Ship Commscreen Select

Klendathu

It's better than a gem and a veil because it hides you from HWHO and CWHO too

Tharvis

Klendathu said:

It's better than a gem and a veil because it hides you from HWHO and CWHO too

OWHO too

Jules

So, let's just say for a moment that most captains started putting commscreen up when they were actually sailing (if it's so good as it is, people should be taking advantage of it).  In that situation the Mariner's, perhaps the biggest seafaring clan in the game right now, really does get split in two:

Any reports from captains at sea wouldn't be heard by those about to set sail, and vice versa.  You could have the entire Mariner's Guild frantically checking clan history (which I have a feeling many of us actually do already), but it seems like a special kind of ridiculous to have a feature which, if it were actually used by more people, effectively splits seafaring clans (and High Clans at that) in two.  

Kresslack

Jules said:

Commscreen's purpose shouldn't be to make you an isolationist hermit, it should be used by captains who are actually sailing.  Captains want to hear from other captains.  

I am reading your posts, and each one seems to circle back to how you would like the convenience factor of tailoring Commscreen to block out all channels but one. I'm pretty sure Commscreen -does- allow you to communicate with other Captains....who are already out on the seas. If you wan't to communicate with Captains still on land, via a clan channel, but no one else, set up a simple alias to turn those channels off and leave Mariners on. You can also set up another simple alias to turn everything back on when you disembark. 

I really don't see this as a needful change. Commscreen is -supposed- to make you invisible to everyone not on the seas; that's the entire point of the skill and it always has been. Changing that because you want an easier way to snub all but one clan isn't a good reason.

At this point, I don't even feel a need for my further involvement in this discussion, as I'm 99.9% sure it won't happen, based on the aforementioned reasons. So, good luck.

Jules

You're ignoring the real time part of this, and at this point, I think it's willful.  

Jules

I think whoever designed commscreen in the first place understands social obligations very well, and if the big seafaring clans had been around then, I think that designer might have taken them into consideration as clear exceptions.    

Klendathu

Jules said:

You're ignoring the real time part of this, and at this point, I think it's willful.  

This isn't meant to be a nasty, vindictive personal attack, but you're going to strongly disagree with everyone else's points. I don't see anyone else agreeing with you, and a number of people disagreeing. @Kresslack‌ has hit the nail on the head - you want it to be convenient for you. I don't see why one or two clans should be singled out as special, Klendathu sails and is not in either clan - he don't want to be a pirate but is assumed to be because he resides in Ashtan. Having either or both of those clans excluded is of no use to him, he'd rather have the Partharan Gare clan excluded so he can talk with other dragons when sailing (this is just a for example)

Jules

They're not just clans, though.  They're High Clans devoted to seafaring.  That said, I actually don't think you being able to select whatever channels you'd like (sure, Parthren Gare, why not, fine by me) would be a bad thing, but at this point I'm not even asking for that sort of functionality.  I really am having a hard time understanding the passionate push-back here, but really, all of us actually replying here are just a tiny portion of the community, and none of us are admin.  

EDIT:  that said, there is a possibility that the sort of functionality I'd originally suggested would help create an expectation that you leave certain channels up, which would be kind of soul crushing if some admin actually put all that effort into creating a nuanced tool to avoid exactly that sort of thing.  Managing people's expectations is tricky.  

Sybilla

The way it works now:

Syntax:
  SHIP COMMSCREEN CHECK
  SHIP COMMSCREEN RAISE
  SHIP COMMSCREEN LOWER
Raise a communications screen between your ship and the mainland.

This makes it so that everyone on your ship exists as if on a separate plane all of their own, HWHO, CWHO, OWHO, CLWHO, etc. will only show the people on your ship (if you share organisations), and you (and your crew) will not show on those lists from the mainland/other ships.

You will not be able to hear any channels, (and I presume others can't hear you talking on them either, not sure about this) for general chatter from the mainland.

You will be able to hear people talking on clans/city/other channels if they too happen to be on a ship. 

What @Jules is suggesting/wants is that you can set a channel whitelist, similar to allowtells which works like this:

Allowtells, if on, allows those on your ALLOWTELLS list to send you tells
while you have TELLSOFF. It is basically a way for you to set up a whitelist,
when you only wish to receive tells from certain people.
Usage:
   CONFIG ALLOWTELLS ON|OFF
 
You currently have ALLOWTELLS: OFF
ALLOWTELLS
Usage:
   ALLOWTELLS LIST
   ALLOWTELLS ADD <name>
   ALLOWTELLS REMOVE <name>
   ALLOWTELLS REMOVE ALL

To allow a captain (and his current crew) to be visible to and hear talk from certain whitelisted channels. 

I personally don't mind either way, but this (to me) defeats the purpose of commscreen. If I put commscreen up and go sailing, it means I don't want to be reached, but if fellow-citymate from one clan knows I'm about and happily shooting the breeze on family clan while the rest of the city is getting ravaged by dragons... it kinda doesn't look good. To me it's an all-or-nothing thing. Either I'm sailing and can't attend to on-shore business, or I'm not.

