EQ Gem/Staff of Nicator.

Jovolo

It isn't 80% 

Bukariin

That's why there's a tilde?  I couldn't be asked to remember if it was 83 or 88.

Jovolo

Its much lower. That number is an incorrect assumption posted earlier in the thread by someone who has no access to the numbers

Seftin

RP A FIX RATHER THAN CRYING FOR A NERF - YOU CAN GET THE GEM BY KILLING HIM SO MAKE A DEATH SQUAD

Seftin

Daeir said:

Let's encourage people to make lolgank squads. That'll fix things.

  

Instead lets not try an ingame fix in our RP world and actually make the admins hard-code it.

Aerek

Caps lock makes for the most compelling arguments.

Either way, I don't think you or Strata are quite on the same page as the folks with the legitimate concerns. Sure, a lot of this thread is whining about Jhui, the Staff, and/or the EQ gem, but the reasonable posters are mostly concerned that disrupt stacks with itself. Jhui's comedic escapades aren't in the crosshairs, they just highlighted the existence of an abuseable mechanic, which is what we're (or at least I'm) referring to.

Someone humorously mentioned that they just think of Jhui as two monks jumping them at once, but that's an apt comparison in this case. If any two Monks, perhaps with Diadems or the EQ gem, can permanently remove your EQ, that's a problem that's not limited to the Staff or the EQ gem holder, alone. Stun was changed not to stack with itself because having the ability to do anything at all taken away from you isn't fun, and disrupt isn't any different in that regard.

Seftin

And I am answering the issues people have with Jhui and the Gem/Staff - yes, by all means fix disrupt to work in-line with other abilities, however asking to nerf the eq gem stacking with staff because one person can use it is ludicrous when you consider there is a perfectly viable in game reaction you can take to this particular combination.

Don't let him have/keep/get the eq gem.

Mishgul

I'm unsure. People have been proposing gank squads to counter gank squads since the beginning of time, and the last time this became a thing, the majority of said gank squad got shrubbed and alienated.

I am lucky because I don't have to deal with it currently. Ganking people is not easy, getting a -group- of competent combatants is definitely not easy, especially in this day and age when so many things are so concretely established, and also escaping out of combat is so much easier.

Seftin

Mishgul said:

I'm unsure. People have been proposing gank squads to counter gank squads since the beginning of time, and the last time this became a thing, the majority of said gank squad got shrubbed and alienated.

I am lucky because I don't have to deal with it currently. Ganking people is not easy, getting a -group- of competent combatants is definitely not easy, especially in this day and age when so many things are so concretely established, and also escaping out of combat is so much easier.

So the only option is to aim for the admin to nerf something that people are capable of preventing in game, that can be used by one individual?

Mishgul

Well if your only options are to gank him and nerf it, and you don't feel confident enough to gank him. Though I am unsure where this black and white situation came from.

Seftin

So if we are unable to do something due to our own ineptitude and, to be honest, laziness and fear of losing, then we should get it fixed by the admins?

Mishgul

I feel like you are not getting my subtle hints here.

Do I have to spell it out?

Seftin

Mishgul said:

I feel like you are not getting my subtle hints here.

Do I have to spell it out?

I think it's because I'm on a boat.

Rangor

lol, people thinking you can just put a group of people together, call it a death-squad and they are instantly capable of killing Jhui. (+friends)

Seftin

Rangor said:

lol, people thinking you can just put a group of people together, call it a death-squad and they are instantly capable of killing Jhui. (+friends)

I'm trying to say maybe they should try and IC resolution as opposed to just crying for a nerf to its stacking potential.

I understand the complexities behind killing Jhui (and co), however what I am saying is just because its complex, difficult and potentially prone to failure doesn't mean it should get a fix from admin.

Mishgul

Just wait until it resets. We can all play sins of a solar empire together when he has it instead.

Or cards against humanity if i've already griefed you into no longer playing sins of a solar empire.

Jhui

Rangor said:

lol, people thinking you can just put a group of people together, call it a death-squad and they are instantly capable of killing Jhui. (+friends)

Only need to kill me silly, then bail for a bit until we come back to try and take it!

Seftin

Jhui said:

Rangor said:

lol, people thinking you can just put a group of people together, call it a death-squad and they are instantly capable of killing Jhui. (+friends)

Only need to kill me silly, then bail for a bit until we come back to try and take it!

It's not exactly hard to kill this scrub, just send him a tell saying "testing" and he goes into auto-afk mode.

Tesha

What? Lifegiver + eqgem + Jhui's number of earrings + artifacts = "just kill Jhui"? Ok, say you try that ten times and it finally works. Then what happens? Ashtan comes and kills you and gets the relics back. 

