Class/House Re-design

Sigge

I was wondering, if you could redesign your class/house, or a class/house what would you change and why?

Personally I've been thinking about Priests lately, and the only things I can think of that I would like to change is the Cleric/Knight feel of them, with the "heavy" armor (If we can call splintmail that), the shield and the mace. I would really like to see them go further towards the healing/blessings aspect. Staffs instead of Maces, armour of faith (similar to the skins that Magi and Sylvans have), and loose the shield. Let the Paladins be the Swords/Spears of the light, let the Priests be the Heart/Shields.

Insert all that Jester stuff here for Jesters...

What about Houses? Like the Magi house in Cyrene, with Lupus as the patron. It just doesn't seem to fit the classes and Cyrene to me with the whole "living for the hunt of knowledge, etc".

The Spiritwalkers should be Shaman only, no excuses. Some Houses seem similar to a dump-stat to me.

Anyways, what about the rest of you? I can't think of anything else at the moment...

Tarkanian

Sorta beating a dead horse here...

The issue with houses is not really how it is designed. I rather like houses compared to guilds, because it does not limit an organization to having the same skills only, but having the same ideals. I like that. The issue with houses, in my opinion, is how far and wide the interpretation of an ideal is, for the house member.

On the other hand, Imperian and Lusternia have started going down the house path (moreso Imperian), albeit in a different manner, and I'm rather curious as to how it will pan out. But with regards to the OP, I'm leaning more towards how Lusternia is handling inter-guild relations.

Tarkanian

Daeir said:

Yeah, the Kindred having Lupus as their Patron always felt super weird to me. With Agatheis gone though, there's really nobody else that can take the mantle now, except maybe Vastar.

and post-god deaths, patron choices are even more limited.

Rispok

I would like to see the current house and possibly city systems done away with entirely, as well as orders.

Instead, Orders 2.0 should come around.

It would be an order with specific classes associated, however the overseeing Divine could allow people to join as they wished. Phaestus may have his 'Certimene' inductions set at Jester, Paladin, Runewarden, Infernal, Sylvan, Sentinel, Druid and Alchemist and Scarlatti will have Jester and Bard, even though both Divine would live in similar areas (look at where their temples are).

Phaestus gets pissed off at Rispok the Infernal for pooping on the sofa, so He kicks him out. Scarlatti thought that was pretty funny, so he decides to allow Rispok the Infernal to join His order, even though he doesn't accept Infernals from rebirth.

Katzchen

Tarkanian said:

Daeir said:

Yeah, the Kindred having Lupus as their Patron always felt super weird to me. With Agatheis gone though, there's really nobody else that can take the mantle now, except maybe Vastar.

and post-god deaths, patron choices are even more limited.

Were not most of the slain Divine dormant? 

Vayne

Quite a few were active, but even still that does not mean their orders were not or even that they did not have a culture to delve your character into.

Katzchen

Vayne said:

Quite a few were active, but even still that does not mean their orders were not or even that they did not have a culture to delve your character into.

I was refering to Patron for a house, not joining an Order. A dormant Divine isn't much use to a house, and they cannot really accept patronage either.

Curious as to which ones, other than Keresis were active?

Jacen

With the addition of the request system that goes through the house tutor, patrons/matrons aren't really needed anymore. If no god fits with your House, then don't ask one to be a patron.

Rispok

Jacen said:

With the addition of the request system that goes through the house tutor, patrons/matrons aren't really needed anymore. If no god fits with your House, then don't ask one to be a patron.

There are so many reasons it would be nice to have a patron again. I want to buy a poker table.

Vayne

Ah, I see @Katzchen. With the shoring up of the Garden and the more hardline faction divisions it certainly makes the Gods a commodity. The unaligned Gods' favour will be vied for by the more ideologically open cities which will then have to filter through their past relations with said Gods and culture. It will still be hard to get a good fit it seems, ya. However, the call for Celani gives hope that the remaining Pantheon spots will start filling up again in the near future.

Tahquil

I would mix alchemists with necromancy+occultism+vodun and lean heavily, HEAVILY on the H.P. Lovecraft book 'The Case of Charles Dexter Ward'.

