Bounty clarification

Zbaco

Would like to request a clarification on bounties. First, some words from HELP BOUNTY:

The bounty system provides a way for cities to track and reward retribution for offences against the city.

There can be only one unclaimed bounty on a person's head at a time.

Bounty filers are responsible for the bounties filed. Do your homework.

Now, consider the following sequence of events:

1. City Enemy raids the city as part of a raiding group. (We'll call this Raid #1).
2. Enemy is charged with Raiding (a City crime).
3. Security Minister files a bounty against Enemy (Bounty #1).
4. While this bounty is still available to be claimed, Enemy raids twice more (Raid #2 and Raid #3).
5. Enemy is charged with Raiding for Raid #2 and Raid #3 (two additional charges).
6. A member of the City Army claims the existing bounty (for Raid #1) and completes it.
---
7. Security Minister files Bounty #2 against Enemy, for Raid #2.
8. Army member claims and completes Bounty #2.
9. Security Minister files Bounty #3 against Enemy, for Raid #3.
10. Army member claims and completes Bounty #3.

My question, then - are steps 7-10 allowed under the bounty system, as long as the bounties are being logged and tracked properly?

[Deleted User]

It would likely follow the 'reasonable timeframe' common sense rule. That is to say if they raid twice, don't bounty them for the second raid if it took like five years for the bounty to be completed.

If it's allowed at all, that is. I was always under the impression that their death cleared crimes regardless personally, and never 'renewed' bounties when the previous was completed/let go. Morthif handles it the same way, to my knowledge.

Aegoth

Stacking bounties like that is generally frowned upon.. just like stacking year terms for offences

Vinzent

It is, at the very least, frowned upon like @Aegoth said. Although I have never seen explicit clarification from the Admin, I wouldn't engage in it and encourage against it. If nothing else, see that no other city (or their MoS, anyhow) stacks bounties.

Taryius

It is far too similar too the cause stacking of old and that just leaves a sour taste in my mouth. 

If your army isn't actively accepting bounties on raiders between raids, I don't think you should be able to 'save' them up.

It also makes it clear to people that are looking to resolve bounty statuses that they only need to die once, rather than some hidden probably inaccurate number held in some scroll.

Zbaco

Regardless, I'd appreciate some official clarification, as it makes sense (to me at least) that if Person is charged with crimes A, B, and C, that they should not be surprised in the slightest if they end up with the corresponding bounties A, B, and C. Actions have consequences, you know?

Melodie

Consequences within a reasonable time frame, is the key phrase there.

Also, it kind of reminds me of counting cause a little bit, which is an unpleasant reminder.

Zbaco

Melodie said:

Consequences within a reasonable time frame, is the key phrase there.

Out of curiosity, what do you consider a 'reasonable timeframe'?

Morsul

I think the generally accepted practice is to add the rewards under one single bounty. So if each instance of raiding warrants 5k gold reward, then all three instances will go towards one bounty with 15k gold as a reward.

[Deleted User]

Zbaco said:

Out of curiosity, what do you consider a 'reasonable timeframe'?

It's literally in HELP PK what a 'reasonable timeframe' is considered to be. PK rules extend to bounties as well.

Zbaco

Pyori said:

Zbaco said:

Out of curiosity, what do you consider a 'reasonable timeframe'?

It's literally in HELP PK what a 'reasonable timeframe' is considered to be. PK rules extend to bounties as well.

Fair enough. Just looking for a hard 'after THIS long don't bother' number too, really.

[Deleted User]

Zbaco said:

Fair enough. Just looking for a hard 'after THIS long don't bother' number too, really.

That's not going to happen. The PK rules are common sense, not hard a hard number on anything anymore for reasons exactly like this. Situations like this is literally why the PK rules were completely overhauled in the first place. Use your head, chances are if literally everyone is telling you something is bad, then it's bad.

Morthif

it's my understanding, but with no Admin conversation to back it up, that if you have a bounty on you you can't 'earn' another until the current on is completed/expired/deleted.

Edit: I don't remember where this fact came from but that's how I've been handling Ashtan bounties since day 1 as MoS.

Atalkez

If anything you delete the previous bounty and refresh with the new charge.

Zbaco

Pyori said:

Zbaco said:

Fair enough. Just looking for a hard 'after THIS long don't bother' number too, really.

