Classlead Discussion Q2 2016

Sobriquet

Always the problem with open classleads though.

Dunn

Also why there's a five limit for non ACC members. 

Atalkez

Jinsun said:

Jesus. Someone really hates Occultist, and really doesn't understand it.

Most of them are mine from what I see. 

Aerek said:

Rant: Someone stole my signature "Something I haven't thought of" solution #3, and so now people are going to think some of these bizarre ideas are mine.

Where do I point this copyright infringement/defamation suit?

Some of that's me! I got lazy and hit a block on a lot of them for what I could offer, so went with that.

Ariete

Antonius said:

Not sure who is filing dual blunt classleads, but they clearly don't know how the spec is supposed to be played, or what half of its abilities do.

All I've seen are 64, 98, and 138 for DWB, and yea the momentum thing is a little outrageous.

I'm unfamiliar with Recover Footing though.

Atalkez

Allows you to stand while off balance. It's currently in the 2h spec.

That's mine too.

Ahmet

Whoever submitted 32 forgot about cubes and orbs :S 

Aerek

The Impale one makes more sense now that I read it again, I must have misunderstood it the first time, but you don't think Pommel/Strike at .9s in Ret would be OP? That's literally faster than the opponent could react to cure.

Aesh

Why do BM's use STR for damage instead of DEX? It really hampers the whole "precision and grace" vibe that the class has. Unless STR also accounts for some "internal strength" to which I would respond with why don't all the classes use STR  to calculate their damage then.

Atalkez

Aerek said:

The Impale one makes more sense now that I read it again, I must have misunderstood it the first time, but you don't think Pommel/Strike at .9s in Ret would be OP? That's literally faster than the opponent could react to cure.

Any more OP than dstab delivering two afflictions at 1.7?

Dunn

Or swiftcurse. 

(Haven't read any leads yet)

Rom

Retardation seems so much less relevant these days. I understand balancing around it for posterity's sake but I can't recall the last time I was in retardation AND someone else was in the room.

Kiet

That's cause only one city really uses it and it's the smallest city, rip

Dunn

I think he means 1v1. It would see a lot more use in raids if it stopped projectiles from passing through that room entirely. I leaded that last cycle and got shot down. 

Kiet

Re-lead it cause that'd be great

Antonius

Ariete said:

Antonius said:

Not sure who is filing dual blunt classleads, but they clearly don't know how the spec is supposed to be played, or what half of its abilities do.

All I've seen are 64, 98, and 138 for DWB, and yea the momentum thing is a little outrageous.

I'm unfamiliar with Recover Footing though.

Increasing maximum momentum to 10 or reducing the cost of Expend to 1 makes Pulp impossible to avoid (and it's hard already), since you no longer require that extra doublewhirl after the leg breaks. That's the entire reason Assault has the 7 momentum requirement, even though it only uses 5 (originally only required 5 too). I have no idea what whoever wrote 64 is doing as dual blunt, but it sounds like they're using flails and possibly don't even know Assault exists.

138 seems odd. Fracture resets the momentum decay timer now so you shouldn't be losing momentum if you're actually using fracture or doublewhirl...

Kellonius

Antonius said:

Not sure who is filing dual blunt classleads, but they clearly don't know how the spec is supposed to be played, or what half of its abilities do.

Its not me this time. 

Jinsun

@Atalkez there's so many reasons why those occie nerf suggestions are bogus, I wish i didn't have a contest limit

Kenway

Jinsun said:

@Atalkez there's so many reasons why those occie nerf suggestions are bogus, I wish i didn't have a contest limit

This is where you explain your opinion with supporting evidence.

Armali

I know as an alchemist, I agree that most of the nerfs feel unwarranted, since I feel with proper defensive play I can handle the aff route, and I've handled Calira, Nylian, Finkle, and Gilt all using it. Half of it is my normal hindering (lethargy and paralysis) and using my active cure aggressively, and the other half is just knowing when to run away. Since I'm a pure momentum class, running away is actually way more damaging to me than if you had a prep route. A lot of the nerfs feel like people just wanting to face tank the class.

Kiet

The nerfs probably come from fighting Seragorn, who is, no offense, on a bit of a different level!

Cynlael

If you legitimately feel like Alchemist is in a good spot, then you probably don't really know what balance is, because Alchemist is really the epitome of 'anti-fun' right now, and has been for a while. You also didn't really list absolutely amazing people, Finkle's good and Gilt's getting there, but not really a fair measure by any means.

Armali

I've fought Seragorn too, and I'll attribute my losses to not handling Unnamable properly, and forgetting I was indoors so I couldn't rof out. I haven't had a chance to spar him again, but I would like to. I do have one win against him. I don't make any claims that I'll win, but I understand how the offense progresses and I know what I need to do to stop it at certain points and what to look out for. If I lose, it's on me for forgetting to do X, Y, Z, not because it's so absolutely unbearable that I need to ask for nerfs to it.

Atalkez

Still waiting on facts to back up the opinions.

Anecdotal evidence isn't gonna cut it. Explain why the logic is unsound, not why you disagree with it.

Ahmet

I can't tell if 110 is troll or not u.u

Ahmet

Same goes for 48.

Amranu

Just going to pop in here for a sec.

Seragorn is not magically better than Atalkez. Let's not dismiss classleads based on perceptions that can't be judged objectively.

Kiet

No one said Sera was better than Atalkez! The point is that classes don't always show off why they're broken except at the top tier. I don't really have an opinion on occy, though, tbh.

Kenway

Report #144

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Submitted by: Anonymous      Status      : Submitted

Skill       : Miscellaneous  Ability     : Room hindrance

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Problem:

Momentum classes -need- room hindrance. Room hindrance's strength can often make them somewhat 

ludicrous to fight against even though their skillset makes perfect sense. We've tried increasing 

hinder proc chance with level of momentum but we haven't tried the other way round.

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Solution #1:

make each proc of room hinder lower the chance of procing consecutively. Reset the chance when the 

target leaves the room and also after a short period say, 15s?

Solution #2:

Solution #3:

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Sobriquet

Cynlael said:

If you legitimately feel like Alchemist is in a good spot, then you probably don't really know what balance is, because Alchemist is really the epitome of 'anti-fun' right now, and has been for a while. You also didn't really list absolutely amazing people, Finkle's good and Gilt's getting there, but not really a fair measure by any means.

@Finkle is an extremely good occie.

Kenway

Oh and I mentioned this one earlier.

Report #135

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Submitted by: Anonymous      Status      : Submitted

Skill       : Artefacts      Ability     : Bastardswords

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Problem:

I'm gonna keep it real real simple. 2h flat out doesn't need their artefacts to increase in damage 

with level. Speed increasing alone makes the artie weapons completely worth the investment. Accuracy 

would be great to have as well especially for hammer. I understand the arguments that it's supposed 

to be a relatively straight forward class but it does a ton of damage as is and really even just a 

single level jump in speed is very noticeable when it comes to stacking.

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Solution #1:

remove damage increases between 2h weapon levels. IE 197/174/131, 197/182/136, etc for bastards

Solution #2:

maintain the damage differences but make hew/pulverise/carve/splinter static values that aren't 

effected by the damage increases. This way limb prep benefits remain without the current problems

Solution #3:

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