Howdy, Stranger!
Categories
- 6.2K All Categories
- 3.1K Everything Achaea
- 1.5K North of Thera
- 26 Archives of the Terraformer
- 257 The Matsuhama Arena
- 885 The Golden Dais of Creation
- 299 The Scarlattan Theatre
- 149 The Blank Canvas
- 2K Getting Help
- 412 General Questions
- 258 Quick Class Questions
- 1.3K Tech Support
- 313 Client Help
- 486 Curing Systems and Scripts
- 841 Off-Topic
- 255 The Wander Inn
- 586 The Universal Membrane
- 298 Class Discussions
- 298 Individual Class Sections
- 20 Alchemist
- 9 Apostate
- 30 Blademaster
- 9 Depthswalker
- 14 Druid
- 4 Infernal
- 20 Jester
- 19 Magi
- 34 Monk
- 11 Occultist
- 8 Paladin
- 7 Priest
- 29 Runewarden
- 18 Sentinel
- 26 Serpent
- 20 Shaman
- 9 Sylvan
Comments
This thread makes me wonder, should (or is?) prepping being phased out of Achaean combat? Should you have to slug it out with someone in the same room for an extended amount of time to have a chance at winning?
But I think the biggest thing here is that Shaman afflicting speed/ability will be hindered by using a spirit binding for room hindrance, reducing their ability to out afflict their opponents.
Right now the bindings I take are almost entirely offensive, and using room hinder of some kind (whether it be similar to pinshot or something that's not quite room hinder - like an engage that drains mana on exit instead of health, which is a possibility I've suggested that no one's even both to consider) it would require me to lose the binding that allows me to relapse afflictions 2.5 seconds later once every 25 seconds, or the binding that allows me to destroy a vodun doll to do a balanceless imbibe to finish the lock.
Losing the first greatly reduces the speed at which I can gain momentum in the first place, losing the second reduces my ability to simply lock someone outright, especially if they have fitness or an equivalent.
Honestly, that's why this should even be considered - the modular structure of Spiritlore allows the addition of these kind of abilities to the class without being broken.
Plus I think you're quick to discount paralyze as hindrance. I know it's not technically "passive", but it's still a big deal when it's being paired with all of your other afflictions.
In my (inexperienced with combat) opinion, your class is in better condition than any other momentum class, (that's considering Jester to be prep). Apostate is literally ruined by stepping out of the room once it happens, and overusing curseward. If they decide to go for a vivisect, then shield.
I'll also mention the same as everyone else: Vodun is extremely strong. I, as a Jester, don't have any issue gaining fashions on serpents, and my hindrance does nothing to them at first.
But then again my combat skills are no skills, so take what you will from me.
Use vodun to keep them in room, now you don't need to worry about erupting swift curse you could mangle/cripple/curse the heck out of someone without them being able to leave beyond tumble - same for Jesters. Yes we have banana etc, however you have 1 second afflictions of everything you need (2 seconds on imbibe for one) for a lock, everything you need for a non-focusable tzantza (you can give the basic afflictions without having to use a herb that requires focusing) and you can even do some crazy bleed/damage tactics.
Use blight with your curses, focus on the vodun side of things (like jester) with your amazing affliction abilities (see blighted vardrax for some ideas).
Sure, you can't keep me in room with you if I don't want you to, but then nor can a priest/apostate/jester/knight/mage etc. Do they have room hinderance? Yes.
Do they have both slow-prep and burst capability? No, by that I mean if I leave the room and you have fashions, you've lost nothing in fact you have gained some strategy from it if you are diverse. You can be as cheap as a jester with a much quicker finish, or as devastating as an EQgem occultist with some quick afflictions into yet again, another quick finish.
tl/dr shaman doesn't need room hinderance outside what they have available (icewalls or even bracers of frost if it's that big a deal - which it isn't)
[ SnB PvP Guide | Link ]
Why do they need room hindrance again?
- Limb Counter - Fracture Relapsing -
"Honestly, I just love that it counts limbs." - Mizik Corten
Album of Bluef during her time in Achaea
Can consider.
