Knightly questions!

Arador

I am speaking from the Infernal perspective. Cannot tumble if you restored.

As for monk. I forgot about the torc, yes. But still holds true for base class skills

Tymir

I think this is where to post.

So, for bashing, do I use Doubleslash or just my regular kill command? It doesn't actually seem like DSL does more damage than a single shortsword. Which makes no sense. Am I missing something?

Bukariin

DSL damage scales up with Chivalry, Slash does not, I believe.  So if Slash does more damage right now (because your Chivalry skill is low) then that's okay for now.

Sena

Slash and DSL scale equally with chivalry/weaponry. One possible issue is that slash and DSL seem to both be bugged at the moment, and the damage varies wildly because of that.

When it's working normally though, slashing with a single shortsword will probably still be better, because of the damage bonus from the swordplay ability. Swordplay only applies to shortswords, and only when you're not wielding two weapons, so for now you're better off not using DSL. Eventually though you'll move on from shortswords to better weapons, and then DSL will be the best choice.

Tymir

Okay. Makes sense if they're bugged, and if Swordplay works for only one shortsword and not two. But, when I use the KILL command, it goes to DSL so I figure the system is optimizing. If not, they're too close for me to discern then difference and the balance difference is negligible.

Also I'm guessing Runewardens do decent at bashing with Chivalry + Fullplate + Runelore?

Sena

KILL doesn't always use the optimal attack, it just follows a few basic guidelines. Also, more specifically, swordplay increases the slash damage by 40%, while DSL averages the damage of your two hits and increases that average by 25%. So if you have two identical shortswords, slashing with just one of them will have about 12% higher damage than DSL, plus swordplay gives better accuracy, and allows you to use a shield. So as long as you're using shortswords, there's not really a reason to DSL.

Runewardens are one of the best bashing classes (maybe the best, but it's a hard choice between runewarden and priest).

Razha

Is there any reason not use a tower+shortsword for solo bashing then if the damage is the same? (Besides crit, which is apparently evened out still, and razeslash?) Also I'd say runewarden wins against priest due to basically zero downtime.

Sena

Razha said:

Is there any reason not use a tower+shortsword for solo bashing then if the damage is the same?

If you don't yet have enough chivalry to use better weapons (I'd say at least virtuoso, unless you get swords with really high to-hit), then no, there's no reason to use two weapons. At trans chivalry, DSL with rapiers (and probably any other swords/battleaxe) will be better than a shortsword with swordplay.

Tymir

Great, thank you @Sena! I have the crummy training shortsword and a better on forged by a nice person for me, so I'll swap over to the better shortsword and just slash for now. I like doing more damage! Also good to hear that Runewardens are top 2 for bashing. Gives me a warm fuzzy.

Sarieno

Set of decently fast empowered rapiers, empowered fullplate and hunting runes make you an absurd hunter.