Class Concepts

Kresslack

There's a reason I put this in The Scarlattan Theatre. That reason being that I am fully aware that Achaea will likely not be introducing a new class for a very long time. I have the appropriate expectations about those sort of additions, and yet I often find myself contemplating on various alternatives and new possibilities. Recently, I have been reminded of these daydreamings in another thread were the idea was (jokingly) made for having a Mhaldorian equivalent of an entity based class, such as Occultists and Sentinels are modeled after. The closest thing available is Apostate, but it's not nearly on the same level.

So, this thread is simply for those creative ponderings of a 'what if' nature, based on what class or classes you think would be a great possible addition into the Achaean environment. Who knows...maybe all or part of them may be implemented in the future, if the Garden deems it prudent.

One concept of a character class I've always thought would be...neat, for lack of a better word, was a dual knife wielding assassin type, somewhat like Serpent, but utilizing knives rather than dirk/whip combo for damage based attacks, instead of pure affliction stacking. They would, however, be able to envenom with the appropriate skill to do so, as well as having the appropriate vials on hand (i.e. not able to naturally envenom the way Serpents can).

A decent visual representation of such a class might be this:

Ernam

So basically a serpent with DSL?  I mean, serpents can fight dual-wielding knives.  You lose the overwhelmingly helpful (sarcasm) effects of your buckler, but if you imagine that our doublestab is one stab per dirk, you basically have exactly what you're asking for .

Aedin

Yeah going to have to agree with Ernam it sounds like an knight with daggers per say. While I'm all for new stuff what would it really bring to the table that isn't really already there? Probably be the beat place to start imo

Kresslack

Ernam said:

So basically a serpent with DSL?  I mean, serpents can fight dual-wielding knives.  You lose the overwhelmingly helpful (sarcasm) effects of your buckler, but if you imagine that our doublestab is one stab per dirk, you basically have exactly what you're asking for .

The main difference would be that, yes, it would more resemble DSL as being a damage based attacking instead of dstab as a quick affliction delivery sort of attack. Certain areas of the body could be targeted towards certain results (such as the knight changes currently reflect). For instance, cutting into the inside of your opponent's forearms to severe the tendons in an attempt to force them to unwield an item, or going after vital organs (maybe without the need for venoms, more akin to Striking) in order to either induce bleeding or a set of specific afflictions.

Aedin said:

Yeah going to have to agree with Ernam it sounds like an knight with daggers per say. While I'm all for new stuff what would it really bring to the table that isn't really already there? Probably be the beat place to start imo

The armour class could be nowhere near the same, and they would have a restriction against using shields (not unlike Monks and Blademasters). The focus for such a concept is in a semi-stealthy class which utilizes knives to deal damage instead of layering afflictions in order to kill someone, which fits into a more traditional assassin role type. Also consider that in many environments, many assassins refrain from using magic and poisons as they are sometimes viewed as handicaps. I think something which can use edged weapons with the absence of venoms, and inflict damage, is interesting to entertain.

Aedin

Hmm thought I added light armored but sadly I did not. While I completely understand where exactly your coming from they would have to rely on more of a burst damage type of combat if it would. Which would be entertaining to put into theory. However like all things with burst which could as always be a probably for the more beefier side of the populance they can't do prolonged combat so it would need a way for it to easily reset the tide of battle after said damage burst combination without being terribly OP. 

While the two handed model of combat could easily be used for this purpose you would need to balance it around the fact that they would require quick rebalance to quickly "dispatch" their targets preferably before "noticed".

Kresslack

Also to keep in mind, this thread is largely for any idea for an eccentric class that one might have dreamed up in their time of playing, whether something as a hybrid of existing classes, or something new in and of itself.

Aedin

Of course of course but general feedback on ideas is how things progress from concept to actually being part of it. I can remember back and how much it actually took something from concept to implement it into a game scenario for simple thing as a skin or actual game changing diffence..  

Even though truly there's always issue found much later on when released as not every single person thinks a like on subject which is how bugs and glitches are found. 

OT:

Now as for the general principal of the class bring a burst damage/ slight afflictions class what would its skill set be and said skills within it?

Kresslack

Aedin said:

Now as for the general principal of the class bring a burst damage/ slight afflictions class what would its skill set be and said skills within it?

That is something that will require a more in depth pondering and comparison than I have already undertaken, and is something I will certainly endeavor to do at my earliest ability.