That's not going to happen. The PK rules are common sense, not hard a hard number on anything anymore for reasons exactly like this. Situations like this is literally why the PK rules were completely overhauled in the first place. Use your head, chances are if literally everyone is telling you something is bad, then it's bad.

No need to be insulting, now. As a new MoS, I wasn't sure how it should work and figured I'd ask about it before haring off down a (potentially) incorrect path.

Kresslack

Atalkez said:

If anything you delete the previous bounty and refresh with the new charge.

Issue with that is if the bounty is close to expiring, you're not allowed to delete and repost it.

Maybe a simple addition to allow Security Ministers to UPDATE posted bounties would help.

Taryius

Kresslack said:

Atalkez said:

If anything you delete the previous bounty and refresh with the new charge.

Issue with that is if the bounty is close to expiring, you're not allowed to delete and repost it.

Maybe a simple addition to allow Security Ministers to UPDATE posted bounties would help.

Bounties should only begin to expire if they've been accepted. Could delete/re-post bounties that have yet to be accepted and therefor have yet to begin their expiry countdown.

Adrik

Speaking as somoene who.. well. Was a MoS.

If they...

Raid
Get Bountied
Raid again
Bounty completed on them DURING said Raid.

You can bounty them after the fact, whenever the fighting is over and you are putting charges up, etc.

You should never 'save' up bounties though and drop 30 on a person for each individual instance of law breaking. Not only is that bad (tm), but it will get you. The Minister of Security, hired upon, if not outright spam-killed for each instance of this.

As the Minister of Security, YOU are at fault for bad bounties or excessive shit like that. (Unless the City Leader put them up). Just remember that.

[Deleted User]

Zbaco said:

Pyori said:

Zbaco said:

Fair enough. Just looking for a hard 'after THIS long don't bother' number too, really.

That's not going to happen. The PK rules are common sense, not hard a hard number on anything anymore for reasons exactly like this. Situations like this is literally why the PK rules were completely overhauled in the first place. Use your head, chances are if literally everyone is telling you something is bad, then it's bad.

No need to be insulting, now. As a new MoS, I wasn't sure how it should work and figured I'd ask about it before haring off down a (potentially) incorrect path.

Literally none of that was insulting.

Sophi

Cause counting is bad mmkay

Dochitha

Since there's no admin confirmation, set your own rules Zbaco. You have entire city backing you up. Roar!

That said if you asked me, I felt 1 ig year buffer is good. So person raids twice, bounty one claimed and completed, and it's still within a year, post up bounty 2. But this is just my opinion. Just feel having a time frame, whatever it is, looks nicer. 

Archaeon

Ask the Senate. 

Vinzent

You can't delete and refresh bounties. Either they get deleted and need a new crime committed after the fact, or it stays gone. This does have Admin clarification.

Krizal

I've issued myself previously to ask what the rules were regarding posting another bounty on someone for crimes committed before their previous bounty was completed, whether it'd be acceptable within a certain time frame etc.

Here's the response I got:

Message #5612       Sent by Anytus

2019/3/09/17:45 Greetings, regarding issue #84802: Thank you for your patience while we discussed this matter. Our policy on this would be that filing bounties retroactively in this fashion would not be appropriate, and should an enemy commit further crimes while an existing bounty has yet to be completed, we would advise looking at alternative means of recourse such as expanded charges or fines. If you have any other questions, please feel free to get in touch via ISSUE ME!

Zbaco

Krizal said:

I've issued myself previously to ask what the rules were regarding posting another bounty on someone for crimes committed before their previous bounty was completed, whether it'd be acceptable within a certain time frame etc.

Here's the response I got:

Message #5612       Sent by Anytus

2019/3/09/17:45 Greetings, regarding issue #84802: Thank you for your patience while we discussed this matter. Our policy on this would be that filing bounties retroactively in this fashion would not be appropriate, and should an enemy commit further crimes while an existing bounty has yet to be completed, we would advise looking at alternative means of recourse such as expanded charges or fines. If you have any other questions, please feel free to get in touch via ISSUE ME!

Thank you, this is exactly the type of straightforward yea/nay admin decision that I was looking for in the first place. I recently issued myself with much the same question, and hopefully the reply to my issue will be consistent with the one you received. Thanks again.

Astarod

I know this is Necroing a pretty old thread, but could this be added to the BOUNTY helpfile? Imyrr and I just had to ask around until this thread was cited. Please!