I do see your point about Mariner's though, but I thought that it's bypassed by the fact you can still hear other people at sea.

Jules

I agree that the "whitelist", which is a good way of putting it, could just get people in trouble.  At this point, I'm just asking for the two High Clans (Or maybe just Mariner's if PoM doesn't want it for theirs), mainly because it's best to hear everything in real time (such as my "Hey guys, Kinilan just left the Tasur'ke" example).  A lot of pirate strategy revolves around harbours, which is a convenient example of why it's good to have land and sea reports coming in seamlessly.  

Kyrra

As long as the other people are on ships, clans and city chatter still go through commscreens, and so do tells. It only blocks communication between ships and the mainland.

I honestly don't see a reason for a change. Saying that you're on a ship at sea is a legit reason for not being able to do stuff since it's going to take X amount of time to travel to a port. There's also nothing wrong with turning off some channels, or doing what most people with mudlet do and just set up channel capture so you can go sailing around without missing what's being said, which is usually the reason people have commscreens up while sailing.

Jules

Kyrra said:

As long as the other people are on ships, clans and city chatter still go through commscreens, and so do tells. It only blocks communication between ships and the mainland.

Yes, this is the problem with actually using commscreen (and why I never do it unless I'm in a harbour and don't want to be bothered).  I'd lose half of my real time communications from Mariner's Guild if I did.  The interim solution I'd suggested of checking history sort of works, but is unwieldy at best.  I'd need to set something up to check it every few minutes (probably at least every 5, just in case).  I'm no great coder, but with forums and such I could probably get that working.  I think I'd set it up to just capture the last line, and if it was new, I could stop and review it manually to see how far back the new comments went, and if any were relevant.  The more I think about that the less happy I am with it.  I set up a thing that parses the whole clan history every few minutes, and if there's something new, I review it to see how far back it goes to be sure I don't miss that one important tell.  I could also set it to just show the last X lines, but I do leave myself open to missing something that way.  It's a pretty terrible way to get threat warning, basically.  

  Kyrra said:

I honestly don't see a reason for a change. Saying that you're on a ship at sea is a legit reason for not being able to do stuff since it's going to take X amount of time to travel to a port. There's also nothing wrong with turning off some channels, or doing what most people with mudlet do and just set up channel capture so you can go sailing around without missing what's being said, which is usually the reason people have commscreens up while sailing.

Not sure I understood the last part, but for the rest of it, I will just say that commscreen might be the only thing in the game that removes you from CWHO/HWHO (and apparently OWHO).  Why is that?  

Kyrra

Jules said:

Not sure I understood the last part, but for the rest of it, I will just say that commscreen might be the only thing in the game that removes you from CWHO/HWHO (and apparently OWHO).  Why is that?  

Because it raises a communication screen which effectively blocks all communication and existence with the mainland, which is stated in the help file >.>

As for the rest:

You can see some pretty stunning GUI's and examples of channel capture's in http://forums.achaea.com/discussion/1606/let-s-see-your-gui 

I only have the commscreen up while docked, which I want privacy to sort through messages and letters without being pestered by people. I rarely have it up while sailing, but due to the way my wilderness map is set, any channels just become spam while sailing anyway. When you set up your channels to go to another window, this becomes less of a problem, and you're able to keep track of things without map spam.

If someone needs something while you're out sailing, just say you're out sailing. It's not that big of a deal. You don't have to immediately drop what you're doing to jump through hoops for people, or have to hide because you refuse to turn your channels off. Turning silence on/off is also an option for people that just don't want to communicate.

If you're having issues with people demanding things from you, that's your issue with them and perhaps your house/city. You are from Cyrene though, where there are plenty of extremely helpful people so finding someone else to do something because you're not immediately available at that time to orient that novice shouldn't be a huge deal. If you're getting HDF/CDF'd because you chose the wrong time to go sailing, there's something wrong with the administration in your respective organisation.

These just sound like excuses to change the mechanics of commscreen because you're unwilling to use any of the other options currently available to you. I don't believe high clans should have any exception because they're just like any other organisation. Not everyone that sails is in the Mariners or PoM. Channels from these organisations are only blocked by commscreens to those not on ships, and there are -plenty- of people who spend time on ships with commscreens down who can just as easily relay you information if you don't want to check the channel history.

I'm iffy on whitelisting because if you're going to do that, you're basically wanting a free gem of cloaking that hides you from all WHO lists while staying on all channels. It's not going to make any difference to your availability, because if you're out sailing, you're out sailing.

Jules

My stuff does go to a channel capture.  And you "only have the commscreen up while docked" (just like everyone else probably).  I'm really surprised you don't see a problem with this feature being mainly used to sit in a harbour sifting through your messages.  I don't have any problem with it being used for that purpose (it's handy), but I seriously doubt the designer thought "you know what, let's make a thing so people can get on their boats and check messages".