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How to Become a Top Tier Combatant

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  • AtalkezAtalkez Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 5,218 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Mizik said:
    Atalkez said:
    Yes but if you fly on head/torso I can leap to break legs+prone but no arms so no salve difference. If I break arms, your still flying and I land. Either way you negate the setup for bstar because you throw the timing off. Opens up other options though
    Can do arms first, which prevent movement in flight.

    Arms / fly
    High leap / centre
    Legs/prone
    Land/impale
    Didn't know arms stops flight movement!
    Thanks bro


    You hug Aurora compassionately.
    NimValaria
  • AerekAerek East Tennessee, USAMember Posts: 1,818 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Fuck me. Going BM.
    -- Grounded in but one perspective, what we perceive is an exaggeration of the truth.
    MelodieEldAradorWessux
  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Makarios said:
    Bedevil does cure all (actively cureable) afflictions. This may or not be a bug (hard to say what the original intention was with such an old ability), but it is the case at the moment. It does not transfer all afflictions, however.

    Would gladly trade a Bedevil nerf (make it randomly cure/transfer, not a cureall) in exchange for making it not so incredibly easy to completely prevent, via force.

  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,270 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited November 2014
    Heh....

    Are you implying active bedevil is prevented via passive bedeviling being forced? The last time I tested, it isn't. Only active Healing is.
    Terra
  • TerraTerra Member Posts: 676 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited November 2014
    Bedevil is definitely not prevented by passive bedevil. Heh. Please just test things before you argue, @Ernam. Please.
    Kuy
  • MakariosMakarios Administrator Posts: 1,917 Achaean staff
    Active bedevil is prevented by passive bedevil.
    JovoloTerra
  • MelodieMelodie Port Saint Lucie, FloridaMember Posts: 5,147 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    That must be recent!
    And I love too                                                                          Be still, my indelible friend
    That love soon might end                                                         You are unbreaking
    And be known in its aching                                                      Though quaking
    Shown in this shaking                                                             Though crazy
    Lately of my wasteland, baby                                                 That's just wasteland, baby
  • TerraTerra Member Posts: 676 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    I stand corrected. It didn't used to stop it. Weird.
  • MizikMizik Member Posts: 2,170 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Atalkez said:
    Mizik said:
    Atalkez said:
    Yes but if you fly on head/torso I can leap to break legs+prone but no arms so no salve difference. If I break arms, your still flying and I land. Either way you negate the setup for bstar because you throw the timing off. Opens up other options though
    Can do arms first, which prevent movement in flight.

    Arms / fly
    High leap / centre
    Legs/prone
    Land/impale
    Didn't know arms stops flight movement!
    Thanks bro
    They'll shield after that first arm. 
    image
    Atalkez
  • MizikMizik Member Posts: 2,170 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    So Icefist
    image
    Atalkez
  • AradorArador Member Posts: 1,696 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I find it weird that the off slash does not reset limb damage timer. So how does the timer work exactly if you only used off slashes to prep a particular limb?

  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean

    lol good point
  • WessuxWessux ChattanoogaMember Posts: 517 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Terra said:
    Bedevil is definitely not prevented by passive bedevil. Heh. Please just test things before you argue, @Ernam. Please.
    Telling people to "test things before your argue" is always a pretty jerkish way to respond to comments you don't agree with. You aren't the master of combat, yourself.

    Don't automatically assume people haven't tested something if you haven't tested it recently. 

    This was totally unnecessary, but it felt soooooo good. But just how you get annoyed with Ernam's post I get annoyed with Adama's. Same knee jerk reaction of either being an ass, sarcastic, or just condescending.

    Sidenote: Not saying I'm an Ernam fan (definitely not) but it was a prime example. 
    Invest in a 9mm retirement plan.
  • TerraTerra Member Posts: 676 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean

    Except I only said it after, on numerous occasions, Ernam posted that things worked a particular way and he was sure of it, without testing, when in fact they did not work that way. Heh.

