The Elemental (and Yggdrasil) Retrospective!

Minifie

Asmodron said:

Kiet said:

People are allowed to both like Mhaldor and be frustrated with the things being Mhaldorian entails sometimes, you know. That doesn't mean they should quit or should've complained harder, lol--that's an attitude that kind of makes it clear you've never played a Mhaldorian seriously yet you're trying to tell a current Mhaldorian how to.

No one in Mhaldor hasn't had a moment where they're frustrated like Elisella at something being Evil cost us. It's a pretty valid reaction, even if ICly of course it should be difficult for us to advance in water. Sometimes people just wanna vent a bit.

As it is, it'll take a while to get Water Lord as a Mhaldorian, yeah. You can switch to another element or you can just take it as a marathon rather than a sprint. It'll be a really cool accomplishment to be a Mhaldorian Water Lord, for both RP and the mechanical side of sticking to it.

Also amused that after the fact everyone 'always knew' what we were doing.

Difference between frustrated/upset with something...and complaining that mhaldor has been screwed and the admin should drop the 'bullshit malus', even though their actions brought them there. That screams of entitlement.

The suggestion to quit is simple: If you feel so strongly in support of water and against what Mhaldor did..then why sit there and tantrum? Either take charge or accept it.

And yes...had you been (or recalled) at the second meeting of the cities, it was stated that Mhaldor is attempting to bind the conduit by will. There were also several hints thay clearly suggested Mhaldor was up to something. Most in Hashan were made aware of this early on as well.

It only screams of entitlement if your comprehension skills are sub par. 

Asmodron

Kiet said:

It's common to have a conflict between 'this makes RP sense' and 'this makes the game less fun.' Mhaldor has to juggle this a lot, obviously, and people have different limits for what's acceptable. People that only play in cities with literally no restrictions at all aren't likely to fully grasp that, and that's fine. But try to be a bit more empathetic given that fact.

I'll tell you that, even now, most people don't know what we did or were doing. I was at the meeting, and if you think being there at all filled you in on it you're deluded.

So Farrah literally claiming by her source that mhaldor was attempting to bind the conduit?

The fact Mhaldor was collecting water cores yet never placing them in any emissary amphora?

The several mysterious deaths seen by mhaldorian players to the sorceress during the crisis?

This was all clearly delusion? Well damn...

Kiet

At least one of those (possibly 2) aren't even related to what we were doing, lol.

It's obvious we were doing something with the water conduit, we said as much. What we were doing and what it involved is something most people don't even know now, much less back then.

I know you're like the spy guy for Hashan, but that doesn't mean the information you gather is flawless. I've seen some of the reports you've made and you have a lot of false premises. That's not a knock against you, really, how are you supposed to know this shit without metagaming or spending an inordinate amount of time on it? But it's good to recognize that you might not know everything about a city you're not even in that's sometimes secretive even with its own citizens.

I don't claim to know who is or isn't in Twilight's Order, for instance, because how tf would I know that beyond hints I pick up. If I show up and try to explain to Kasa that I know what Twilight's been doing all this time I'll look like a jackass.

Asmodron

Kiet said:

At least one of those (possibly 2) aren't even related to what we were doing, lol.

It's obvious we were doing something with the water conduit, we said as much. What we were doing and what it involved is something most people don't even know now, much less back then.

You're missing the point entirely. You stated no player could have known what was happening, suggesting that only a select few did. This was in reply to mhaldorian players not even being in the loop. I replied that it was clear something was going on and it was involving the conduit, meaning if even outsiders clearly noticed, then citizen sshould definitely have and ignorance is no excuse to it.

Again I will state, you're not forced to accept anything. No one is forcing you to play the game they want. If you don't like something, there are other avenues, always. Tantruming solves nothing.

Keorin

Venting and frustration are pretty reasonable reactions, with all of this. Waiting for quests to come back for days when you're wanting to play with something new and watching other people get there is always gonna be pretty frustrating. 

Roleplay should have consequences, but that doesn't mean those consequences are always fun to have to deal with, in the moment. 

