Proficiency Tutors and YOU

Grouulthuun

Hello all! First forum post so..let's jump into things! Hashan seems to be the ONLY player-controlled city with their own Proficiency Tutors, Geld for Warhammer, and A shady-looking man for Daggers\Dirks. All of the other Tutors are in neutral areas so -this- scenario forces players to either risk breaking into Hashan (and some can't, especially the newer folk), going against their character and buddy-ing up to the city to gain access, or paying their fine(s) to gain access to them. This is completely unlike ALL of the other Proficiency Tutors and is very problematic to a Knight who plans on just learning a bit of warhammer-age or a...I'm going with Serpent who uses the Daggers and Dirks... My idea is to move these two Tutors to Delos with the majority of the other Proficiency Tutors or at the very least a neutral area so everyone has access to them -OR- another great idea that was brought to my attention. One could..make a quest out of it to get them out of the city. Perhaps via some break-in or just simply mailing each denizen (x) amount of gold (keeping in mind that newbies would wish to learn as well) so they saunter their way out past their city gates to learn. Worried that may be used to kill the Tutor? There are so many Tutors in Delos that seem to be living fine. The Shady man seems to be able to take bribes just fine and I'm sure Geld has already taught many city enemies already who've snuck in. There are a few ways to go about this, with the first being the worst-case scenario. But I don't see a reason why we can't have fun with this.

Adrik

Grouulthuun said:

Hello all! First forum post so..let's jump into things! Hashan seems to be the ONLY player-controlled city with their own Proficiency Tutors, Geld for Warhammer, and A shady-looking man for Daggers\Dirks. All of the other Tutors are in neutral areas so -this- scenario forces players to either risk breaking into Hashan (and some can't, especially the newer folk), going against their character and buddy-ing up to the city to gain access, or paying their fine(s) to gain access to them. This is completely unlike ALL of the other Proficiency Tutors and is very problematic to a Knight who plans on just learning a bit of warhammer-age or a...I'm going with Serpent who uses the Daggers and Dirks... My idea is to move these two Tutors to Delos with the majority of the other Proficiency Tutors or at the very least a neutral area so everyone has access to them -OR- another great idea that was brought to my attention. One could..make a quest out of it to get them out of the city. Perhaps via some break-in or just simply mailing each denizen (x) amount of gold (keeping in mind that newbies would wish to learn as well) so they saunter their way out past their city gates to learn. Worried that may be used to kill the Tutor? There are so many Tutors in Delos that seem to be living fine. The Shady man seems to be able to take bribes just fine and I'm sure Geld has already taught many city enemies already who've snuck in. There are a few ways to go about this, with the first being the worst-case scenario. But I don't see a reason why we can't have fun with this.

pay your fine, criminal scum.

Iocun

We've already talked about this in-game, but I'll repeat here to spark some discussion.

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed. 

In this case, I'd go for a "quest"-based solution of sorts, as it seems much more interesting to me than just having all the proficiency teachers in Delos. I like inequalities between cities. Some cities having things (or lacking things) that none of the others have is cool!

Adrik

Iocun said:

We've already talked about this in-game, but I'll repeat here to spark some discussion.

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed. 

In this case, I'd go for a "quest"-based solution of sorts, as it seems much more interesting to me than just having all the proficiency teachers in Delos. I like inequalities between cities. Some cities having things (or lacking things) that none of the others have is cool!

Why does a novice need to go to a weapon proficiency teacher?

You automatically get that if you are of the class.

Calira

Adrik said:

You automatically get that if you are of the class.

Warhammer proficiency is not given to 2-handers automatically, and lots of people prefer the theme of swinging around a hammer instead of a sword.

Iocun said:

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed.

Hashan doesn't leave guards on the tutors for a reason. It shouldn't be that difficult for the novice's citymates to smuggle them in.

Iocun

Calira said:

Adrik said:

You automatically get that if you are of the class.

Warhammer proficiency is not given to 2-handers automatically, and lots of people prefer the theme of swinging around a hammer instead of a sword.

Iocun said:

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed.

