Should I Just Start Over?

Minifie

85 is past the start of the hump, 92 onwards is like jumping off the cliff you just climbed up.

Cooper

Ahmet said:

Less than halfway when it comes to raw numbers, but as far as bashing times go 85 is probably about halfway, give or take a few levels.

Very inaccurate.

91.25 or so is halfway xp wise. Halfway time wise is around 89.xx.

Druids in Mhaldor don't really fit, but that doesn't mean it can't be done.

The city can assist with class changes of people who are stuck in a forestal class, but we aren't going to do it for everyone. You'll need to prove you're going to be active and openly participating in city activities before that happens. We've had probably 2-3 people in the last year return and ask for credits to switch from druid/sentinel/sylvan. None of them have stuck around more than a few days.

Sarathai

Krypton said:

Sarathai said:

Eventually you're stuck with what's in your staff (I would recommend getting a Splinter, too, since otherwise once your grove runs out of sunlight you won't be able to resummon a new one from it).

Or just customise a regular quarterstaff to be resetting.

You can do that, yes, though if you do and port your grove, last I checked it won't pop up in your inventory immediately like a Splinter will.

Nakari

I played a sylvan in Mhaldor from the release of alchemists, when they were prevented from joining, to a few real life years after. Technically I'm still about, but only in very brief bits, at least for the moment. I'm not sure if there's actually been another active forestal since I was, so I might be in the best spot for some of this advice. 

Mhaldor has always allowed people to stay forestal, and thus far never forced anyone to make a switch, though this could of course change with a new Sartan and such (I've no experience with the currently active Sartan, myself). That said, being a forestal limit your advancement in the long run. If I remember right, forestals weren't allowed to join Sartan's order when I was last playing, and that likely puts limits on how far you can actually advance in things, so it's something of a mixed bag. If you actually ran into that though, the city would doubtlessly pay for you to change class. Also note that if you ever want to multi class, you can't take apostate or infernal.

Where I'll disagree with some of the people in this thread is whether forestals fit within Mhaldor. The city was plenty gung-ho about being anti-Eleusis/capital-N Nature for a long while while they had to have forestals for curatives, and people didn't seriously argue that the powers themselves were inherently incompatible until a good time after we got alchemists, so I think there's plenty of room to argue why it works just fine, at the very least. That said, plenty of people ICly don't believe it works, so you'll get plenty of stares/comments/people asking why you don't just switch.

You will be forest enemied for existing, this I can confirm. It's actually a relatively recent rule change, before you had to be part of an exterm run or something of the sort, now they'll enemy you as soon as they see you've imprinted a grove. However, forest enemying is really just an annoyance, and some of the stuff said so far has simply been incorrect.

 The only thing being forest enemied means is that you'll be damaged by forest enemies in forest/jungle rooms (including your grove), and your grove resurrection will take more energy for you to use. Other then that, everything's worked fine in my personal experience, including imprinting/seal/preservation/creating new quarterstaves/return (I did almost all of this a week ago, as a matter of fact). So no need for an artifact staff, you can just pop into your grove, take a bit of damage as you get a new staff, and walk back out. The stuff you need most for fighting and such are staff powers anyways, so most of the time you won't even notice.

Overall, it's an interesting and unique role that I've had a lot of fun with personally, but it's very much an against-type role, obviously enough. You'll stand out, you won't ever be an archetypical Mhaldorian, but you'll get to play in a role that few people have explored the potential of. 

Krypton

Afaik, if your Grove is still generating sunlight, that sounds like a bug with the forest enemying system.

Unless the High Warden has some special command (like excommunicate) she has to use specifically for that, or something.

Tesha

You should definitely come back, there's great acceptance of people who come back from dormancy. People are generally really patient with helping others, I'm sure people in Mhaldor will help you out. There's an active Sartan right now and I've heard some great stuff about him and the event currently unfolding in Mhaldor, it's a pretty good time to return. Good luck!

Nakari

Krypton said:

Afaik, if your Grove is still generating sunlight, that sounds like a bug with the forest enemying system.

Unless the High Warden has some special command (like excommunicate) she has to use specifically for that, or something.