Minifie

Asmodron said:

Kiet said:

At least one of those (possibly 2) aren't even related to what we were doing, lol.

It's obvious we were doing something with the water conduit, we said as much. What we were doing and what it involved is something most people don't even know now, much less back then.

You're missing the point entirely. You stated no player could have known what was happening, suggesting that only a select few did. This was in reply to mhaldorian players not even being in the loop. I replied that it was clear something was going on and it was involving the conduit, meaning if even outsiders clearly noticed, then citizen sshould definitely have and ignorance is no excuse to it.

Again I will state, you're not forced to accept anything. No one is forcing you to play the game they want. If you don't like something, there are other avenues, always. Tantruming solves nothing.

Apparently feedback = tantruming. You really are out of the loop here, and should probably just step away before it becomes funny AND sad.

Kiet

Asmodron said:

Kiet said:

At least one of those (possibly 2) aren't even related to what we were doing, lol.

It's obvious we were doing something with the water conduit, we said as much. What we were doing and what it involved is something most people don't even know now, much less back then.

You're missing the point entirely. You stated no player could have known what was happening, suggesting that only a select few did. This was in reply to mhaldorian players not even being in the loop. I replied that it was clear something was going on and it was involving the conduit, meaning if even outsiders clearly noticed, then citizen sshould definitely have and ignorance is no excuse to it.

Again I will state, you're not forced to accept anything. No one is forcing you to play the game they want. If you don't like something, there are other avenues, always. Tantruming solves nothing.

Random slaves(and even Troni) had a good chance of missing what all we were doing, or not realizing we'd piss off water this much. It's absurd 'hindsight is 20/20' thinking that makes you think otherwise. "Quit the city or complain louder" is not a helpful suggestion nor something that's realistic to people who actually roleplay some kind of faction loyalty.

Your words sound a bit hollow when you play in an unaligned city and won't even join a real order that'd impose actual limitations on you, though. I don't mean that as a dig, but how can you possibly relate to Elisella's position where she's put into a conflict of what's fun vs what's consistent rp?

Minifie

Kiet said:

Asmodron said:

Kiet said:

At least one of those (possibly 2) aren't even related to what we were doing, lol.

It's obvious we were doing something with the water conduit, we said as much. What we were doing and what it involved is something most people don't even know now, much less back then.

You're missing the point entirely. You stated no player could have known what was happening, suggesting that only a select few did. This was in reply to mhaldorian players not even being in the loop. I replied that it was clear something was going on and it was involving the conduit, meaning if even outsiders clearly noticed, then citizen sshould definitely have and ignorance is no excuse to it.

Again I will state, you're not forced to accept anything. No one is forcing you to play the game they want. If you don't like something, there are other avenues, always. Tantruming solves nothing.

Random slaves(and even Troni) had a good chance of missing what all we were doing, or not realizing we'd piss off water this much. It's absurd 'hindsight is 20/20' thinking that makes you think otherwise. "Quit the city or complain louder" is not a helpful suggestion nor something that's realistic to people who actually roleplay some kind of faction loyalty.

Your words sound a bit hollow when you play in an unaligned city and won't even join a real order that'd impose actual limitations on you, though. I don't mean that as a dig, but how can you possibly relate to Elisella's position where she's put into a conflict of what's fun vs what's consistent rp?

I worked beside Alrena for it, and even I didn't know that much about it. She (and any she had to directly report all info to) kept it VERY tight under wraps. For you to find out what actually went on means one of those few people spilled, you ARE on of those few people, or you are guessing from forum and post-fact information. 

Solnir

Rants is a few rows down guys.

Aralaya

The real problem, is that I'm not an immortal murder God when I'm in elemental form.

#PlsBuff

Asmodron

The fact you are attempting to force the idea that "no. You never knew" even when clearly people were made aware something is going on..baffles me. You resort to insults rather than simply see the obvious that people were aware something was happening. You claim our information was "incorrect" yet what happened was pretty damn close to what was suggested in reports concering what Mhaldor was attempting.

It honestly feels pointless to even to try and make you see reason. You lept to defend and insult without even considering the points, with replies of It was literally all 'lol. No. You're sad' and 'lol. No you're wrong'.

