Stop paralysis and stun from eating queues

Paux

This just in: Achaea is Pay to Win! Just not how you think. 

 Pay for less latency and you win!

Now if only IRE would setup tiered payment plans where you pay more to get more faster service and capitalize on this completely fair and honest market strategy!

Lenn

2000 credit artefact for queue that respects afflictions.

Minifie

Lenn said:

2000 credit artefact for queue that respects afflictions.

And you can go fuck right back off to the cat cafe.

Archaeon

If gmcp.Char.Afflictions.List.paralysis then combo else combo/mind command end 

Namino

Archaeon said:

If gmcp.Char.Afflictions.List.paralysis then combo else combo/mind command end 

if gmcp.Char.Afflictions.List.paralysis ~= 1 then
 send("combo/mind command")
end

lua gmcp.Char.Afflictions.List.paralysis
false

combo/mind command
<latency>
Archaeon hits you with curare.

Your state of paralysis prevents that.
Your state of paralysis prevents that.
Your state of paralysis prevents that.
You send your command into the mind of your opponent, doing nothing but taking away your equilibrum for 4s because your jab failed, dummy.

Is that more clear?

Ironically the easiest solution for this is to just make paralysis stop illusion/mind command/hallucination and other things that typically are effective/paired with abilities that are currently stopped with paralysis, but that probably reduces some defensive options particularly in regards to illusions where you might be trying to use it to throw off your opponents offense while in an affliction hole and paralyzed.

Archaeon

What a niche example

Atalkez

Hmm, I dealt with this by tracking my own afflictions and nesting everything inside a paralysis/prone check.

My latency is likely better than some of yours, but doing the above should fix most of the outlier issues you’re talking about.

Also you don’t want to use the List like that, it doesn’t get removed until diagnosis unless something changed that I’m not aware of. I know they were adjusting gmcp things recently.

Namino

Yeah, in my actual check I use wsysf.affs.paralysis which works more effectively for me on Wundersys but I was going with what was handed to me. That handles accidentally spamming the combos out while already paralyzed, but doesn't handle the case where it gets intercepted due to latency.

For the record, I understand the monk mind command is a class-specific problem that doesn't affect most people but when fighting a para/x class with a moderate ping, it's actually cancerous, lol. I don't think we need a queue for that. Just make paralysis stop command please and thank you.

Antonius

@Namino This is exactly what classleads are for (HELP CLASSLEADS if you aren't familiar), though they won't be open again until early next year. Similar requests for other abilities have been approved in the past so I can imagine something will be done for mind command.

Namino

Yep. I was planning on it.

But it seemed relevant here too. 

Iakimen

Archaeon said:

What a niche example

It really isn't. I encounter this problem myself very frequently - if you look over any of the fights I've had with you as Monk while you were in Psion or SnB, you'll see a number of lone mind commands, which all arose from this interaction.

Concerning Namino's solution, it is enough to just make mind command prevented by paralysis - leave the other telepathy abilities untouched. Being able to mind command while paralyzed has very limited use.

Keorin

I'm a few days late, but I'll echo that this is a frustrating problem for monk. But it's hardly just a monk problem, it also hits (to a lesser extent), any class that frequently contemplates or discerns, which is a lot more common.

I -do- have a script that adds or removes mind command or contemplate from my attack alias based on if I have paralysis or not. I don't think there's much I could do to make that script better. But I have fairly consistent .07 second ping or so, which means that there's always a window where my script can't fire quickly enough, and I get myself thrown uselessly off eq. It's not a rare occurrence, and it's hardly just a problem in monk.

Taryius

Keorin said:

I'm a few days late, but I'll echo that this is a frustrating problem for monk. But it's hardly just a monk problem, it also hits (to a lesser extent), any class that frequently contemplates or discerns, which is a lot more common.

I -do- have a script that adds or removes mind command or contemplate from my attack alias based on if I have paralysis or not. I don't think there's much I could do to make that script better. But I have fairly consistent .07 second ping or so, which means that there's always a window where my script can't fire quickly enough, and I get myself thrown uselessly off eq. It's not a rare occurrence, and it's hardly just a problem in monk.

Discern doesn't go through if you're paralysed, and there is a trait for contemplate for that reason. Neither is as big of an issue as mind command, which I don't think is the end of the world, but a classlead for it should be thrown in next time they open up. I think one got rejected a few cycles back, but times change and you never know!

Lenn

I have the trait for discern rather than for contemplate.

[Deleted User]

Lenn said:

I have the trait for discern rather than for contemplate.

That's for assess. Discern shows bleeding for Shamans/Blademasters.

When I was DW I just contemplated off of the reap line, since contemplate EQ is faster than reap, so it was fine.

Lenn

Yeah, assess.

I just manually contemplate, but it's still annoying when I get paralyzed.

Cooper

The mind command issue is a "get good" issue. Time your attacks better so your opponent won't be attacking as you try to use mind command.

Minifie

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/overwatch/t/git-gud-is-toxic/36013?page=2

Cooper

Read the first reply to the post you linked, then reread my comment. 

Minifie

r/whoosh

Astarod

Shit talking combat mechanics in an OOC setting instead of through classleads is TOXIC. 


Also, @Cooper, you said it wrong....

@Minifie get gud.

[Deleted User]

Astarod said:

Shit talking combat mechanics in an OOC setting instead of through classleads is TOXIC. 


Also, @Cooper, you said it wrong....

@Minifie get gud.

...But you said it wrong, too. It's "git gud".

Iakimen

Cooper said:

The mind command issue is a "get good" issue. Time your attacks better so your opponent won't be attacking as you try to use mind command.

The issue is only relevant in cases where you strip deafness beforehand. Due to Monk's fairly long balances (ironically, the fastest deaf strip you can get is with t-fang or level 3 axe, which the vast majority of tekura monks will not have), the window for mind command is fairly small. For those with high latency, having to wait for their balance means you no longer can rely on queuing to make up for your disadvantage. In these cases, you simply can't afford to wait. You'll miss the window of opportunity.

This issue affects those with high latency the most, and those with high latency are the least capable of dealing with it, due to the clientside scripting involved. The solution seems very obvious to me. If mind command was stopped by paralysis, than those with low latency would hardly see a difference, if they coded around it properly. Those with high latency would no longer be punished by an unfortunate interaction that they are unable to deal with.

Most importantly, you have no idea how this class works, and haven't for years. I don't care when you spout bullshit in other threads, but I do care when it concerns combat or classes that I enjoy playing. Please keep your "get good" nonsense out of this thread, or at least until you manage to reach a level that approaches being good at combat in this game. Thanks.

Namino

The issue debanging the scripting argument isn't even one to do with monk's jab balance timer, really. If you script it to only send the mind command if the undeafening jab lands, you run into a bigger problem.

The number one use of mind command is to knock your opponent off of salve balance to delay their ability to cure a real break and allow you to complete a killpath. If you sweepkick, break a leg, and then jab and mind command, that's the classic open.

However, if you sweepkick, break a leg, then jab and script client-side to make sure the jab lands before you send the mind command, your setup is possibly (even probably, and perhaps even *certainly* in the cases of people with high latency) going to fail, as their server-side curing will begin healing the real break before your mind command apply goes through.

Again, this is an issue we'll bring up on classleads for sure. But it's not a 'git gud scrub' thing. Not everyone lives next door to the server.

Cooper

I don't have to be an expert 1v1 fighter to give suggestions that will help people.

The "get good" thing was pretty clearly a joke, I even spelled it wrong and put it in quotes to make that clear.