Hashan doesn't leave guards on the tutors for a reason. It shouldn't be that difficult for the novice's citymates to smuggle them in.

Yeah. As long as Hashan is aware of this issue on an OOC level and is willing to "be slightly inattentive" when it comes to those rooms, I'm quite fine with it. Still, I'd be interested to hear from people who actually had to do it.

Austere

Iocun said:

Calira said:

Adrik said:

You automatically get that if you are of the class.

Warhammer proficiency is not given to 2-handers automatically, and lots of people prefer the theme of swinging around a hammer instead of a sword.

Iocun said:

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed.

Hashan doesn't leave guards on the tutors for a reason. It shouldn't be that difficult for the novice's citymates to smuggle them in.

Yeah. As long as Hashan is aware of this issue on an OOC level and is willing to "be slightly inattentive" when it comes to those rooms, I'm quite fine with it. Still, I'd be interested to hear from people who actually had to do it.

While I agree with this, I think generally speaking, relying on players to do the right thing is a crap shoot. Seems like just having multiple tutors would alleviate all concerns. 

Zulah

The one teacher in a city teaches the "shady" weapon skills. So if you're not enemied no big deal. If you are enemied, you gotta do sneaky stuff to learn a sneaky weapon type. It's a fun adventure. No guards anywhere near the teacher too.

Kog

Zulah said:

The one teacher in a city teaches the "shady" weapon skills. So if you're not enemied no big deal. If you are enemied, you gotta do sneaky stuff to learn a sneaky weapon type. It's a fun adventure. No guards anywhere near the teacher too.

Stealth warhammer class when?

Iocun

A warhammer to the skull is a good way to make someone quiet.

Honestly, the idea of a warhammer assassin is somehow super cool to me 

Gallida

Kog said:

Zulah said:

The one teacher in a city teaches the "shady" weapon skills. So if you're not enemied no big deal. If you are enemied, you gotta do sneaky stuff to learn a sneaky weapon type. It's a fun adventure. No guards anywhere near the teacher too.

Stealth warhammer class when?

The class itself should have no stealth abilities but you can't see the person behind the giant warhammer.

Antonius

Austere said:

Iocun said:

Calira said:

Adrik said:

You automatically get that if you are of the class.

Warhammer proficiency is not given to 2-handers automatically, and lots of people prefer the theme of swinging around a hammer instead of a sword.

Iocun said:

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed.

Hashan doesn't leave guards on the tutors for a reason. It shouldn't be that difficult for the novice's citymates to smuggle them in.

Yeah. As long as Hashan is aware of this issue on an OOC level and is willing to "be slightly inattentive" when it comes to those rooms, I'm quite fine with it. Still, I'd be interested to hear from people who actually had to do it.

While I agree with this, I think generally speaking, relying on players to do the right thing is a crap shoot. Seems like just having multiple tutors would alleviate all concerns. 

This has been brought up multiple times. Admins are fine with the current situation for whatever reason.

Iocun said:

Calira said:

Adrik said:

You automatically get that if you are of the class.

Warhammer proficiency is not given to 2-handers automatically, and lots of people prefer the theme of swinging around a hammer instead of a sword.

Iocun said:

I personally don't know how difficult it currently is for a (novice) Hashan enemy to get to those teachers (possibly with help). If it is quite feasible, I'm fine with it as it is, as it adds an interesting challenge in my opinion. If it is very hard however, this should be addressed.

Hashan doesn't leave guards on the tutors for a reason. It shouldn't be that difficult for the novice's citymates to smuggle them in.

Yeah. As long as Hashan is aware of this issue on an OOC level and is willing to "be slightly inattentive" when it comes to those rooms, I'm quite fine with it. Still, I'd be interested to hear from people who actually had to do it.

It's exceptionally easy. I've done it for myself and to help other people get a proficiency. There's no guards and no monolith sigil in the room, and WALK TO <denizen> works while phased so you don't even need to know where you're going. Worst case you'd need two people to help you: a Serpent to phase in, and somebody to portal you to them.

