League of Legends

Jovolo

Just a ton of AP changes/buffs

Makaela

ok soo no nerfs to AD... I fail to see the issue?

Selira

There is simultaneously going to be a strong poke meta and a rise in jungler power with the new sated devourer. Trust me when I say it's been hard enough to be effective in the tank meta, but now even a very slight misposition is going to mean instant death.

Though sated Vayne jungle is hilarious.

Makaela

to qoute the path run down
Runeglaive smite teleport kalista top

Dortheron

Makaela said:

to qoute the path run down
Runeglaive smite teleport kalista top

If you have a PBE account, just play the blackmarket mode with TP boots enchantment. Then you can have Runglaive smite flash/ignite kalista tp boots top

Makaela

I have a PBE account but the client crashes after I type in my password.  

Dortheron

Makaela said:

I have a PBE account but the client crashes after I type in my password.  

That sucks. Have you reported about the problem on the pbe forums? Found here: http://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/bugs

Also, make sure that your PBE files aren't located in the same spot as your normal league files, as that seems to mess things up.

Makaela

Different folder Entirely. I will report the issue when I get home tonight!

edit:  after a patch it works so *shrugs*

Makaela

My first ever S rank as a support!!

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1888742547/204133896?tab=overview

I know I need to work on getting more wards down and wards destroyed. But I was caight with indecision on where to put my wards when Veigar was warding places I wanted vision >.>  I tried to cver us in oter areas but I definitly need to work on better warding!  Any other tips?

Jovolo

It's hard to give advice just from the match breakdown but I think locket of the iron solari would have been a better investment than zz portal. Lux was doing best in their team beside udyr who you can CC endlessly before he gets on your carry and being able to mitigate Ekko and Lux' damage for your entire team is a big boon. You also get the AoE shield active for team fights. Combine that with your face of the mountain active and that's a nice chunk of effective hp to give on of your carries. I'd suggest finishing face of the mountain earlier too. 33 minutes into the game is a bit late. You want locket and face of the mountain both finished within 30. They're pretty cheap overall. 

That cs though...

And like you said, more wards. Use any opprtunity you can to ward the enemy side of the jungle where you're pressuring the map. If dragon is up within 2 mins or you're pushing/someone in your team is split pushing on drag side, ward that side. Otherwise ward the other side. This would be if you win a team fight and they back off or are dead, if they're defending any towers from creep waves, if you simply move as 4 or 5 through their jungle and they can't beat you in a straight up fight. It'd also a good time to deny vision in their jungle so you can catch them out.

Makaela

I got zrrot as most of the ap damage in tean fights was being absorbed by me as it was and we were starting to struggle in seiging their towers so the active came in real handy for that.  Also what about my cs?  

I do have Locket of Iron Solari as one of my situation Items in in my  item build preset.

Jovolo

Not your cs as you're support! The rest of them. 40 minutes in and their ad carry had 87 farm, trynd had 135, only one person in the game had over 200.

If zz worked for you that's fine, just saying locket would also be a good item. It's usually core on almost all supports. I'd still say you should finish face of the mountain earlier but otherwise it looks good

Jovolo

This is an example of more reasonable cs figures at 40 minutes from a recent ranked game I had. I think 6cs/minute is average/good, 8+cs/minute is decent/great. 

http://matchhistory.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUW1/2201301992/71611241?tab=overview

and another one at 30 minutes: 

http://matchhistory.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUW1/2201192613/71611241?tab=overview

I'm Js0n (Kalista). The second game has worst cs/minute but a better KDA. I still need to work on my farming a whole lot.

Ideally you want to hit 300 cs at 40 minutes as a minimum, iirc

Makaela

oh yeah! funny thing is our Vayne apparently disconnected at some point after the 29 minute mark and she had more cs than most of the enemy team. I rarely hit 300 cs in a 40 minute game.. usually cus once I hit full build or near it I stop actively farming >.>

Tael

Jovolo said:

This is an example of more reasonable cs figures at 40 minutes from a recent ranked game I had. I think 6cs/minute is average/good, 8+cs/minute is decent/great. 

http://matchhistory.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUW1/2201301992/71611241?tab=overview

and another one at 30 minutes: 

http://matchhistory.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/EUW1/2201192613/71611241?tab=overview

I'm Js0n (Kalista). The second game has worst cs/minute but a better KDA. I still need to work on my farming a whole lot.

Ideally you want to hit 300 cs at 40 minutes as a minimum, iirc

It's pretty fruitless to try to figure out what CS should look like at 40 minutes. It depends too much on how the game is going - if you're playing against a team that is trying to push objectives constantly and trying to pick fights early and often, you're almost certainly going to end up with less CS than that because you can't afford to sit in lane while teamfights are happening. And when you're roaming with your team, your CS is going to depend a lot on the waveclear (and restraint) of the other champs/players on your team. And if you start snowballing early and can go win fights yourself, you can likewise come out with less CS and more power just from the bounty gold, not to mention the objective and vision advantage you can get out of winning fights (though it's worth pointing out that a lot of people overestimate bounty gold - a normal kill is only worth around 15 CS if you don't do something strategically useful while they're dead).

Your per-minute estimate is better. But that also depends on how aggressive they're being, how much they're harassing, how active their jungler is, etc.

