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Best class with arties

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  • AntoniusAntonius Member Posts: 4,991 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    With the direction houses are going, how many are even going to consider picking something like strength or int when it will benefit only a fraction of their members?

    Runewarden could in theory top out at 24 if they were willing to spend a mayan crown and had a strength icon. I'd say 22 is the most likely.
  • MicosituMicositu Member Posts: 31 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    You forgot ogre elixir, and truefavour, also a couple of quests you can do out there to boost str.  
  • ExelethrilExelethril Member Posts: 3,360 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Magi, sylvan or monk, most probs. I remember being really slipshod/yolo and not bothering to get any resist enchantments or use basic defenses like metawake/mass/monos against Mithridates and losing five ranked spars in a row.

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  • TaelTael Member Posts: 1,197 @ - Epic Achaean
    I think there's a degree to which this thread is conflating "best class with arties" with "class most benefited by arties".

    I think those are probably different things. The fact that there are a lot of arties magi can buy does not necessarily mean that magi is the strongest class once it's bought them.
  • AustereAustere TennesseeMember Posts: 2,341 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Tael said:
    I think there's a degree to which this thread is conflating "best class with arties" with "class most benefited by arties".

    I think those are probably different things. The fact that there are a lot of arties magi can buy does not necessarily mean that magi is the strongest class once it's bought them.
    Magi doesn't even require all the artefacts it could buy to be in the running for this.  Ask @Atalkez‌ about fighting me with level 2 collar and a diadem. Shit is OP. Even with evade,  you can throw holocaust and hope they get unlucky with evading back in.  Throw in leg breaks and your need of luck drops drastically.  
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  • AtalkezAtalkez Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 5,216 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Magi don't use limb prep enough. Shit is OP



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  • AddamaAddama Member Posts: 947 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Ernam said:

    Surprised to see nobody mentioning Runewarden.  I mentioned Runewarden as one of the best classes without artefacts, but it's also one of the best classes with high-end artefacts.  The damage output and pure affliction speed with 25 strength and ~2 second DSLs is mind boggling, and combined with high-Int Thurisaz, it's particularly terrifying.

    (* damage burst runewarden does benefit from damage arties, but isn't going to kill anyone with any skill, and can honestly be done just fine without artefacts, with the right race/spec and weapon choice).

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  • TaelTael Member Posts: 1,197 @ - Epic Achaean
    edited December 2014
    Austere said:
    Tael said:
    I think there's a degree to which this thread is conflating "best class with arties" with "class most benefited by arties".

    I think those are probably different things. The fact that there are a lot of arties magi can buy does not necessarily mean that magi is the strongest class once it's bought them.
    Magi doesn't even require all the artefacts it could buy to be in the running for this.  Ask @Atalkez‌ about fighting me with level 2 collar and a diadem. Shit is OP. Even with evade,  you can throw holocaust and hope they get unlucky with evading back in.  Throw in leg breaks and your need of luck drops drastically.  
    Absolutely, I didn't mean that Magi wasn't the best class with arties, just that saying "there are more arties for magi to buy than there are for class x" doesn't necessarily mean that having those arties as a magi puts you in a better position than having all the relevant arties as class x.

    Counting how many artefacts a class can make use of isn't necessarily the best metric for relative power. There are a number of posts here saying things like "monk can benefit from way more arties than BM", which doesn't, itself, necessarily entail that an artefacted monk is stronger than an artefacted BM. The impact of each artefact on a class's effectiveness is not a constant.
  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014
    I've always looked at magi damage artifacts as mostly for bashing and group combat, because in 1v1, magi can't (currently) kill people with outright damage.  Damage does always help, though, because forcing an opponent to run away helps counter prepping, and constant health damage pressure keeps sip priority away from mana, which is more important than most magi realize (probably because so few people play magi to its potential).

    Knights, on the other hand, do kill you with damage, and pre-damage prior to kill setups is frequently the deciding factor, which is directly based on strength and artefact weapons.  

    High str BM is the same way - I very frequently accidentally kill people with pommelstrike directly after, and often even prior to, venomlocks.  21 str + level 3 band pumps out some seriously scary damage, for a class with access to 1.5 second quad break + prone and hamstring.  It's also freakishly easy to stick sensi .  With lupine meteors and adequate prep, it would probably kill anyone in lesserform who isn't heavily artied or a knight.  Hell, it's one of the very few things in the game that actually can kill a BM.
  • TrevizeTrevize Member Posts: 1,517 @ - Epic Achaean
    Achilles said:
    Runewardens can't get to 25 strength.  Paladins can if they get jera and if Cyrene or Targossas actually had icons.

    Strength base spec - 15 str
    Improved Physique - +1 str
    Level 3 Gauntlets - +3 str
    Jera - +1 str
    Fury - +2str
    Icon - +1str

    Most they can get to is 23 str
    TFs, though not as 'reliable' as the above, can push you past that.
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  • SenaSena Member Posts: 3,957 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Wheel tarot can also potentially increase your strength, though that's not at all reliable either.
  • JinsunJinsun TN, USAMember, Secret Squirrel Posts: 3,041 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Sena said:
    Wheel tarot can also potentially increase your strength, though that's not at all reliable either.
    I so want them to repurpose wheel tarot to be a nifty offensive dice roll potentially affecting both players. I've literally seen one thrown twice in ma lyfe
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  • SeftinSeftin Member Posts: 923 @ - Epic Achaean
    I threw 1500 of them and watched someone gain and lose the same level repeatedly. 
  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Wheel is actually pretty good on people with Iron Elite. You don't lose as much xp as you gain
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  • NexesNexes Member Posts: 86 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Xith said:
    Wheel is actually pretty good on people with Iron Elite. You don't lose as much xp as you gain
    Nerf inc
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  • ErnamErnam Member Posts: 2,416 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited December 2014
    Antonius said:
    With the direction houses are going, how many are even going to consider picking something like strength or int when it will benefit only a fraction of their members?

    Runewarden could in theory top out at 24 if they were willing to spend a mayan crown and had a strength icon. I'd say 22 is the most likely.

    There are ample ways to obtain ogre elixirs (primarily, buying them during promotions, for much less than a MC), and yes, I counted that, because I personally use them all the time, and because it's a theoretical max (without TFs, icons, wheel of fortune, quests, boons, etc, which allow you to go even higher).  For what it's worth, 22 is only slightly less ridiculous than 24 or 25 strength, anyhow.  With artefact weapons, and max gauntlets, sash, collar, and bow, you're still going to be doing absolutely absurd DPS to players ( and everything else ).

    I think I had 25 in my head from playing with Paladin, which I did in fact have 25 str as, in some way or another, without a TF (on the test server).  The +2 from Inspiration is no joke, particularly since you can of course still get the +1 from Jera and +2 from Fury as well.  By your math that'd be 26 str for pallie, who can easily substitute the DPS from thurisaz with the combination of meteors (instead) and demons.
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