Unless it was recently changed, this isn't the case. Forest enemying has never blocked sunlight gain for forestals (and being Mhaldorian, I've known several over the years), and has never been intended to. Forest enemy has always been fairly distinct from excom/anathema in that respect.

I haven't been following things closely lately, so if something in the enemy mechanics itself was intended to change with the removal of oakstone, then maybe, but I didn't see anything to indicate that being the case in the news posts, or in any of the documentation. 

Krypton

That's true, the last update made public information was from a time Oakstone still existed:

All Sunlight (be it grove, or quarterstaff) usage by Oakstone enemies is increased to 300% of normal.

Kiet

Seems like it's working as intended then

Tahquil

While Mhaldor may be a bit more welcoming now for grandfathered classes, I know there was a stint where Viceroys were demanding you quit your forestal class or be ousted and enemied to the city. I tried to get Gildenlow to come back to activity and he was pinned down by a Viceroy because he was still Sentinel within his first hour of returning. And that pretty much killed any interest he had left for Achaea.

Nakari

I could be wrong, really. I haven't played actively in Mhaldor in several years (though I've popped up sometimes for decent stints). So if that's a more recent thing, then they might have gotten harsher.

It's always depended a little on who's talking to you though. There was definitely someone higher up in house/city leadership a handful of years ago who announced people had to chance, only to get corrected a few days later.

Cooper

Mhaldor used to be the city of rp without regard for OOC considerations. That was a really cool feeling but sometimes really not fun.

That's changed a lot! 

Minifie

Daeir said:

Wouldn't say that's a change for the better, honestly. An entire city-state exists to egregiously capitulate to other people's OOC enjoyment of the game at the expense of the world, it doesn't need another one.

Because that's exactly what Cooper said we do, I mean, it couldn't possibly mean that Mhaldor has loosened the chains on players to account for OOC stuff to not punish players, but lets go for the fact it's ruining the game world, that makes logical sense.

Kiet

Mhaldor punishes people all the time, we're just more considerate for OOC circumstances than we once were. That's a necessary thing in a game that's past its prime populationwise.

Jonathin

Getting punished for ic stuff is cool. Getting punished because a kid decided to stuff a knife into an outlet is not so cool.

There has to be some give and take and it seems like Mhaldor found a p good balance.

Cooper

Daeir said:

Wouldn't say that's a change for the better, honestly. An entire city-state exists to egregiously capitulate to other people's OOC enjoyment of the game at the expense of the world, it doesn't need another one.

Like usual, you're entirely off the mark here.

A city that discourages people OOCly and makes them dislike playing in a faction is extremely toxic.

A city that RPs while encouraging people OOC is good for the game.

I have absolutely no clue why you would try to put either me or Mhaldor down for this. We are 100% benefitting the game.

Trey

Cooper said:

Daeir said:

Wouldn't say that's a change for the better, honestly. An entire city-state exists to egregiously capitulate to other people's OOC enjoyment of the game at the expense of the world, it doesn't need another one.

I have absolutely no clue why you would try to put either me or Mhaldor down for this. We are 100% benefitting the game.

Because the Daeir's salt crust thickness is rivaled only by those found in the Bonneville Flats.

Minifie

Once again, you post absolute drivel without actually understanding the core point made. Mhaldor as a City is just as strict IC while affording some wiggle for OOC consideration. This was NOT a thing at all more than a decade ago, didn't progress fast enough? Gone, shit tier fighter? Gone, didn't pick up on the core tennents fast enough and perfectly? Gone gone gone.

Mhaldor was also pathetically small, with ~250+ players on mhaldor was the only city that could potentially rock an empty cwho, with hashan closely behind. By keeping IC strictness without the complete ignorance for OOC situations has helped Mhaldor only, and has done 0 harm to the game.

Want to know something funny? Tanjinn almost had 1 active member during 02 (iirc, Cooper may confirm). You give a shit about Ooc wellbeing and your players will take any shit IC, because they know you aren't out to shit on them

if you want to argue ignoring anything OOC in regards to situation enhances roleplay, then argue away, hell, make Targossas adopt it, but comparing mhaldor going from the past level to our acceptabe level is the same as Cyrene, then you are demonstrably wrong.

Kiet

Daeir, without trying to offend you, do you not ever stop and think 'everyone is constantly calling me clueless, maybe they're at least partially right?'