    Yes, I screwed up and failed to retest something -once-. I wrongly assumed that since he was wrong about everything else he had argued with us about, he was wrong about this too (since it, like the other things, at least -used- to work the way I said).

    I don't think it is jerkish to ask that people get their facts straight before posting angry things to others ("you know damn well bedevil doesn't fullheal!"). This applies to me, as well, yes, and that is why I retracted my previous post by saying "I stand corrected."

    You, @Wessux, on the other hand, are an arrogant ass.

    Atalkez
  • AtalkezAtalkez Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 5,218 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Catfight


    You hug Aurora compassionately.
    TerraWessuxAustere
  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014

    There's a reason I've stated repeatedly that once Bedevil is forced (which is unstoppable) Priest has one of the worst, if not the worst healing in the game.  Once passive bedevil is forced, Priests don't have a single active healing ability, aside from angel sacrifice which completely ends offensive combat.

    I think forced bedevil is supposed to be balancing, but it's incredibly OP for classes that can force, but doesn't do anything for classes that can't.


    @Wessux

    I think that there's a lot of ignorance regarding Priest healing abilities in general, floating around.  Most people don't seem to be aware of the pretty massive nerfs to Healing, or understand that priests passive healing abilities (which don't stack) are some of the worst passives in the game.  They proc randomly, which is bad, and can have proc intervals up to 45-50 seconds (angel care), have huge costs (both Devo and angel power), and various other limitations.  Dagaz used to be the worst passive in the game, but recently was upgraded.  I'd very objectively place Priest in the running for worst passive curing in the game (other than none at all, obviously - but classes with none usually have amazing active healing abilities or really effective offensive hindrance).

    Active Bedevil is really good but easily stopped (as is everything in Healing) by pretty much every affliction that stops anything (including requiring both arms).  It also has a massive eq cost and a very long cooldown.  It's basically only good if you're already completely locked, but before you get proned/eptethed/slept/etc, and only if your active Bedevil is on cooldown.

    Healing was given an equally massive (4 second) eq cost and a cooldown, which makes it virtually never the right ability to use, unlike literally every other active cure in the game, which have 1.5-2 second balances (fitness, salt, alleviate, bloodboil, fool, etc) - many of which don't even have cooldowns.  Unlike Fitness, for example, it's almost never better to use Heal Asthma (4 seconds) instead of just using angel aura (1.3 seconds) 2-3 times for the same eq cost.

    Also, unlike every other active cure in the game (-fitness), Healing shows what you cure to everyone in the room, making it arguably the worst active cure in the game.

    As an active priest combatant, I can say that I very, very rarely ever use Healing, purely because of its massive EQ cost, and because most of the time I have Bedevil forced and have worse active/passive healing than a bard.  The only ability in Healing I ever do use is active Bedevil (against classes who can't force commands), but this has a massive cooldown, and pretty much obliterates offensive momentum (which is fine).


    Like most classes, people assume things they don't understand are OP - which is a big part of why I finally went Priest in the first place.  Personally, I will admit that I thought priest healing was OP, until two things happened:  1) it got massively, repeatedly nerfed  2) I learned how the abilities actually work, and how easy it is to prevent them.


    Jeslyn
  • MishgulMishgul ROTHERHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMember Posts: 5,378 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Your paragraph structure is awful, your consistency with words and names is non existent and you don't seem to have a good grasp on how arguing works.

    -

    One of the symptoms of an approaching nervous breakdown is the belief that one's work is terribly important

    As drawn by Shayde
    hic locus est ubi mors gaudet succurrere vitae
    Kuy
  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,270 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Healing doesn't cost eq? It just requires it. Can you not heal;angel aura?
    Terra
  • JacenJacen Member Posts: 2,307 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Terra said:

    Except I only said it after, on numerous occasions, Ernam posted that things worked a particular way and he was sure of it, without testing, when in fact they did not work that way. Heh.

