the economics of our business, and none of you have any real experience running a viable MUD company (that I know of at least!), so it's really difficult for you to be productive on the idea front there.
    This is why I think this thread has kind of lost its purpose. Plus some other comments by Sarapis. They don't really want ideas on his fron because we have little experience with their business economics and the way they run the game behind the scenes. Not to mention that yes, people are still panicky for no real good reason. All this resulted in was some nerfed quests, ahmetite, and braid. The last two were necessary, but there rest? I don't really think so, because it hurt some midbie and newbie quests, too.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • TahquilTahquil Member Posts: 4,374 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited March 2016
    Multiclass carries some of the blame but I think a lot of the current spike has to do with the promotions that have occurred in the past 2 months.

    The seafaring talismans wasn't everyone's cup of tea. I know quite a few people who left off buying credits or bought way below their usual number of credits for that month in hopes of a better promotion in March.

    March bought on a promotion which a -lot- of people bought into however people buying into this promotion doesn't bring credits into the system. Given that buying tokens and spinning for prizes 'seem' to be giving a lot more bang for you buck than buying outright a lot more people have been opting to buy tokens instead of bringing fresh credits into the game. The prizes from the wheel are given in credits that are bound to the player and won't ever touch the market.

    Let's see hang on a bit and see the next promo. It might bring a influx of credits in that market seriously needs to drop the prices.
    Shirszae
  • BorranBorran Member Posts: 845 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    No wonder these promotions are all so expensive.  IRE has all these golden water fixtures!

    YselaElipise
  • ZukoZuko Member Posts: 730 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Kayeil said:
    Sarapis said:
    Medi said:
    I notice a lot of people putting forth effort trying to generate ideas for revenue or content for game, only to be told that it's not really a focus at this point in time, or flat-out not something that will be considered. I wonder, if people are going to be so persistently helpful, what are some general areas that the admin feel Achaea could use some brainstorming?
    Class leads, ship leads, and of course there's the ideas command in-game!

    The thing is, ideas are easy. Everybody has a thousand of them. It's combining a deep understanding of what you're talking about with ideas born from experience where they start to have some value. So, for instance, things like usability fixes tend to be good things to suggest, because they're something you guys have intimate experience with. Same with classleads, where you have more intimate experience with it than most of us do (well, those of you that know combat really well), or even just talking about things you'd pay for.

    However, none of you really have much visibility into the economics of our business, and none of you have any real experience running a viable MUD company (that I know of at least!), so it's really difficult for you to be productive on the idea front there.
    This is why I think this thread has kind of lost its purpose. Plus some other comments by Sarapis. They don't really want ideas on his fron because we have little experience with their business economics and the way they run the game behind the scenes. Not to mention that yes, people are still panicky for no real good reason. All this resulted in was some nerfed quests, ahmetite, and braid. The last two were necessary, but there rest? I don't really think so, because it hurt some midbie and newbie quests, too.
    Agreed!

    I don't think faucets should have been hit quite so soon. @Elipise made a good point
    Elipise
  • AnariaAnaria Member Posts: 184 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished

    Credits currently available for purchase:
          10 credits at  8000 gold per credit.
           1 credits at  8700 gold per credit.
          10 credits at  9000 gold per credit.
         100 credits at  9500 gold per credit.
          37 credits at  9900 gold per credit.
          13 credits at  9999 gold per credit.
          15 credits at 15000 gold per credit.
        1000 credits at 39999 gold per credit.
        8000 credits at 40000 gold per credit.
          82 credits at 50000 gold per credit.
    (3 offers with higher prices have not been shown.)

    Since March 6th, the date of the original post.
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