It would involve the astronomy aspects of Alchemy, but given the death of a person the Alchomancer would create the vital salts of the corpse and can raise a doppleganger of said person. The doppleganger would be created like a homunculus and whatever you germinated would debuff the target 1 point of a stat (not stacking with other people's doppies). I'ld love that it would debuff the whole bloodline of said person due to family secrets you can torture of of it but, OP. It would obviously, take a rather long time to create a doppie, and once made you can bestow blessings of curses on it giving them both a offensive and defensive use. It would give people further reason to not suicide rush groups and try to stay alive due to the power over you a person could obtain.

Argys

Tahquil said:

I would mix alchemists with necromancy+occultism+vodun and lean heavily, HEAVILY on the H.P. Lovecraft book 'The Case of Charles Dexter Ward'.

It would involve the astronomy aspects of Alchemy, but given the death of a person the Alchomancer would create the vital salts of the corpse and can raise a doppleganger of said person. The doppleganger would be created like a homunculus and whatever you germinated would debuff the target 1 point of a stat (not stacking with other people's doppies). I'ld love that it would debuff the whole bloodline of said person due to family secrets you can torture of of it but, OP. It would obviously, take a rather long time to create a doppie, and once made you can bestow blessings of curses on it giving them both a offensive and defensive use. It would give people further reason to not suicide rush groups and try to stay alive due to the power over you a person could obtain.

Yes.

Darklyre

Tahquil said:

I would mix alchemists with necromancy+occultism+vodun and lean heavily, HEAVILY on the H.P. Lovecraft book 'The Case of Charles Dexter Ward'.

It would involve the astronomy aspects of Alchemy, but given the death of a person the Alchomancer would create the vital salts of the corpse and can raise a doppleganger of said person. The doppleganger would be created like a homunculus and whatever you germinated would debuff the target 1 point of a stat (not stacking with other people's doppies). I'ld love that it would debuff the whole bloodline of said person due to family secrets you can torture of of it but, OP. It would obviously, take a rather long time to create a doppie, and once made you can bestow blessings of curses on it giving them both a offensive and defensive use. It would give people further reason to not suicide rush groups and try to stay alive due to the power over you a person could obtain.

If you could debuff a whole bloodline then Beldaran would become the most PK'ed person in the game.

Babel

Jacen said:

With the addition of the request system that goes through the house tutor, patrons/matrons aren't really needed anymore. If no god fits with your House, then don't ask one to be a patron.

Not having a Patron is still a very bad idea for numerous reasons.

Akia

Yeah look at the poor Ashura.

Babel

To clarify the point, the House Patron remains an important figure both in and out of character, even if certain important OOC functions have been divorced from the formal role. After all, remember that Shallam was not destroyed until there were no gods remaining to protect it! Additionally, your House Patron will ultimately be a person who keeps a close eye on what happens in your House, involves you in events, and generally tries to make things fun for you. If you have no Patron, sure, you have a way to request that things get done, but if you don't have anyone who's tremendously motivated to make those really big projects happen, well...

Synbios

Babel said:

To clarify the point, the House Patron remains an important figure both in and out of character, even if certain important OOC functions have been divorced from the formal role. After all, remember that Shallam was not destroyed until there were no gods remaining to protect it! Additionally, your House Patron will ultimately be a person who keeps a close eye on what happens in your House, involves you in events, and generally tries to make things fun for you. If you have no Patron, sure, you have a way to request that things get done, but if you don't have anyone who's tremendously motivated to make those really big projects happen, well...

I suspected that Ashtan won't get destroyed by the dala'myrr for that exact reason.

Delphinus

Babel said:

Additionally, your House Patron will ultimately be a person who keeps a close eye on what happens in your House, involves you in events, and generally tries to make things fun for you. If you have no Patron, sure, you have a way to request that things get done, but if you don't have anyone who's tremendously motivated to make those really big projects happen, well...

That's a big potential downside, but it's sometimes difficult for those houses to see what they're missing out on. This is especially true if the house is cut off from the rest of the world, and it can be reinforced by, say, a history of inert or unmotivated patrons.

