Forums Home Forum Rules Achaea.com Lore Wiki Vote for Achaea! IronRealms.com
Home› Everything Achaea› North of Thera

What Happened To You Today?

1…424425427429430…812

Comments

  • MicaelisMicaelis
    Sarapis said:
    Micaelis said:


    That's just my two cents. I could be wrong, but from the outside, I feel like this is simply a punishment of outcome, not punishment of bug abuse.
    Yes, that's the only kind of punishment that makes sense. If you abuse a bug to get 1 extra gold a day, we might not even care enough to bother fixing the bug, much less punish you. Generating millions of gold a day? Big harm to the game = big punishment.
    Well that makes sense then. A clarification of the reason is appreciated. Thank you!
  • BannBann
    @Makarios / @Nicola - Can we get a little addon to SHIP TRADE DEAL SHOW that will tell us who accepted the deal on our ship? Gonna have to comb through my buddies to see who I had accept this deal for me the other day :D

  • MicaelisMicaelis
    Morthif said:
    Micaelis, Makarios stated that it was a combination of bugs that allowed them to generate massive amounts of gold whenever the trades lined up properly. When every single change in the past year or more has been to decrease the amount of gold in the game there really is no excuse to think it was working as intended. 
    Like I said, I'm an outsider on this and am probably ignorant to some of the ways they bypassed the intended system.

    Aside from that, the argument that inferred reasoning is a substitute for explicit policy is a terrible assumption to make. If you assume everyone will deduce the proper course of action based on all available evidence in any given area then they're not an idiot, you are.

    It took what, 48 hours after the incident in question happened for them to not only rectify the bug, but resolve the consequences? Seemed like a simple fix that was unable to be addressed either due to lack of interest or lack of personnel. The issue here isn't the bug, but the lack of admin, or their inability to see the consequences of a bug they (perhaps) knew about for a very, very long time.  Long story short, we need a tech support job fair.
  • MorthifMorthif
    Micaelis said:
    Morthif said:
    Micaelis, Makarios stated that it was a combination of bugs that allowed them to generate massive amounts of gold whenever the trades lined up properly. When every single change in the past year or more has been to decrease the amount of gold in the game there really is no excuse to think it was working as intended. 
    Like I said, I'm an outsider on this and am probably ignorant to some of the ways they bypassed the intended system.

    Aside from that, the argument that inferred reasoning is a substitute for explicit policy is a terrible assumption to make. If you assume everyone will deduce the proper course of action based on all available evidence in any given area then they're not an idiot, you are.

    It took what, 48 hours after the incident in question happened for them to not only rectify the bug, but resolve the consequences? Seemed like a simple fix that was unable to be addressed either due to lack of interest or lack of personnel. The issue here isn't the bug, but the lack of admin, or their inability to see the consequences of a bug they (perhaps) knew about for a very, very long time.  Long story short, we need a tech support job fair.
    Both the paid and volunteer staff work very hard for us rude ungrateful louts and if they missed a bug or didn't realize the scale of it until recently we aren't in a position to judge them over it. There is so much about what they do that we have no clue about to say if they should of or shouldn't of fixed it prior to this weekend.
  • KryptonKrypton shi-Khurena
    Micaelis said:
    This thing was submitted as a bug, or so people are saying, for near on a year, and half of them had no response and the other half said working as intended. 
    I'm sceptical of this. No one has said what the actual report was that was stated to be "working as intended".

    Was the report that "different people can accept and complete the deal"? Because that WAS in fact "working as intended" -- it allowed different captains to get the deal completed to their availability.

    If what was NOT intended--allowing COMPLETE more than once per Serenade--had been accurately stated in a bug report, and its problematic consequence laid out, I don't think it would have been overlooked, let alone marked "not a bug".
  • MicaelisMicaelis
    After being contacted, following this conversation, it seems there was more to the story than the little multiple person/homeport bug thing. So I fully understand the issue and reaction! Good work on rectifying this before everything broke and I'm sure we can all look forward to a more sustainable CFS now, RIGHT?!
  • MarisellaMarisella
    Micaelis said:
    Morthif said:
    Micaelis, Makarios stated that it was a combination of bugs that allowed them to generate massive amounts of gold whenever the trades lined up properly. When every single change in the past year or more has been to decrease the amount of gold in the game there really is no excuse to think it was working as intended. 
    Like I said, I'm an outsider on this and am probably ignorant to some of the ways they bypassed the intended system.