Your solution to lifegiver+eqgem being OP is to "just beat them". Relics are a mechanic that rewards winning by making you absurdly more powerful so you can win more. It's the same problem I have with icons. "Just beat them" is a ridiculous statement. Relics should be in the vault of Proteus much more often, I have seen exactly one relic be unattainable since they were introduced.

Seftin

Tesha said:

What? Lifegiver + eqgem + Jhui's number of earrings + artifacts = "just kill Jhui"? Ok, say you try that ten times and it finally works. Then what happens? Ashtan comes and kills you and gets the relics back. 

Your solution to lifegiver+eqgem being OP is to "just beat them". Relics are a mechanic that rewards winning by making you absurdly more powerful so you can win more. It's the same problem I have with icons. "Just beat them" is a ridiculous statement. Relics should be in the vault of Proteus much more often, I have seen exactly one relic be unattainable since they were introduced.

I'm not tallking about all relics, I'm talking about eq gem with staff of nicator.

And yes, my answer is just beat him.

Herenicus

Lets just go in the other direction and introduce a second, more powerful tier of relics that requires the first tier to obtain. Then we will surely have the tools we need to stop the @Jhui menace once and for all.

Jhui

Why does the name in your post have to be "Jhui"?  Why can't it be Rangor or Iakimen or Xer?  It would be equally useful to them.

I would gladly grab a small group and kill myself if I were somewhere else.  Would it be as easy?  Probably not, but that's because my boys in Ashtan > scrubs in other cities.  But luckily, you don't have to kill the entire group for the relic to be taken, just 1 person.

Is it the problem with the relic or a problem with Monk?  I consider myself OP as fuck with or without it which I am hoping to address in these classleads.

Overall, I have just been able to whore the shit out of Eq Gem because everyone else is being lazy or they just suck.

Is it overpowered?  Yes.  Does it belong to me?  No.  Is it any more overpowered for me than anyone else?  Nope, it's still the same eq reduction.

I think what everyone is really trying to say in this thread:  "Monk is overpowered and Jhui is a whore"

Jacen

@Nim said it before, somewhere. Feed forward is generally a bad game design. Its fine for a person/faction to be better, but they shouldn't gain (significant) mechanical advantages because they're better. At least, not so directly related to the area that they're great in. 

Works great for single player games where you progress through tiers. Horrible idea to give the people who have proven that they're better more advantages/resources to be better. Just keeps tipping the scales.

Atalkez

Monk is overpowered and @Jhui is a whore.

This is pure gold.

Santar

The EQ gem is bad for a couple of reasons:

1. It is disproportionately strong compared to the other relics. It needs to be lowered to be a much smaller EQ bonus.

2. It makes the winning side have an even bigger advantage more often than not. This can apply to all relics, but the EQ gem is only one that provides an extremely severe advantage.

Jhui

Santar said:

The EQ gem is good for a couple of reasons:

1. It is very strong compared to the other relics giving a player that godmode feeling of taking on the world which everyone wants to be able to feel.  However, that player can easily die if he tries to take on too much and transfer that power to some other person to use back on them.

2. It makes the losing side have a chance to obtain this and feel like they can get closer to challenging the big dogs. This can apply to all relics, but the EQ gem is only one that provides an extremely severe advantage.

I may have exaggerated a bit there.

I think me holding onto the eq gem is 100% because of my own personal commitment to whoring it because of how well it works with my abilities and not because we are some super power that can't be brought down.  People just suck man. We don't. End of story.




Slight sarcasm, but not really.

Jacen

We're gonna make some OP items that are transferred to the winners of PK fights, but for the low price of beating the people who are already better than you without the OP items while they have the OP items, you could own one too! (momentarily)

Santar

Yep, the main reason you have it most of the time is because you and your people go get it.

Should the whole world turn into a game of constantly trying to get the EQ gem and taking groups of dragons to do so every single day?

Probably not. Balance the thing to be a minor buff.

Mizik

I like it. The EQ Gem is great Endgame purpose!

It's like our version of Starfalls.

It's the reason we play.

Jhui

Santar said:

Should the whole world turn into a game of constantly trying to get the EQ gem and taking groups of dragons to do so every single day?

A little over-exaggeration on how useful this is in anyone else's hands but mine (or maybe another artied eq monk, but again...monk).

The exaggeration that I am seeing is, "Jhui has Eq Gem, can't handle that, game over, give up."

When in reality the situation is "We'll get ass-raped either way because these dudes are just so much better than we are, but eq gem has just given us an awesome excuse as to why this is happening."


Am I right, or am I right?