    Yes, I screwed up and failed to retest something -once-. I wrongly assumed that since he was wrong about everything else he had argued with us about, he was wrong about this too (since it, like the other things, at least -used- to work the way I said).

    I don't think it is jerkish to ask that people get their facts straight before posting angry things to others ("you know damn well bedevil doesn't fullheal!"). This applies to me, as well, yes, and that is why I retracted my previous post by saying "I stand corrected."

    You, @Wessux, on the other hand, are an arrogant ass.

    This thread would hint that the if passive-can't active bedevil has been that way for a long time. Not that you couldn't still be correct, but it looks like its been working this way for four months now, well within the timeframe that you've kicked ass with a priest alt.
    image
  • JeslynJeslyn United StatesMember Posts: 482 @ - Epic Achaean
    Jovolo said:
    Healing doesn't cost eq? It just requires it. Can you not heal;angel aura?
    I think he means that it costs about 4 seconds of elemental energy. There are only a few healing skills that don't require it such as healing blindness and deafness. So yes, you could use healing and angel aura.

    You call upon the powers of Fire and project your healing through your Spirit channel.
    You bid your guardian angel to raise an aura to shield you.
    You may channel elemental energy once again. (4.117s)
    You have recovered equilibrium. (3.915s)
  • TerraTerra Member Posts: 676 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014
    Jacen said:
    Terra said:

    Except I only said it after, on numerous occasions, Ernam posted that things worked a particular way and he was sure of it, without testing, when in fact they did not work that way. Heh.

    Yes, I screwed up and failed to retest something -once-. I wrongly assumed that since he was wrong about everything else he had argued with us about, he was wrong about this too (since it, like the other things, at least -used- to work the way I said).

    I don't think it is jerkish to ask that people get their facts straight before posting angry things to others ("you know damn well bedevil doesn't fullheal!"). This applies to me, as well, yes, and that is why I retracted my previous post by saying "I stand corrected."

    You, @Wessux, on the other hand, are an arrogant ass.

    This thread would hint that the if passive-can't active bedevil has been that way for a long time. Not that you couldn't still be correct, but it looks like its been working this way for four months now, well within the timeframe that you've kicked ass with a priest alt.


    At the time of that thread, active bedevil was definitely possible while passive bedeviled. The thread was about passive bedevil being forced to stop healing. Active bedevil was nerfed later on (to be stopped by broken arm and paralysis, both of which previously hadn't stopped it) because it was constantly being used to get out of locks and wasn't reasonably stoppable. I am unsure what you are pointing to in that thread, specifically, though, as I did not go back and reread it.

    I did alt as priest long after that, yes, and active bedevil was possible while passive bedevil was up (at least at some point) while I alted!

    Numerous combatants who have played priest have asserted that active bedevil was possible while passive bedevil was up. We aren't all idiots.

    Edit: And @Ernam just did it -again-. (Disclaimer: Unless healing radically changed recently) Healing does not use eq, and doesn't show what you cure to the room, only the element used. Bedevil's eq isn't massive either. Faster than bloodboil iirc. This is what I'm talking about. :(

  • AddamaAddama Member Posts: 947 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Wessux said:

    This was totally unnecessary, but it felt soooooo good. But just how you get annoyed with Ernam's post I get annoyed with Adama's. Same knee jerk reaction of either being an ass, sarcastic, or just condescending.
    Except I wasn't being an ass, sarcastic or condescending.  Nothing I said was false.  I'm not going to repeat my claims or edit them or anything because frankly I think you misread it or something.  I still have no idea why you're coming at me.
    ~Kresslack's obsession~
  • WessuxWessux ChattanoogaMember Posts: 517 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Terra said:

    Except I only said it after, on numerous occasions, Ernam posted that things worked a particular way and he was sure of it, without testing, when in fact they did not work that way. Heh.

    Yes, I screwed up and failed to retest something -once-. I wrongly assumed that since he was wrong about everything else he had argued with us about, he was wrong about this too (since it, like the other things, at least -used- to work the way I said).