With the recent change to mangle, Shaman have no hope in hell of keeping people in place for a kill sequence outside of sheer stupidity. Please give us something for the love of god.
Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
Force apply head, vodun cripple, force restore?
Mangle leg, mangle leg, mangle arm, mangle arm, breach (assuming a curseward here) into lock afflictions with addiction to stop outr and with para to stop running after they stand, about the same time as the first resto on arm finishes. Assuming you've already stuck slickness, they can't mending and they'll be locked.
Vodun cripple, mangle leg, mangle leg, strip speed, aeon into lock affs.
Was this a big nerf? Yes. Does it make it impossible for you to do stuff? No.
You just have to work harder for it now. The previous incarnation was entirely too hard to live through with any realistic chance of success.
You're also acting like Force/AoE/Aeon/Binding is all useless. Vodun is still the strongest skillset in the game, imo.
Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
Won't work. Lemme theorycraft you this. I'll even add a force restore for kicks.
0 force restore
2 mangle leg
4 mangle leg, apply first leg
6 mangle arm
8 mangle arm, first leg cured, apply second leg
10 curse breach
11 curse something, insta cured
12 curse something, not stuck yet, also second leg resto cured, first leg mending cured
13 curse something, stuck, second leg mending cure, stand, run
It gets even better if they curseward immediately following the breach, because they've had 10 seconds to recover eq from a breach before this combo.
If mangle needs slight alterations because of the nerf (which is possible), the logical thing to ask for would be those. It still exists; thus, shaman does not need something else entirely to hold people down.
Mangle could maybe use a slight balance cost reduction or the ability to prone + mangle leg at the same time, to put it more on par with other limb breakers, since it only does half of what it used to.
Force apply head before that string and they can't curseward until near the end because off EQ from the resto after restore. I've never played Shaman so I don't know 100% of how everything works, but I feel like you're overreacting to the change when there are still -lots- of options available. If the balance needs reduced I'm sure Mak daddy will get to it.
Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
I guess I don't really fully appreciate the implications, but it's always seemed like such a random, legacy ability. Survival doesn't give you the ability to ignore the first affliction of a bard or a serpent or an alchemist or any other affliction class in the same way. Why do curses and evileye have this general defense that nothing else does? And if we want them to have such a defence against curses...why isn't it just shield like for every other class (and no truecurse/truestare), so the defence has the normal shield restrictions (breaks on offensive actions for instance)?
I've never really understood why curseward exists. Can anyone enlighten me?
@amranu is right about single restoration apply is not sufficient for most strategies.
Even with the previous level 3 breaks with mangles, riftlock requires almost a quad.
Breaking a limb for a 4s salve-off in attempt to lock is insufficient for any lock to be cursed, previously we will use that 2 salves and most likely lock AFTER the 2nd salve apply for 4s of 4 curses.
Mangling takes 2.3s with nimble, healing up and stand is only 4s. The window is 1.7s per mangle, which is not even 2 curses (at least DSL/dstab gets 2 afflictions in that 1.7s window, we can only get ONE in).
Seriously, folks do not realize 2 afflictions every 2s is FAR better than one affliction every 1s, which makes a lot of difference, as one of the afflictions gets to stick 1s longer. IE curare/xentio, target cures curare, xentio is effective the entire 2s. While curse paralyse, curse clumsy, clumsy is there AFTER 1s, not from the beginning. And clumsy has an intended effect against physical classes. But this is not an issue, as this is Shaman's uniqueness.
@xinna Agree it's a great idea for mangling to use a quicker balance, or mangling leg prones, both works!
That said, even when you are prone, and you know a lock is coming, just curseward my friend. It will save your life, and prio salve on your arms (avoid riftlock), not legs (tell me I am wrong?), cos you can be prone in front of a Shaman and still curseward at the right time to stop lock, why run. I think curseward should not be usable while prone!
I am really curious and excited about what's in the store for Shamans!
Too easy to prone as Shaman for it to not be usable while prone.
Maybe if you have 1 or 2 broken arms you can't?
Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.