Skye

I wanted pictomancers once. But what I came up with wound up too similar to Vodun and srsly overpowered because I have no concept of combat balance XD

I was thinking about it when I was Scarlattan *years* ago, then I went back to look at it in 2010/11. And then I got bored. Also it's pretty long.

Pictomancers only wear leather armour and require a wielded sketchbook, and a stick of charcoal. Certain replication items require coloured inks and will be stated.

A regular sketchbook contains 80-100 pages and each sketch failed or successful takes up a page. One book might cost about 400-500 (works out to 5g a page, same as an arrow). An artifact sketchbook will contain maybe 300 pages that replenish at a rate of either 30 per day or fully after an Achaean month from time of purchase. Inspecting a sketchbook will tell you how many pages have been used/destroyed/leftover.

The amount of charcoal required depends on how elaborate your sketches are, but ideally one stick (riftable) might last as long as half a sketchbook. So one stick might last very long for a novice but not very long at all for a more experienced player. Charcoal might be obtained for free from the leftovers of a Sentinel campfire, or purchased from Rurin. An artifact quill (maybe the same one they use for Tarot?) may be substituted.

Pictomancy
The core skill of Pictomancy. Pictomancers are required to create a sketch in order to begin their attacks on denizens or other players. When bashing, the preliminary sketch is not counted as an attack and will not provoke one unless the denizen is already aggro by default.

The more detailed your sketch, the more damage your attacks will do. Naturally, the higher your skill at Pictomancy, the more detailed your preliminary sketch will be. Because players (or adventurers) have the innate ability to 'grow' and 'change', sketches of players do not last as long as that of denizens and their pages will eventually fade or be rendered inert on their own after a few hours.

Sketchbook: Manage your sketchbook. Allows you to inspect the sketchbook for a summary of what occupies what pages and how many pages you have left. Inspecting a particular page also lists what details you might have added or lost. One page for one target, killing the subject destroys the page automatically and starts you on a new one. If you want to switch between multiple live targets, you have to TURN PAGE #. (uses no balance)

Sketch: Add detail to your drawing. There are four levels of detail (doodle, croquis, study, lifelike) you can achieve and certain details are required to perform certain attacks. Each sketch requires balance but you can combo it with other abilities to do damage/hinder while you draw. Anything that 'smudges' or decreases the detail of a sketch will always take away more detail than sketching gives regardless of skill level. Each sketch action drains mana and requires more mana as the level of detail increases.

Marr: Carve cuts into your drawing to cause damage. This is a bashing skill and does not take away detail. But you cannot sketch while marring a portrait. Sketch falls apart once the target is dead (fixed 5% for a basic doodle and an additional 10% of the original 5% per detail level against players)

Smudge: Smudge the limbs of your target to cripple them. Requires at least a croquis drawing and decreases the level of detail with each smudge. (one targetted limb per smudge, cripple damage accumulates. Will always take away more detail than sketch adds)

Corpulence: Adds weight to your target. Levitation stripped and mass defence gained but also causes the target to move slowly between rooms for a few seconds (adds detail 'corpulent', negates the 'lithe' detail)

Lithe: Strip the weight and mass from your target (adds detail 'lithe', negates the 'corpulent' detail. Blocked by Shackle of Garash)

Blind: Blinds the target requires at least a croquis drawing. (adds detail 'blinded').

Brighteyes: Return sight to the target (negates the 'blinded' detail)

Silence: Smudge away the tongue of your victim. Requires at least a study level sketch. Decreases the detail level of a sketch (Negates voicecraft and anything that requires speech. Adds detail 'silenced'. Regain use of tongue by concentrating)

Study: Your experienced eye now allows you to take in and apply greater detail with every sketch. Increases the rate at which a sketch gains detail.

Repair: Undo damage done to a target. (Heals physical afflictions or negates a detail of your choice)

Distance: Gain the ability to Sketch and add details from an adjacent room. Target will still feel your attempts to sketch.

Familiar: You now have the ability to create Familiars.

Shackles: Iron shackles on the target make actions difficult to perform. Aeon-like delay but writhe to escape. (adds detail 'shackled')

Stun: Stun your target by breaking their nose with a smudge (decreases detail level, adds detail 'broken nose'.)