Melodie

*squint Delphinus*

Delphinus

@Melodie: I have precisely one example in mind, and if you know me, you probably know which example it is.

Blujixapug

Delphinus said:

@Melodie: I have precisely one example in mind, and if you know me, you probably know which example it is.

It's Lupus right.

Jarrod

Blujixapug

Tahquil said:

I would mix alchemists with necromancy+occultism+vodun and lean heavily, HEAVILY on the H.P. Lovecraft book 'The Case of Charles Dexter Ward'.

It would involve the astronomy aspects of Alchemy, but given the death of a person the Alchomancer would create the vital salts of the corpse and can raise a doppleganger of said person. The doppleganger would be created like a homunculus and whatever you germinated would debuff the target 1 point of a stat (not stacking with other people's doppies). I'ld love that it would debuff the whole bloodline of said person due to family secrets you can torture of of it but, OP. It would obviously, take a rather long time to create a doppie, and once made you can bestow blessings of curses on it giving them both a offensive and defensive use. It would give people further reason to not suicide rush groups and try to stay alive due to the power over you a person could obtain.

@Tahquil That reminds me of this.

Also to derail less...

I would redesign Elementalism to let mages specialise with a particular element, reskinning some of their abilities and giving them a few new ones.

I would redo sylvan Elementalism to revolve more around weatherworking. The four winds, rain and snow, sun and cloud, drought and floods. Perhaps also with specialisations. And they could bond their viridian form with different environments: forest, jungle, desert, swamp.

I would redesign Dawnstriders to be a specifically anti-serpent House and class. They'd still be sort of picaresque rogues with assassin tendencies, and they'd have evade and bows and possibly hypnosis, but they wouldn't have fangs or secrete venom or have scaled skin. Instead of snakes they'd have mongooses. They'd undergo some rite of initiation related to Aurora or Deucalion and gain an ability to see through illusions.

I would redo jesters to not exist, ha haa.

I would redo monks so all the different monk Houses used different Tekura styles, and it would be like an old wuxia story or kung fu movie. The pot-bellied, bald-headed Ashuran monk proudly boasts, "My tiger style is superior!" The bearded Black Lotus monk scoffs, "The patient symmetry of my lotus style is more than a match for your tiger style!" The scar-faced Tanjinn gives a contemptuous snort and interrupts, "My mantis style will defeat the both of you at once!"

Argys

Lol'd at pot-bellied monk and all the rest following.

Darklyre

Look okay I just want to be able to have a monk from the Ashura, Sentaari, Black Lotus, Mojushai, and Ebon Fist all meet up at the teahouse in Thera and dramatically flip tables in anger.

We also need the ability to flip tables. I'm sure @Ruth agrees.

Tvistor

Monk House rivalry would instantly become cooler than Serpent House rivalry.

In retrospect that's not that big an accomplishment unless you find shrugging lines really interesting.

Nim

I like all of @Blujixaohgodyourname's ideas (especially monks, can we do that please?!), except the jester one. I'd turn jesters into some crazy rogueish class, somewhat like a non-musical bard or a flashier version of the serpent class. I'd also want to make them even harder to master than serpents, because if you're going to be a jester and you're going to go around killing people, I want that to basically be a pinnacle of awesomeness in its own right, and I want players that pull it off to be rightly feared.

Also, because I'm selfish, I'd totally ignore the logic of Mojushai having Blademasters, and put them in the Wardens instead, because I want to be in the wardens, but I'm allergic to knight classes.

ETA: Actually, house-based differences in skills might be a cool idea, if they were the exception rather than the norm and they made a lot of sense, eg. Dawnstriders being anti-Serpents, Monks having different styles rather than just all relying on Tekura, maybe even minor changes in abilities, like Shallamese Blademasters using Spirit instead of Void because Void is bad or something like that.

Blujixapug

Darklyre said:

Look okay I just want to be able to have a monk from the Ashura, Sentaari, Black Lotus, Mojushai, and Ebon Fist all meet up at the teahouse in Thera and dramatically flip tables in anger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WZvzB7zG_HM

Kazu

I wanted to link a video from Jet Li's Fearless (2006) version with the fight on the giant wooden tower, but i can't find a single video of it.