I'll end it with the exact same point I've been reiterating from the start: You're not forced to play the game by the restrictions of others or your org. If you're not happy, then seek alternative routes. Complaining about merely for the sake of it does nothing. Otherwise you choose to accept those restrictions and must abide by them

Kiet

Asmodron said:

The fact you are attempting to force the idea that "no. You never knew" even when clearly people were made aware something is going on..baffles me. You resort to insults rather than simply see the obvious that people were aware something was happening. You claim our information was "incorrect" yet what happened was pretty damn close to what was suggested in reports concering what Mhaldor was attempting.

It honestly feels pointless to even to try and make you see reason. You lept to defend and insult without even considering the points, with replies of It was literally all 'lol. No. You're sad' and 'lol. No you're wrong'.

I'll end it with the exact same point I've been reiterating from the start: You're not forced to play the game by the restrictions of others or your org. If you're not happy, then seek alternative routes. Complaining about merely for the sake of it does nothing. Otherwise you choose to accept those restrictions and must abide by them

Literally everyone was aware something was happening, yes. That doesn't mean a slave/troni knew the extent of it or how much it'd piss off water. Hence, your suggestion of "they should've complained more" is ludicrous. I've stated this point repeatedly but you seem to think I'm saying you knew nothing at all.

Synbios

Milabar said:

Torinn said:

Can fire Lords turn into the sun?

No

@Torinn @Milabar


Syntax:
MANIFEST INCANDESCENCE

Extra Information:
Requires maximum spark.
Clears all spark on use.

Works on/against:
Adventurers

Details:
By becoming a conduet for Kkractle's power, you may surround yourself in
the terrible incandescence of the Primal Fire, immediately slaying any
that dare look upon your brilliance(*) providing they be sufficiently
vulnerable(**). If your aggressor is not vulnerable enough to be slain,
they will be transfixed instead.

You may not perform any actions while incandescent, though you may
during the short windup period for said incandescence to manifest.
Note that on successfully using this ability all of your spark will be
wiped and you will become unable to become incandescent again for three
minutes, unless upon the Elemental Plane of Fire.

* For the purposes of this, it is anyone that performs a hostile act
against your person.
** Below 25% of their maximum health.

No, but you can still be 

Minifie

Asmodron said:

The fact you are attempting to force the idea that "no. You never knew" even when clearly people were made aware something is going on..baffles me. You resort to insults rather than simply see the obvious that people were aware something was happening. You claim our information was "incorrect" yet what happened was pretty damn close to what was suggested in reports concering what Mhaldor was attempting.

It honestly feels pointless to even to try and make you see reason. You lept to defend and insult without even considering the points, with replies of It was literally all 'lol. No. You're sad' and 'lol. No you're wrong'.

I'll end it with the exact same point I've been reiterating from the start: You're not forced to play the game by the restrictions of others or your org. If you're not happy, then seek alternative routes. Complaining about merely for the sake of it does nothing. Otherwise you choose to accept those restrictions and must abide by them

I'm not sure what you are hoping to achieve here? Is it to flaunt that, after the fact, you totally knew what was going on and all the repercussions that would come, or that because orgs act differently we shouldn't be able to complain OOC when things are frustrating as a player? Elisella has not, IC, bitched or whinged about what happened at all, she came to the forums to voice that whatever the malus currently is, it seems incredibly unfair. She does have other options, but bringing feedback is not "tantruming", even if it is worded in a way that comes across frustrated and upset. Devs will take it and apply it or not change it, that's fine, but stop pretending like you knew all this and "ha ha totally should have done something to stop it" hindsight.

Mhaldor made a decision, we are living by it, but we can voice a few frustrations along the way, as can any other city if they feel so inclined as well. 

Nazihk

Kiet said:

how can you possibly relate to Elisella's position where she's put into a conflict of what's fun vs what's consistent rp?

Everybody in Hashan knows what it's like to have to choose between having fun and RPing a Hashanite.