Torch: Set your target alight by burning their sketch. Requires a croquis level sketch. (uncurable burn damage, damages sketch beyond repair)

Rashes: Causes random amnesia/off balance by creating a horribly itchy rash. (requires red ink, adds detail 'rash', apply epidermal to heal)

Starvation: Prevent everything and anything from entering the mouth of your victim by 'sewing' his mouth shut with a set of crisscrossing lines. Target may tear the 'stitches' apart by attempting to open his mouth by speaking. Requires a study level sketch (adds detail 'stitched mouth')

Cockeyed: Temporarily skews your target's vision for a few seconds so that their accuracy decreases (adds detail 'cockeyed')

Perception: See through pictomancy replicas, illusions, camouflage and hidden individuals.

Tenterhooks: Sink invisible tenterhooks into the skin of your target. Latches on for bleeding damage. Target must PULL HOOK to rip them off with added damage after a delay. Requires working arms in order to pull the hooks out. (Adds detail tenterhook)

Flay: Insta-kill. Showoff your mastery of anatomy by 'reverse engineering' your sketch. Flays the flesh and meat off the body of your target. Requires a lifelike sketch and four 'tenterhooks' to be attached to the target. A body may only have four hooks at a time and all four hooks must belong to the same Pictomancer (hence be on the same sketch)


Familiars

Seals a portion of a denizen's soul within a sketch to be summoned at your beck and call. One use only. Requires the "Familiar" ability in Pictomancy.

Familiars, when probed, do not bear the 'loyalty' line but rather the 'mark of' line. Because they are not 'loyals', they do not turn on the Pictomancer when afflicted by disloyalty, but there is a constant underlying risk of them turning against their controller for no reason at all. Naturally the weaker the Pictomancer and stronger/more intelligent the denizen, the higher the risk. Pictomancers reserve the right to protect their Familiars because even though they are not listed as 'loyal', they are considered 'property'.

You may have up to three active denizens at any time, but only one of each kind. Every denizen you bring onto the field increases the risk of being turned against. Yessir, they can and will gang up against you.

Enslavement: Requires a lifelike sketch of a denizen. It is a delayed process of several seconds and while you can perform actions like sipping while it is happening, it requires you to stay in the room. A Pictomancer's strength of will should be accompanied by the strength to tank a few hits too, after all

Most denizens with a blanket exception of the undead may be enslaved. Loyals to other players will have a failure message of already having their souls bonded. Too powerful denizens like honours mobs will say their soul is too powerful to be dominated/stolen.

You may not enslave organisation (City, House, Guild) loyals because their souls are protected by the Divine patron. This includes denizens who are very obviously loyal to a particular Divine like certain priests that aren't actually probed as loyal. Delosian loyals are under protection of Prospero, so you can forget about having Delosian guards following you around . Would be funny if a city losing its patron results in being able to enslave them but... we'll cross that bridge when we come to it >_>

Oh yes, Enslaving 'intelligent' denizens creates less obedient Familiars. For example, if you Enslave the Theran Guards, they might decide to curbstomp you after 10 minutes while a less intelligent creature like a bear or vampire spider might be obedient to the death.

Manifest: Summon your Familiar from parchment to the real world. Destroys the sketch.

Control: Force your Familiar to perform basic acts like an ordinary loyal. Ordering your Familiar to attack will grant the full range of what they can normally do. Have a care with those who use room attacks because those will hit you too.

Banish: Forcibly banish your Familiar. It is 100% successful if the Familiar is not aggressive against you, but there is a chance of failure if they've already started attacking you. "The Familiar resists your banishment through sheer force of will!"

Marionette: Force your Familiar to perform more complex acts like speaking (if they can speak) or emoting. NOTE: FORCING YOUR FAMILIAR TO EMOTE ONE OF ITS ATTACKS IS THE SAME AS PROVOCATION.

Modify: You can now 'modify' your Familiars. Add a collar to any Familiar to lower the chances of them turning against you. Modify razor edge/iron hammer adds additional cutting/blunt damage to their attacks. Certain familiars may also have the option of having a bridle/saddle added if they are mountable. Modifications may only be made once prior to summoning the Familiar (IOW still in sketch form)

Replication

Subjects: A fixed list of subjects you are able to successfully sketch or replicate. Some are purely RP (flowers etc), some are more useful (stepping stones to avoid water, lit torches/candles for light). Variety increases with skill rank. Requires a subject item in the room or inventory. Certain room descriptions may also have the required subjects. Sketches may be created and saved for later use.

Still-life: Create an illusionary replica of any item on 'sketch'. Only the user can use it.

