Homeport

Laedha

ANNOUNCE NEWS #4753 (04/24/2017 at 15:01)
From : Nicola
To : Everyone
Subject: Fixing Homeport
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We have also just fixed a bug with the Homeport ability in Seafaring. It is no
longer possible to use Homeport from a harbour. Homeport is intended as a last ditch
rescue for a ship at sea should her Captain not be able to complete a voyage, not as
a fast travel method to avoid sailing times and docking fees.
 
 
Penned by My hand on the 13th of Lupar, in the year 740 AF.

I'm not going to argue with the previous trading change because the amount of gold it was generating was getting kind of ridiculous. 

This change seems unnecessary though. The effects are self-limiting because of the cost. In order to use homeport for fast travel, people either need to be willing to spend 10k a pop (much more than any docking fees) or pay 50cr for a non-decay figurehead (550k gold at 11k credit prices) plus re-consecrate it each time it's used. My ship already had a non-decay figurehead but I made one non-decay on another character in order to use it for faster travel. Unlike the trading bug, homeporting between ports does not seem like a bug, it seems like a way for people to trade money for time/convenience just like a lot of other artefacts. 

At the very least, people who did that should have the option to issue and have that ship upgrade un-done. There's little point to a non-decay figurehead. 

Obviously I can't tell people what to say but it would be awesome if people didn't use this thread to debate about the other trading change. Somebody can make another thread for that if they want. 

Klendathu

Hahahahaha. Bug abuse. Not working as intended. Now fixed.

By all means, issue. See what response the admin team come up with. Pretty sure it'll be a more polite version of the line above.

Laedha

They probably won't change it back, I get that. I just don't think the way people were using it, on its own, distorts the game or creates an imbalance anywhere.  (Unlike the trading bug.) The fact that you can get a figurehead non-decayed and then it doesn't blow up when homeport is used sure made it seem like it was an intentional perk of buying the non-decay figurehead. 

Klendathu

It is a perk of non-decaying the figurehead. Homeport is meant to be used to get back to a harbour quickly when you're out sailing, not as a way to insta-travel your entire ship.

Krypton

A non-decay figurehead not blowing up is also a bug.

Only resetting figureheads are supposed to survive, as stated in AB HOMEPORT.

Torinn

I think this in conjunction with the trade thing was really the issue.

Klendathu

I suspect Nicola may be reading the forums...

ANNOUNCE NEWS #4754
Date: 04/24/2017 at 15:48
From: Nicola
To : Everyone
Subj: Another Seafaring Bug Fix
Non-resetting figureheads are now properly destroyed when the Homeport ability is used. Non-decay figureheads that are not resetting are also destroyed as is standard with a non-resetting item in any kind of object loss scenario. Resetting figureheads will reset after homeport usage with all power drained, as normal.
Penned by My hand on the 14th of Lupar, in the year 740 AF.

On a completely unrelated note, I would just like to say how lovely her hair is today. Not that it's not lovely every day, of course, just that it's extra specially nice today.

Laedha

Krypton said:

A non-decay figurehead not blowing up is also a bug.

Only resetting figureheads are supposed to survive, as stated in AB HOMEPORT.

Agreed. The announce that just popped up makes sense and fixes that. But I still think that is another reason why homeport should work from harbours. It makes the cost either 10k a pop (plus the trip to consecrate) or 100cr for nondecay+nonresetting.

 Torinn said:

I think this in conjunction with the trade thing was really the issue.

Also agreed. So since they fixed the trade thing and also fixed that you need nondecay+resetting to avoid blowing up a figurehead, I wish they would revisit allowing homeport from harbours. 

Antonius

Classleads will open up again in July, make a note to raise it then and start thinking of a compelling argument.

Melodie

Homeport was never intended as a "quick travel", but rather a "oh fuck I'm in the middle of the sea and my child has just swallowed a bottle of asprin and I have to GO RIGHT THE FUCK NOW".

