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Monk Tricks
Monk class has changed quite a lot since I stopped playing six years ago. Rolling this alt has been fun, but I'm getting to the point where "prep legs -> break legs -> bbt -> repeat" doesn't work against most people and I've been forced to get creative.
I discovered today, for example, that WWK and Mind Command could be used on the same balance. It's a four second balance which kind of blows but I'm assuming Roundhouse and a Telepathy affliction can be utilized in the same way.
So what has worked for you? Is Riftlocking even a possibility with Monk? Am I overthinking this class if I'm trying for anything more complicated than "keep prone -> loldamage"?
I discovered today, for example, that WWK and Mind Command could be used on the same balance. It's a four second balance which kind of blows but I'm assuming Roundhouse and a Telepathy affliction can be utilized in the same way.
So what has worked for you? Is Riftlocking even a possibility with Monk? Am I overthinking this class if I'm trying for anything more complicated than "keep prone -> loldamage"?
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note: Some systems may catch the blackout+asthma with a smoke check.
Key strategy: use a throwing axe to stick asthma & slickness (with proficiency and knife thrower perk). You can lead into the double arm break with a double leg break (since they will always cure legs first), giving you enough time to burn through up to 2-3 kelp and still get a riftlock before an arm is cured. As soon as you see them not eat kelp 1.5 seconds after you throw your axe, throw a slickness axe. If the haven't cured their arms before this happens, then voila, they're riftlocked.
I never actually timed it, but with nothing but a nice, fast throwing axe, you should be able to get ~2 second axe throws. Assuming your opponent has 2 kelps outrifted before you start throwing kalmia axes, it's a nearly guaranteed riftlock if you don't screw it up (you also can't miss, since they're prone). If they keep 3 or more kelp outrifted, you can still get them by sneaking addiction (using blackout) or throwing in a torso break (can be done with the actual axe throws, or before the leg break, etc.) Either they'll prio the torso over arms, buying you an additional 3 seconds, or they won't, which gives you 2 level 1 torso break BBTs, which will kill pretty much anyone who isn't a necromancer or Jhui-artied.
The setup would look like this:
prep arms, legs [, torso/torso]
[sneak torso break if they aren't smart or have SLC]
Blackout *[optional]
vardrax axe *[optional]
SWK/HFP/HFP (double leg break)
Kalmia axe to torso/SPP/SPP (double arm break, torso break with axe) [can break head with axe instead, if you snuck the torso break]
If they cured addiction (likely) then just repeat kalmia axes until they don't eat kelp after 1.5 seconds, then slickness axe.
If they didn't cure addiction, then just kalmia axe twice, then slickness axe.
[now they're riftlocked]
Keep in mind, passive curing makes the addiction strategy virtually impossible, as well as pretty much any other form of affliction strategy for monk. Similarly, (obviously), you can't riftlock anyone with fitness, or dragons, provided they aren't completely retarded.
It cures deafness, can target any limb you like, is far more accurate, and is much faster. Pretty much better in every possible way, except that it doesn't do much as much damage (which honestly doesn't really matter 99% of the time).
Also see: Prefarar arrow : mind command tumble
Going for the triple play.
First of all, monk doesn't do "lol damage". Even with level 3 knuckles and 21 str, my monk doesn't kill most midbie or higher players provided they cure/avoid correctly. Tekura/strength has been nerfed so many times in the few years that monk has finally began to require some somewhat complicated strategy to kill people (which is good) while still revolving around damage as a primary kill method.
The first thing you should focus on are torso breaks. Without a torso break, you're not going to kill pretty much anyone. It's a complex subject, but it boils down to: "How can I get a few BBTs in before they cure torso?" (which often boils down to: "How can I sneak a torso break?".
Also, if you're wondering about AXK... don't bother. It's 100% useless.
This literally never happened.
Kross proved that it was possible to kill people with AXK (which I never disagreed with). My counter-point was and is that in every example he provided, BBT would have also worked, and it would work 2-4 seconds faster. Thus, AXK is 100% pointless, unless you are in a duel where you pinky-swear to not use BBT for some dumbfuck reason.