Tangibility: Creates longer lasting, tangible illusions of items. Other people in the room can see and manipulate them.

Camouflage: Hide an item/person in plain sight. Moving targets dispel the illusion the moment they move or perform most actions.

Visualisation: You no longer require a physical subject item to create a picture.

Imitation: Attempt to replicate certain skills of another class. Works only for skills that take immediate physical form like gravehands, walls, banana peels, shields but not enchantments like sigils. You cannot imitate archery as it is a skill that requires one to actively wield and draw. You also lack aiming and wind control so even if you could, you'd be shooting blanks and missing most of the time anyway. It is impossible to imitate runelore proper with the exception of stone walls. Attempt may fail but improves with practice and continued exposure to the ability. AB REPLICATION IMITATION will give a list of abilities you might attempt to imitate and AB REPLICATION <ability> will list your success rate of performing the imitation.

Critique: You can see through another Pictomancer’s petty attempts at Replication and dispel them. Success based on skill level of both Pictomancers and also whether one has the Perception ability in Pictomancy.

Illusion: Creates elaborate combat illusions. ie: SKETCH <afflictionname>, will conjure a random affliction line that pertains to that affliction. There is a chance the illusion will come out as garbled gibberish.

Portraiture: Adds the falsified physical presence of an individual to the room. Requires a subject to pose. ie: You can sketch someone propping a totem and use them in the room as a fake decoy to make people think he's propping when he's not.

Forgery: Duplicate CoAs and falsify documents (ie fake journals/letters) to varying degrees of success.

Authentication: Verifies the authenticity of documents. Both Forgery and Authentication requires a copy of the item and an original document (or signet ring/CoA) from the target. If both forger and authenticator are of the same skill level, then the chances of identifying are 50/50.                                                    

Nim

I've always wanted to play a photomancer, someone who controls light.

Originally it was just mostly harmless light and maybe blinding people, but now I want master sparks.

Bluef

I've always wanted to see something like a cross between Outriders and Rangers in Imperian -- but with more of a rogueish flair. With access to traps, darts, knife play, bowmanship, but also stealth, tracking and the like. They would be all about survival in nature, but they wouldn't necessarily be nature-aligned; instead, they would be more nomadic (fast movement in all terrains and an inclination for exploration) and less tribal than sentinals and shaman; really less attached to civilization in any form. 

Sarapis

Barbarians.

Nim

oh, we're including pictures


pictured above: the class i want

Sarapis

Barbarian!

Sarapis

(Although his crotch-plate is ridiculous and his armour too nicely-forged in general for the kind of barbarian I have in mind.)

Nim

He's a Cyrenian barbarian, that's all.

An alternative universe @Bronislav, I believe.

Skye

Every fantasy RP needs Conan.

Sarapis

Yes, exactly. Every fantasy RP needs Conan. Although in our case I'm thinking Conan would have inherent raw elemental powers as well, because no mere mortal could conceivably compete with our magically-enhanced classes (i.e. all of them).

Kresslack

Sarapis said:

Yes, exactly. Every fantasy RP needs Conan. Although in our case I'm thinking Conan would have inherent raw elemental powers as well, because no mere mortal could conceivably compete with our magically-enhanced classes (i.e. all of them).

Berserkers....yeeesss.

Nim

But oldschool barbarians fought against magic without any of their own and won.

Giving them spells just makes them brawny, savage spellswords. :c

Skye

I always saw barbarians as a 2H class, but given the knight changes that no longer seems unique

Aedin

Sarapis said:

Barbarian!

Totally going to make a signature off that, has a lot of detail, and very dynamic!

Kresslack

Skye said:

I always saw barbarians as a 2H class, but given the knight changes that no longer seems unique

They've always been depicted as skilled with...or without, any weapon.

Nim

Basically, barbarians are oldschool monks back when throwing axes was a thing.

Kresslack

Dual wielding halbreds like a boss.

Caladbolg

Sarapis said:

Yes, exactly. Every fantasy RP needs Conan. Although in our case I'm thinking Conan would have inherent raw elemental powers as well, because no mere mortal could conceivably compete with our magically-enhanced classes (i.e. all of them).

Didn't neverwinter knights have a barbian subspec that was based on hunting mages? It's been awhile since i've played it but seemingly I think I remember it. Beserkers are awesome, and our jedi mind trick, karate kid monks are getting stale, Maybe.. I dunno.. >.> Give them a two handed axe and say have fun?