Ultimately, what matters is whether you have more gold than the other ADC (and, to a lesser extent, the other players in the game). That's the easiest metric to look at to tell if you're CSing well - if you're consistently beating your opponent in CS, you're CSing just fine.

And you want to be careful not to get lost in CSing too. It's pretty obvious that you don't want to get yourself killed or forced out of lane while being overzealous about CSing, but it's also very important to actually use the big powerspikes you get from all that gold. ADCs that don't know how to CS are disastrous for the team, but ADCs who only know how to CS aren't very useful either. Gold doesn't buy power at a constant rate in LoL - particularly for ADCs it buys it in massive individual increments. Having 1000 more gold than the enemy ADC is a huge advantage, but it doesn't mean you're more powerful if you're waiting to buy a BF sword. And once you do go buy it, you're only more powerful until they get their own item - at which point you'll be equal for a while while you save up for your next item, even though you're ahead in gold.

When you go buy your BotRK or your Runaan's or your BT on Kalista, you want to make plays, not just continue farming until the enemy hits their own powerspike and your advantage disappears again. Your goal isn't just to get to an end-game build faster, it's to hit your powerspikes before the enemy and then use the time between your powerspike and theirs to push objectives, make plays, and widen the gap such that each time you hit a spike, you have even longer before they catch up to you. Don't let CS number targets get in the way of doing that or fall into the trap of thinking that you should be spending the entire game farming until you come in at the very end and sweep up. Some games go that way, but the further you get in the rankings, the more games are going to be decided much earlier on and focusing on numerical CS targets just to hit your end-game builds won't work at all.

Selira

All that being said, 87 cs on an aoe hypercarry at 40 minutes in is inexcusable. Jinx needs her farm desperately - by that time I'm at least at about 200 cs in most games (usually closer to 300-400 range) and keeping massive pressure on the map just from my wave clear. Jinx has her biggest spike at four items, though if she's ahead out of laning she'll be a monster the whole way through.

Kafziel

Selira said:

As an AD player, screw this patch.

Said every AD player, every patch

Makaela

@Selira To be fair Jinx did her best to get farm, survive and to try to get kills. However it became painfully apparent to me that her Lux support had no understanding on how to properly zone me and my adc out.  I mean If I can just walk and pace behind the enemy caster minions to effectively zone the enemy adc out from safely farming the enemy support is nopt doing its job properly.  And that is exactly what occured.  As a result Lux who can just later safely use her massive spell ranges in teamfights to stay relevant and jump back into having raw power was able to do so however her ADC had 0 chance at recovery with how she was shut down continuously from even trying to get any farm.

Their jungler should have attempted to gank us woth how often we were pressed to the enemy tower. Even if (which we did)we hadit warded the appearance would be enough to make us fall back maybe enough for Jinx to grab some of that much needed CS. 

Hell my most recent support match I felt really terrible on.. I went 0-10-7.. However my team had to remind me that I died doing my job. I kept our ADC quinn alive often, I died most times while attempting to increase our vision only to find all 5 enemies waiting for me. I still got the wards placed and that as a result led my team into fights they could win. They had to remind time that while yes my KDA was atrocious even for a support that I held more value then I was placing on myself.  The vision I managed to provide for my team allowed them to make the risky plays they made, plays they would not have otherwise tried for.  I still failed to get 25 wards by 30 minutes though >.>

@Jovolo I don't look at just CS, I once a long time ago had a ranked game as Brand where I was full build by the 15 inute mark simply becuase I had gained such a lead in mid that I began to roam and snow ball top and bottom off of my kills granting them assists when they were behind. My end game cs was shit but I still obtained the most gold by a 5k margin.  CS is important but there are far to many other factors to take in.

Tahe

If Dr. K can sell hardcore drugs to characters in a game, why can't Graves have his cigar?

Daklore

Because one has to have an ESRB rating, the other doesn't.

Edit: Also, one has millions and millions of players, while the other has hundreds. Also, advocacy groups complain. Parents complain. Parents who actually play league with their children complain... why they're complaining, I don't know, but whatever.

Trilliana

Daklore said:

Edit: Also, one has millions and millions of players, while the other has hundreds. Also, advocacy groups complain. Parents complain. Parents who actually play league with their children complain... why they're complaining, I don't know, but whatever.

As a parent... why can't Graves have his cigar? That'd be like taking away Gragas' booze because alcohol offends me (not really saying it does, but... same difference)!

Saeva

All those massive breasts flopping around the splash art and someone's mad about cigars!? lol this world.

Aegoth

You leave my breast flopping alone

Jarrod

Just played a game with @Saeva and @Aepas. Sometimes you have to go full assassin, or as I like to call it, "Just bug stuff".

Cynlael

'Full Assassin' - bruh those merc treads need to be lucidity boots, and the banshee needs to be black cleaver or ghostblade (yes, im aware BC will put you a little over cdr cap)

Jovolo

Banshee's is understandable against their team. Live long enough for the jump resets

Jovolo

Smite(Skirmishers)/TP Fizz top and jungle Ekko are so strong right now btw. Thoroughly recommend. 

Saeva

Fizz is always one of the most ridiculous champs regardless of jungle items

Cynlael

The amusing times of dicking around in bronze, where no one builds defensive items until super super late game... Also, Shen has a surprisingly good clear speed from what I remember...

Cynlael

Lol. This champ is fun again.