Honestly, it's probably easier to get a proficiency from one of the tutors in Hashan while enemied than it is to get one from any of the tutors in Delos as they're bashed almost constantly (or used to be).

Synthus

As someone that had to sneak into Hashan to get warhammer proficiency from Geld, I can attest that it's easy enough as long as you ask for help from citymates. In my case I believe I was following a citymate that had an earring, while the other citymate snuck in. We earring'd to them, I got the proficiency, patted a totem for being a good boy and doing a good job attacking enemies, we earring'd out, done and done. Didn't even have time to queue up the Mission: Impossible theme.

As Antonius said, Hashan has made a few accommodations regarding the trainer rooms that lets you pop in and pop out quickly. Totems still hinder, but there's no guard stack to wreck you for it. 

Additionally, I was told a player may reach out to Hashan's Minister of Security to arrange passage to the trainers, so that might be an option if a player is in a pinch. However, that was ages ago and before the current Security Minister. I hear their new guy is like one of those guard NPC's from Oblivion, what with the "stop right there, criminal scum!" and the "pay the court a fine or serve your sentence!" Might be better off sneaking in some other way.

Adrik

Synthus said:

As someone that had to sneak into Hashan to get warhammer proficiency from Geld, I can attest that it's easy enough as long as you ask for help from citymates. In my case I believe I was following a citymate that had an earring, while the other citymate snuck in. We earring'd to them, I got the proficiency, patted a totem for being a good boy and doing a good job attacking enemies, we earring'd out, done and done. Didn't even have time to queue up the Mission: Impossible theme.

As Antonius said, Hashan has made a few accommodations regarding the trainer rooms that lets you pop in and pop out quickly. Totems still hinder, but there's no guard stack to wreck you for it. 

Additionally, I was told a player may reach out to Hashan's Minister of Security to arrange passage to the trainers, so that might be an option if a player is in a pinch. However, that was ages ago and before the current Security Minister. I hear their new guy is like one of those guard NPC's from Oblivion, what with the "stop right there, criminal scum!" and the "pay the court a fine or serve your sentence!" Might be better off sneaking in some other way.

Ur damn right i do!

Paux

I think moving them is a good idea, but I'm against them moving just because. Things should have a roleplay reason for happening. 

Like uncovering an event that a certain faction within the city has been attempting to overthrow the current Ruling Court, upset with the current religious influences. When caught,  there's a trial, where the culprits are faced with paying a fee or exile. The faction assassinates (or attempts to) the Minister of Security and flees the city. 

Then we can add to the narrative while functionally making the game better.

Accipiter

Hashan was historically pretty lax on security anyway. Not like Mhaldor or Shallam was with having monks sitting around with mindnet up. Most of the time we don't even notice raids until they start smudging or killing vocal denizens. Even if there was a mono in the room you could get a friend to walk in and shroom it then portal in and it probably wouldn't be noticed for real months until someone saw the mono was gone and they would just think it decayed.

It is changing a bit lately but if you do it when a few specific people aren't around I doubt anyone will see to care.

Meriet

Speaking of weapon tutors, what're the exact syntaxes? Because I can't seem to get Colbey to teach me about swords for the life of me.

Santar

Meriet said:

Speaking of weapon tutors, what're the exact syntaxes? Because I can't seem to get Colbey to teach me about swords for the life of me.

https://www.achaea.com/game-help/?what=proficiencies

Meriet

Santar said:

Meriet said:

Speaking of weapon tutors, what're the exact syntaxes? Because I can't seem to get Colbey to teach me about swords for the life of me.

https://www.achaea.com/game-help/?what=proficiencies

Yeah, but I can't get the syntax right for Colbey
I've tried:
learn proficiency in [blades, swords, straight swords, straightswords, edged blades, edgedblades, edged swords, edgedswords, straightblades, straight blades] from [colbey, colbey######, swordmaster colbey] and it always just returns something confused.

Gallida

You need the specific weapon. So "LEARN PROFICIENCY IN BROADSWORD FROM COLBEY" will work.

Meriet

Ahh, thank you very much!