Klendathu

Caladbolg said:

Sarapis said:

Yes, exactly. Every fantasy RP needs Conan. Although in our case I'm thinking Conan would have inherent raw elemental powers as well, because no mere mortal could conceivably compete with our magically-enhanced classes (i.e. all of them).

Didn't neverwinter knights have a barbian subspec that was based on hunting mages? It's been awhile since i've played it but seemingly I think I remember it. Beserkers are awesome, and our jedi mind trick, karate kid monks are getting stale, Maybe.. I dunno.. >.> Give them a two handed axe and say have fun?

Wizard Slayer - couldn't use any magical items apart from magic armour and weapons, had increasing magic resistance with level. Pretty damned good as a melee fighter.

Mishgul

Caladbolg said:

Sarapis said:

Yes, exactly. Every fantasy RP needs Conan. Although in our case I'm thinking Conan would have inherent raw elemental powers as well, because no mere mortal could conceivably compete with our magically-enhanced classes (i.e. all of them).

Didn't neverwinter knights have a barbian subspec that was based on hunting mages? It's been awhile since i've played it but seemingly I think I remember it. Beserkers are awesome, and our jedi mind trick, karate kid monks are getting stale, Maybe.. I dunno.. >.> Give them a two handed axe and say have fun?

The Forgotten Realms barbarians had the whole, dual wield bastard swords, throwing axes, huge magic resist, ability to summon lots of animals to fight with them and just be beefy and ridiculous in most of those games I have played.

Sarathai

Klendathu said:

Caladbolg said:

Sarapis said:

Yes, exactly. Every fantasy RP needs Conan. Although in our case I'm thinking Conan would have inherent raw elemental powers as well, because no mere mortal could conceivably compete with our magically-enhanced classes (i.e. all of them).

Didn't neverwinter knights have a barbian subspec that was based on hunting mages? It's been awhile since i've played it but seemingly I think I remember it. Beserkers are awesome, and our jedi mind trick, karate kid monks are getting stale, Maybe.. I dunno.. >.> Give them a two handed axe and say have fun?

Wizard Slayer - couldn't use any magical items apart from magic armour and weapons, had increasing magic resistance with level. Pretty damned good as a melee fighter.

Pretty terrible mechanically in BG2. It was interesting as a niche, but not something you'd bother with most of the time over the other Fighter specs (especially Berserker or Kensai).

Definitely +1 to the idea of a Barbarian class, though.

Blujixapug

Kresslack said:

A decent visual representation of such a class might be this:

I hope that guy has at least one skill devoted to belts. Beltsmanship. Utility belts. Wearing 30 belts in place of a suit of armour. Keeping all your belts straight. Tactical buckles. Improvising a hole punch.

Mockery aside, I've been sitting on a bunch of ideas for a pirate class for years, occasionally adding to them like a bird weaving twigs and junk into its nest. I should just post it here, since I'm probably never going to actually submit it, and even if I did they'd probably never make it into a class (probably). It's not really complete, overloaded with utility, and it's more what I think are cool ideas than an actual cohesive viable class balanced for PVP. Plus it's all strewn across different Notepad files on different drives... I formatted together the stuff for one skill, and I'll finish the rest and post it tomorrow.

Nizana

Given what I've seen in Achaea thus far, and other IRE games, I will have to say something like the Marauder from Warhammer combined with Chaos elements of Ashtan.

Skills:
1st- Mutation
***Similar to the Illuminati Transmology, they would mutate their body through the use of Karma (think Tentacles in Occultism!) or some other resource.. or maybe none at all! Just have it laid out like Metamorphosis.
2nd- Oneness
***Essentially a mix of Domination and Spiritlore. Through pacts made with the entities of Chaos, they are not merely granted minions. They are possessed.
3rd- Insanity
***Think along the lines of Chivalry, or Shindo/Kaido. Self-focused buffs with some skills relating to imparting insanity of some form.

It'd basically be my version of the Chaos Knight class. You Targossians can keep your Paladins, and Mhaldorians can have their Infernals! Runeguards, get back to your forests and your Cyrene!

Bring on the Chaos!

They would wear Ringmail at the most, no armor at the least. They would have no use for shields, due to Mutation, but they could wield one (reduces skill options, of course). Ideally... there'd be different combination of weapons and mutations, where the mutations would have different effects, or none at all, depending on the weapons their wield (if any) while they use the abilities.