Minifie

Nazihk said:

Kiet said:

how can you possibly relate to Elisella's position where she's put into a conflict of what's fun vs what's consistent rp?

Everybody in Hashan knows what it's like to have to choose between having fun and RPing a Hashanite.

Elisella

If the shoe was on the other foot and somehow Water was more conducive to Mhaldor/Evil because of the ritual affecting the element, there'd be no end of complaining. That's not how it happened, so here we are.

IC-ly, Eli's frustrated but still trying to make it work. She was proud of being able to do something for the conduit, had no idea what was going on beyond "Hunt watery things", and is now torn between "take the easy way out and do something else" or "stick with it even as the heathens that she patiently explained things to end up advance faster than she does". In Hardship and all that.

OOC-ly, as a player, I'm incredibly grateful for everything the admins have done. This is amazing in terms of content, things have been handled quickly when there were problems, and having an alternate 'faction' identity is making strange bedfellows of RP potential possible and fun.

I think there's problems with the system, but I don't know of an elegant way to fix it beyond "Make Water the same advancement speed as everyone else" or "Make the Water plane even more snide towards Mhaldorians to explain why Veldrin is ahead of Eli despite Eli being the first person to pledge Water and Veldrin showed up two days late".

There. Rant over, let's move on to menacing @Shirszae with towels and sponges.

Makarios

Ok, so a few points here.

- We strongly considered making water lord completely unattainable for Mhaldorians. We decided against this because of the nature of Mhaldor: there's no way they could reasonably revert what they've done because it'd be directly going against the cities rp. Yes, it would've made sense for it to be completely unattainable, and we'd have done that if there was any possible way they could fix it down the line.

- Water lord will stay as difficult as it is for Mhaldorians. Its doable, but extremely hard. This is the compromise we settled on for not making it completely unattainable. Regardless of who makes decisions, those decisions will have long term consequences.

- People got lord way faster than we expected!

Minifie

Makarios said:

Ok, so a few points here.

- We strongly considered making water lord completely unattainable for Mhaldorians. We decided against this because of the nature of Mhaldor: there's no way they could reasonably revert what they've done because it'd be directly going against the cities rp. Yes, it would've made sense for it to be completely unattainable, and we'd have done that if there was any possible way they could fix it down the line.

- Water lord will stay as difficult as it is for Mhaldorians. Its doable, but extremely hard. This is the compromise we settled on for not making it completely unattainable. Regardless of who makes decisions, those decisions will have long term consequences.

- People got lord way faster than we expected!

You greatly underestimated how hard we could no-life it.

Elisella

Good enough for me.

I'm going to return to defending the honor of Archoura and the guardsmen with this unreasonable supply of soulspears.

Tysandr

Elisella said:

Good enough for me.

I'm going to return to defending the honor of Archoura and the guardsmen with this unreasonable supply of soulspears.

There is no such thing as an unreasonable supply of soulspears.

One can never have enough.

Cooper

Asmodron said:

You claim our information was "incorrect" yet what happened was pretty damn close to what was suggested in reports concering what Mhaldor was attempting.

He claimed your information was incorrect, because it was incorrect. Everyone knew each faction was up to something, but your idea of what we were up to is not accurate.

Melodie

The only thing I have to say about Water now...

Gavriil

Well, I mean I was just posting my stuff because I'm slightly frustrated. 

I'm Eleusian, in Air, it's taken me 27 total completions of 14 quests to get to Advisor.
At Advisor, I'm at 49 total completions. 

Nazihk

Makarios said:

- People got lord way faster than we expected!

I think you underestimated the bonuses with certain factions that cities got.

I got Earth Lord without ever having to repeat a quest, which means that I never had to wait on a daily quest reset. The only waiting I had to do was for jackal/feral respawns, and I have a Death's Call to help me brute force my way through those quests.

Aralaya

I didn't even have to complete all the quests, there's still one jackal quest I could do but I'm already Cacharann

Telendrieth

Lort. I'm on my third round of quests for water and still rank 1. 

Elisella

You're all adorable.

Telendrieth

I did just start yesterday.  

Kriex

Im second rank for earth and have yet to repeat a quest