You also didn't play the 'Mhaldor of old' since afaik you've been playing for far less than Cooper and I, and we're talking about stuff from back then.

Mhaldor doesn't 'put ooc over ic' on any kind of a consistent basis. We're talking shit like 'this person works 50 hours a week and can barely log in' or 'this person had a crisis in their life and they can't do their tasks to their best.'

If you think we shouldn't consider that, then you may be a psychopath, because the only reason it wasn't considered in the past was because so many of the players were teens without the empathy people around their 30s are supposed to develop.

Trey

Daeir said:

APB, APB! Mhaldor forum brigade scramble! Daeir posted a thing!

If I were Targossian you'd still be getting called out for being a salty little fuck.

Also lightspire sux. Trufax.

Durian

But you didn't make a hypothetical assumption about what Mhaldor could do, you specifically called the change Cooper alluded to a bad change.

P.S. The word capitulate triggers me, can we form a safe zone from that word please?

Trey

Daeir said:

-SNIP-
Does that clarify what I mean a little better?

Since that is a different stance than was perceived in your original reply to Cooper, no. But this is probably what you meant to begin with, I take it?

Kiet

You should re-read what you post before you post it, then.

Farrah

Yeah, you basically just agreed with exactly what Cooper said, after telling him Mhaldor was worse because of it.

Cooper

Daeir should probably re-read what he's responding to as well.

@Daeir No one but you is talking about tasks or requirements or progression.

My comment about OOC considerations was in response directly to Tahquil and Nakari regarding people being forced to change class or quit the city upon return from dormancy as a 'not allowed' class.

You then responded directly to me and said you didn't think that was a change for the better.

I responded telling you that you are off the mark and that a city that discourages people OOCly is bad, and that RP with OOC encouragement is good.

Then you posted saying that you weren't talking about Mhaldor - despite replying directly to me about Mhaldor - and then tried to twist my comment to mean something that was the opposite of what I said. And also you brought IC tasks for an unknown reason.

Your next post lays down an attack on others while saying you shouldn't concern yourself with those who will attack you (on the forums).

You then twisted the meaning of your original post again, said again you didn't mean Mhaldor despite your original comment talking about Mhaldor.

...actually, you know what, this isn't worth it.

tl;dr you brought up a lot of stuff that had nothing to do with anything being discussed and repeatedly changed your stance while being extremely negative in response to us trying to help someone who wasn't sure if they had a place anymore in Mhaldor or the game.

Go fly a kite.

Reyson

That's some whacky contortionism, holy hell. 

Edit: Daeir, not Cooper

Antidas

Cooper said:

Daeir should probably re-read what he's responding to as well.

@Daeir No one but you is talking about tasks or requirements or progression.

My comment about OOC considerations was in response directly to Tahquil and Nakari regarding people being forced to change class or quit the city upon return from dormancy as a 'not allowed' class.

You then responded directly to me and said you didn't think that was a change for the better.

I responded telling you that you are off the mark and that a city that discourages people OOCly is bad, and that RP with OOC encouragement is good.

Then you posted saying that you weren't talking about Mhaldor - despite replying directly to me about Mhaldor - and then tried to twist my comment to mean something that was the opposite of what I said. And also you brought IC tasks for an unknown reason.

Your next post lays down an attack on others while saying you shouldn't concern yourself with those who will attack you (on the forums).

You then twisted the meaning of your original post again, said again you didn't mean Mhaldor despite your original comment talking about Mhaldor.

...actually, you know what, this isn't worth it.

tl;dr you brought up a lot of stuff that had nothing to do with anything being discussed and repeatedly changed your stance while being extremely negative in response to us trying to help someone who wasn't sure if they had a place anymore in Mhaldor or the game.

Go fly a kite.

Not taking a stance on the actual argument, but I gotta say - I particularly enjoy how you intentionally left all your post in there, while proceeding to say that it wasn't worth it to post at all lol. If its not worth it, then don't post. Otherwise, don't say its not worth it, because it clearly is! Y'all make no sense

Aegoth

It's called dramatic irony

Xaden

Guess how many people were playing the game at noon GMT? 47.

This is not a big community.

We should probably all try not to be cunts to one and other.

Durian

He's trying to make peace, get him Americans!