    Aside from that, the argument that inferred reasoning is a substitute for explicit policy is a terrible assumption to make. If you assume everyone will deduce the proper course of action based on all available evidence in any given area then they're not an idiot, you are.

    It took what, 48 hours after the incident in question happened for them to not only rectify the bug, but resolve the consequences? Seemed like a simple fix that was unable to be addressed either due to lack of interest or lack of personnel. The issue here isn't the bug, but the lack of admin, or their inability to see the consequences of a bug they (perhaps) knew about for a very, very long time.  Long story short, we need a tech support job fair.
    There's a Celani call going on, so maybe we will get more people anyway, if lack of admin is a problem. Alternatively, apply for Celani too!
  • MicaelisMicaelis
    Celani and RP Divine doesn't apply to this problem specifically, but a good point!
  • LaedhaLaedha
    Micaelis said:
    Celani and RP Divine doesn't apply to this problem specifically, but a good point!
    How do you figure? Seems like some bug reports probably could have been more thoroughly dealt with if there were more admin. I know somebody who definitely submitted a bug about the accept/complete issue and got 'working as intended' but I suspect it was because the person who looked at it misunderstood, or maybe it wasn't totally clear, or a combination. Whoever got the bug had to be pretty knowledgeable about sea trading to see why it would be a problem. More celani = more people to spread the work around and people with different in-game areas of expertise. 

    Or do Celani not deal with bug reports? 
  • KayeilKayeil Washington State
    Based on previous posts in this thread, I gather that whatever bug reports were sent in were not complete with all the bugs together... so if they bugged a part and not the whole, the Celani or whoever looked at it might not have understood or seen what was actually happening or being complained about. That is a very understandable situation, because without all the facts or information, how are they supposed to automatically know or see what is going on?
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • AccipiterAccipiter
    Atalkez said:
    After all the gold has been traced and wiped as best the team can do, can we discuss a potential hard reset on CFS to even 8000 average price and let it change from there under the new market?

    Being privvy to Targossas coffers....I cant help but assume this bug had a drastic impact on all facets of the game economy.
    Interested on your thoughts on how this would be possible seeing as the sellers decide the price. Unless you are talking about a "Sorry for the Ship Fuckup' fire sale for credits next month.
  • AegothAegoth
    Because we are a community of good, kind-hearted people, @Daeir
  • KayeilKayeil Washington State
    I definitely don't think it'll be 6k ever again, but I think that is in part due to multi-classing and all these promos full of talismans/artefacts. I think it has potential to lower somewhat back to 8-9k per but only time will really tell.
    What doesn't kill you gives you exp.

  • KyrraKyrra Australia
    What if CFS just got removed and people had to sell directly?
    (D.M.A.): Cooper says, "Kyrra is either the most innocent person in the world, or the girl who uses the most innuendo seemingly unintentionally but really on purpose."

  • AtalkezAtalkez
    edited April 2017
    Remove the gold manipulation and all gold generated from the manipulation.

    Remove all credits from CFS, return them to their owner.

    Set the average price back to 8000, and reinstate the 100 above/below rule to stop credit speculation. The rule didn't work because it wasn't effective enough to overcome the gold being driven into the economy. Would likely work better without artificial levels of gold in the game.

    CFS has never been perfect, but it stayed fairly steady with the fluctuation on a slow rise but that stopped recently. We've made a lot of changes to curb the inflation but it hasn't worked and now we know a bit more of why. So the only way to counteract that inflation is a hard reset on the value of that currency it feels like.

    Edit: I dunno if this is even feasible or not, the admin I'm sure will do their best to even things out.




    Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
  • SkyeSkye The Duchess Bellatere
    I would pay good IG gold to see an area opened called Super Dragon Punchout. You pay gold and fight dragons of your choice in a barehanded fightclub type bout. Whenever you punch a gold dragon, a shower of teeth falls out. 


  • RyzethRyzeth
    I'd rather just have worthwhile gold sinks besides CFS, personally.