It's an emergency button with consequences. It's only when the emergency outweighs the consequence that it should be used.

Laedha

This is the homeport scroll: 

Homeport (Seafaring) Known: Yes
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Syntax: INVOKE HOMEPORT
Details:
This powerful seaspell will return your vessel to the harbour that it
last departed. Once cast, the spell will summon a powerful storm to
transport you great distances.
 
Be warned, using the Homeport ability will come at a great cost,
destroying your figurehead in the process (or draining and dismounting
resetting ones). Your vessel must be in prime condition to withstand the
rigours of this journey, and any damage to this ship while returning
will cause the spell to fail.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Nothing in there indicates that it's supposed to be meant for rescue as opposed to travel. It also gets interrupted very easily, so it's definitely not useful as a combat escape power. Seems odd that the highest level seafaring ability is intended to have such a limited purpose. I'm not disagreeing that maybe it was intended to be that way, but I definitely do not think this is an issue where it's an obvious bug. It's very limited, only one return to the last harbour, and either breaks or un-consecrates the figurehead. Even as a travel tool, it's not that powerful. 

Krypton

Homeport          A seaspell to return you to safe harbour.

Can't "return" to safe harbour if you're already in one.

Melodie

ANNOUNCE NEWS #4453                                     (11/12/2015 at 22:51)  

From   : Tecton the Terraformer

To     : Everyone

Subject: Ships and Seafaring changes

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Our second big batch of ship changes are now live! Here's the details of the changes in this batch:

...

* HOMEPORT has been added as a new transcendent ability. This will allow you and your ship to return 

to the harbour of your last departure at high cost - handy for situations where you need to depart 

the realms in a hurry while in the middle of a voyage.

Christophe

Homeport should have (and always should have) an equivalent forced docking period which would have been the equivalent of the time saved.  Its common sense.   The idea you could Homeport and then instantly sail makes it a fast-travel ability.   Homeport then be forced to make repairs and wait 30 minutes or an hour makes it an escape ability.   My two cents, but I think calling it an exploit is a little on the harsh side...   I'd dry-dock anything that homeports if it was me, the outline elements of what you need are all there and it makes RP sense.

Its a mechanic that wasn't quite working out like the admins intended, and these sort of things happen with class skills all the time (and people use them) and then they get fixed on liaison rounds and such.   However, they are not true bugs or exploits its gotta be said.

Atalkez

True, but using it in conjunction with another mechanic to make a hefty sum of gold, bypassing the gold cap otherwise implemented?

That's bug abuse.

Ahmet

I don't think using it as fast travel was the main problem, the main problem was using it in port, and it taking you back to the last port you docked at. That seems a bit dumb, and obviously wasn't intended. If you wanna go out and fish, then homeport back to save you half an hour? Seems fine. Intended even.

Laedha

Atalkez said:

True, but using it in conjunction with another mechanic to make a hefty sum of gold, bypassing the gold cap otherwise implemented?

That's bug abuse.

Agreed but now that the other bug has been fixed, I'm hoping admin will walk this one back a little. Or set up something like @Christophe suggested so it can still be used for travel, but at an additional time cost. Otherwise it seems incredibly weak as the trans ability. In most places, if you have to leave the realms in an emergency situation, you can just anchor and take your chances. Salvage isn't that expensive. I'll try doing something with the next classlead reports although I've never done that before. 

Christophe

The bug was the trades, out and out - To be honest to declare the people who home-ported to be somehow worse than the people who didn't I think is harsh.    Some of these people would have been using Homeport as a viable means of moving around PRIOR to the bug I suspect (particularly for attacking other ships) so where you have become used to a mechanic working in a such a way it allows you to 'move faster' then its common sense you'd implement it for anything including these trades.

Nobody wants to defend this, I get that, but there is a line here where common sense has to prevail too.   If Homeport has been able to do this for a long time (which I believe it has) then I am sure the more able seafaring folk have worked out it has its uses for getting around trades or not.