    I don't think it is jerkish to ask that people get their facts straight before posting angry things to others ("you know damn well bedevil doesn't fullheal!"). This applies to me, as well, yes, and that is why I retracted my previous post by saying "I stand corrected."

    You, @Wessux, on the other hand, are an arrogant ass.

    I'm really not that arrogant. I ask questions often and never really comment on something unless I've tested, discussed, thought out what I could. @Terra‌ I have an extremely high opinion of you because you usually say things that I'm either thinking/agree with, or I learn something/am inspired to try something new. Don't be a bitch because I got annoyed at one guy's post. 

    @Ernam‌, too long did not read.
    Invest in a 9mm retirement plan.
    BadeTael
  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014

    If active bedevil ever worked with passive bedevil up, it was an obvious bug.  IIRC it was mentioned that you could only use one or the other when it was created and announced.  Don't have the classlead, but it was probably also in it, as well.

    The AB file also specifically states it, and always has, AFAIK.

    If you ever used active bedevil with the passive up, you should have immediately bugged it.

  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    @Terra‌

    Perhaps you should submit a bug report, instead of just assuming everyone who doesn't agree with you is an idiot.

    Bedevil (Healing)                             Known: Yes
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Syntax:            BEDEVIL <adventurer>
                       BEDEVIL
                       
    Extra Information: Channels: Air
                       Earth
                       Fire
                       Spirit
                       Water

    Works on/against:  Adventurers and self
    Details:
    Upon channeling all five elements, you will be able to focus your will upon a hapless victim, and 
    channel your afflictions into him or her by corrupting the spirit channel. Further, as a result of 
    doing this, some of your afflictions may be cured.

    In addition, if no target is specified, you will gain a defence which will cause afflictions dealt 
    against you to potentially strike down your agressor as well.

    Due to the nature of this ability, while you are protected by the defence you will be unable to employ your ability to heal afflictions with your elemental channels.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------



  • TerraTerra Member Posts: 676 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014

    Syntax:        BEDEVIL <adventurer>
                       BEDEVIL
                      
    Extra Information: Channels: Air
                       Earth
                       Fire
                       Spirit
                       Water

    Works on/against:  Adventurers and self
    Details:
    Upon channeling all five elements, you will be able to focus your will upon a hapless victim, and channel your afflictions into him or her by corrupting the spirit channel. Further, as a result of doing this, some of your afflictions may be cured.

    In addition, if no target is specified, you will gain a defence which will cause afflictions dealt against you to potentially strike down your agressor as well.

    Due to the nature of this ability, while you are protected by the defence you will be unable to employ your ability to heal afflictions with your elemental channels.

    -------------------

    It says nothing of the sort. It only says you can't HEAL, which has indeed always been the case.

    But I'm not going to argue about this anymore. Multiple people have said that it used to work the way I described. We all agree it doesn't work that way anymore. I acknowledged that I was wrong about it. Let it rest!

  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014

    It categorically does not say that you (exclusively) can't use HEAL.  It says "you can't employ your ability to heal afflictions with your elemental channels".  Two lines above the thing you are referencing, it clearly states that Bedevil heals afflictions, and a few lines higher it states that it uses elemental channels to do so.


    Wow, I fell for the old "goad into arguing, then edit in a "nevermind, I don't want to argue about this" after I respond.  Should be better at this by now.  :s
  • AradorArador Member Posts: 1,696 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Can Bedevil still cause a lock? If so.. 


    BEDEVIL THREAD

    CooperTaelSyriAlcinae
  • EldEld Member Posts: 3,946 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Arador said:
    I find it weird that the off slash does not reset limb damage timer. So how does the timer work exactly if you only used off slashes to prep a particular limb?
    It doesn't, basically.  Far as I can tell, if you prep a limb with nothing but off side slashes, it will never reset.
    Aerek
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