    What to have that isn't stupidly OP, but still fun/worthwhile to spend gold on besides credits... Is another story entirely.
  • AccipiterAccipiter
    Ryzeth said:
    I'd rather just have worthwhile gold sinks besides CFS, personally.

    What to have that isn't stupidly OP, but still fun/worthwhile to spend gold on besides credits... Is another story entirely.
    Well, credits are for 'everything in the game' and any other gold sink is going to be for 'not everything in the game' so if the only thing you are saying is worthwhile is credits then you won't find anything worthwhile really.
  • ExelethrilExelethril
    edited April 2017
    I liked the "you're about to do double damage to <person> for 100000 gold;confirm" idea

    [ SnB PvP Guide | Link ]

    [ Runewarden Sparring Videos | Link ]
  • AsmodronAsmodron
    edited April 2017
    Having played other large population games out there and analyzed their economical concept....I can honestly say that we Achaeans are pretty spoiled. I've seen concepts where you need to pay in gold for your mount (as we do) and then need to pay very large sums to upgrade it for simple necessities, such as walking/flying faster (which in a large scale world, is a blessing).


    Trade skills are a legitimate business, as coming by the commodities isnt as easy as turning on a script and walking the area. I will say that their herbs and minerals arent so entwined to combat prowess as ours (heck, ours are a necessity), but their other trade skills grant benefits that are very much needed and helpful to take on bigger obstacles. It somewhat reminds me of Lusternia's trade system....but with less glitter, silliness and broken-ness.


    It becomes a duality of people that have a lot of gold and cant be bothered doing the work, so end up throwing gold at harvested resources of all kinds, to those that have the skills and have through time gained full mastery in them so use them to collect and sell. Yes....that is another point to bring up, you dont just become a master at a trade skill in a few minutes from 1700+ lessons, you actually have to -use- the trade to increase your talent. This costs you time and resources but has the chance of greater overall gain. The only thing I think we have close to that is the idea of a master blacksmith.


    Funny enough, in the big MMOs out there, people dont make the most of their gold from hunting. It is actually made from achievements. Dungeon clears, high-end trade item sales, gear auctioning etc. I believe this adds to helping the economy work, as rather than, once again, turning on a script and zooming through a zone while watching something on netflix, this requires some actual focus and planning.



    To summarize....I think we just have it way too easy in Achaea, but at the same time, with our small Pop, I'm not sure we can have it any other way.
  • OgnogOgnog
    Have some faith in the laws of supply and demand. They apply in the real world economy, and you'll see that they apply to CFS as well. Keep the faith!

  • AhmetAhmet Wherever I wanna be
    Your reputation among the ranks of the champions rises.
    You are now the Avenging Arrow Champion in the Ivory Mark.
    This is the surest sign that the mark system is suuuuuuuuuper broken. Someone please fix.
    Huh. Neat.
  • AegothAegoth
    Ahmet said:
    Your reputation among the ranks of the champions rises.
    You are now the Avenging Arrow Champion in the Ivory Mark.
    This is the surest sign that the mark system is suuuuuuuuuper broken. Someone please fix.
    i think you meant to say depthswalker. You getting kills is... well, time to stop holocausting
  • CaelanCaelan
    Makarios said:

    The people who got shrubbed were in a completely different league when it comes to generation compared to 99% of the people who used this bug. One person made more than the entire coffers of Targossas, for some perspective (that we have tracked down so far).

    As I said, this wasn't a case of people making a bit more than should be possible. I'll reiterate: there is no way any remotely established player is going to convince me (or anyone else privvy to the amounts involved) that there wasn't a point at which it clicked that the people involved might be doing something suspect. Frankly, the punishment is pretty generous given the amount of damage that was done, and the potential damage that would have continued to be done if a player hadn't notified us of the situation. Most bug abuses are pretty grey area. This one wasn't.

    I just appreciate that you took my advice on resolving the conflict.  <sarcasm> Now, where's my damn reward </sarcasm>  Any time you need my input, just ask :D 

    Seriously, bravo zulu on the timely assault on these asshats (tm Sarapis) and just another heartfelt "thanks" for all the shit you and @Nicola (and other admin) put up with and do for the community.

Sign In or Register to comment.