@Aegoth, care to tap into that vast amount of experience with monk combat that you have (or quote someone else's) to explain to us, using actual math, a single example of AXK killing someone faster that BBTs would, or killing someone when BBT wouldn't kill them?
Spoiler alert:
The only time AXK would ever kill anyone when BBT wouldn't is in team-ganks with multiple monks, due to the BBT timer. However, even in that example, it's incredibly unlikely (as in, I've never seen it a single time, ever) that in team combat, you'd ever have 4-5 limbs simultaneously broken on a target, which is what is required to make AXK relevant, at all (as in, better than a kai choke or bashing combo).
- Limb Counter - Fracture Relapsing -
"Honestly, I just love that it counts limbs." - Mizik Corten
Riftlocking just doesn't seem viable, or if it is viable, it would only work once (it's not hard to keep 10 kelp in your inventory). A similar amount of prepwork would make AXK viable, not only from a damage angle but for the potential to land a head cripple.
Something like that? And hope they cure paralysis before addiction?
E: Time-wise, it would work if I only had to throw everything once or maybe kalmia twice, but it's a really small window considering I can only stack edibles and my balance is like 2.5 seconds.
E2: Can focus cure addiction? I'm not sure if that's physical or mental.
With the amount of prepwork you're doing, you might as well just break their legs, then break torso/arms while they're prone, and BBT. Maybe switch in pref axe/arm/arm/mind command to stop a tumble attempt.
An idea I'm toying with in my mind is to SWK leg break, then break torso/arms (with a targeted axe throw to torso, with epseth another salve balance and keep their legs down longer). The idea is to keep them down as long as possible.
Random questions - will epteth stop parrying? And will epteth/epseth stack with a break?
Quite frankly, the only way a riftlock would work if they had no ginseng/kelp outrifted. There's no way for addiction to stick unless you ran them out of ginseng first, since herb balance is faster than axe balance. An additional note is that venoms from thrown axes aren't hidden in blackout, so you can't rely on that either. As such, riftlocks from Monks are fairly 'gimmicky' in the sense that they rely on the opponent not preparing adequately by not precaching herbs.
With that prep work, there are a number of far more reliable, and stronger tactics available to you than an attempted riftlock. However, if you prepare accordingly, you certainly get style points for it and everyone knows that style >> killis
EDIT: that's somewhat dependent on how fast you can throw also.
This was already "fixed". (addiction consumes trans/conc cures, simultaneously)
Monks can riftlock, refer to my first post for explanation. It's also extremely easy to get 1.3-ish second venom jab/throws. (@Bukariin)
_________
No, it is not (ever*).
*unless you are Jhui**
** if you have eq gem and staff of nicator
How is a quad break of head/torso/legs not equivalent to that? They still can't use telepathy, and you get enfeeble and 2+ torso break BBTs, which does significantly more damage than a 5 limb AXK (almost twice as much).
Numb would -easily- stop AXK, since it has a 6+ second balance. BBT is way better vs a monk, for this reason, as far as I'm concerned.
That does bring me to one point that someone mentioned. AXK is actually useful to have for people who go pure Int monk, which results in super low strength. I don't really count this, since that build is more or less pointless for anything other than spamming kai-choke, though.
Target fully prepped:
Break arms(0sec) -> Break torso/head (2.5s) -> (chasing torso restore)Break legs (5.1s) -> AXK (7.6s) -> AXK (13.6s)
Restore arm(0sec) -> Mend arm (4s) -> Restore torso(5s) -> Mend torso(9s) -> Restore leg(10s) -> Mend leg(14s) -> Restore leg(15s) -> Mend leg/Stand(19s)
So that's two AXK combos, and you can almost shove three in. Anyway you get to land that first AXK while torso, one arm, both legs and head are broken, so that's five breaks, and the second one should land before the first leg mends, which is four, and you get a head mangle, unless they do something dumb like heal head first and then you get to shove in an extra AXK or BBT.
I'm not saying it's better than BBT, but it's more viable than you make it out to be.
Though to be fair under the same assumptions you can squeeze three BBTs in, one of them with the torso break.