Jonathin

People crying about homeport and don't even know what it was like to sail without it.

Laedha

Ahmet said:

I don't think using it as fast travel was the main problem, the main problem was using it in port, and it taking you back to the last port you docked at. That seems a bit dumb, and obviously wasn't intended. If you wanna go out and fish, then homeport back to save you half an hour? Seems fine. Intended even.

You know, I looked pretty hard at the scroll when I first got it and really did think it was admin-intended for it to work from port. It doesn't take you back to your last port, it takes you back  to the last port from which you departed. I know you know how it works but it's a meaningful distinction in terms of figuring out how the ability is supposed to work. It could have been set up to return you to the last port at which you docked, but it wasn't. That made me feel very confident that using it to get from one harbour to the last harbour was an intended feature. 

Jonathin

That totally makes sense if you were not around before homeport was a thing, but I have to tell you that the intended purpose of the skill was not to act as a fast travel ability. It was and was always supposed to be a figurative "oh shit" button because if something were to happen before, you would just have to leave your ship floating.

You may disagree and that is fine, but I suggest you submit your case during the next class lead bit because you are not going to get it changed via the forums.

Krypton

By all means, suggest your classlead/idea, but know that today's Homeport bug correction just indicates they are all the more likely to preserve its sole, original intent:

Lorielan said:

Homeport is designed as a last ditch action for emergencies when you just can't make it to another harbour/have to leave the game whilst sailing. I don't think we're interested in making it a convenience option, or to make it facilitate ease of travel.

Accipiter

Should of made it flag on harbour entry instead of exit but the fix seems fine for what it does. Maybe on entry has other issues I haven't thought of.

Aralaya

Although confusion should be mostly gone, something like this could be useful.
When you undock
"You attune <figurehead> to the port of <port> so you may return from the open water in dire circumstance"

When you dock

"The attunement to the port of <port> surrounding <figurehead> fades away"

Just an idea

Kayeil

I non-decayed and reset my figurehead around the time of Homeport implementation. Always assumed it was just for OOC emergencies, hence the reason I've never used it. Always figured the cost of losing figurehead power wasn't worth it just due to laziness. I don't think it should be altered to allow for quick travel as I do not believe it was the intent of the skill. Seafaring has always been a time investment. They didn't speed up hunting, instead denizens got bigger pools of health and it takes me a little longer than it used to... I definitely don't see them purposefully speeding up seafaring in any way in this capacity either. If you want to go faster, you get a bigger ship and train your crew to be better. That is how it has always been.

Kafziel

Can someone give me the ELI5  on this trade bug

Accipiter

@Kafziel The way I hear it, personal trades could be accepted by someone, then turned in by anyone on the ship. As the person to accept didn't complete the deal could be accepted again.

Couple this with homeport taking you back to the last harbour you left, meaning that the trade route that goes thraasi-zanzi-thraasi cut out 2 crossings of the tears you could get mass cargo quick, then if the accept and turn-in was at the same harbour you could repeat it all day long

I am glad i didn't know about it because I probably would of abused it.

Tahquil

I'll reiterate the first half of @Christophe's post because I kinda like it.
"Homeport should have (and always should have) an equivalent forced docking period .."

I like this general idea, a way to limit Homeport usage. I propose 3 different ways to use it though.

1) A cool down on homeport spell itself of 1-3 hours.

2) The inabilty to mount a new figurehead for 1-3 hours due to the damage of destroying your first one. People can still go and sail, but will be crippled without the ability to use sea spells if required.

3) A forced docking time where after using homeport you cannot leave dock for 1-3 hours.

Krypton

Once a month, like token...

Require at least 1000 figurehead power...

Lotsa options.

Bann

Don't think I've ever even USED homeport. Normally I just take my laptop into the bathroom with me when I have to poop.

Sobriquet

Gives a whole new meaning to logging on