Trade skill ideas

Asmodron

Boredom here again,


So while looking at the tradeskills I found they generally have a lackluster feel, especially with the design skills which are basically for show and give almost no form of bonus. Here are some random examples (Dont hurt me..)


Cooking: I tried to refrain from flavor concepts of 'salty, bitter, sweet' as I thought it might be conflicting with certain dish descriptions, and so I focused more on texture qualities.

Crisp - Making a dish have a crisp quality will grant a slight boost to health for 1 hour when eaten(2% boost?)
Heavy - Making a dish heavy with flavors will make it far more satisfying when eaten
Smooth - Making a dish have a smooth quality will grant a slight boost to mana for 1 hour when eaten. (2% boost?)


Jewelery:

Amulet - Wearing an amulet will reduce the cost of experience on death


Tailoring:

Fashion - Wearing fashionable clothing will result in less distaste from villagers
Apron - An apron will allow you to cook faster or forge faster
Thicker - Thicker clothing will result in getting much less cold in certain areas: Waistcoat only  Apparently already exists.
Caparison - covering your steed in a caparison will not only show your colors (if your herald inscribes it on the caparison), but also will allow it to do slightly better in jousting

Antonius

They're primarily for show by design. The moment things start conveying mechanical benefits they stop becoming roleplay aiding luxuries and become a requirement. Tailors can already increase the amount of warmth an item gives, but no to the rest.

Khaibit

In tailoring, you can already make clothing thicker.
There are traits that let you sew longer lasting things and faster. 
I am not really sure what the point of adding these things to the skill is. 

Fashion? Would that mean denizens didn't hate you as much for murdering them? What about dragons, no one cares what a dragon is wearing. No one cares what the person murdering you is wearing.

Amulet n jewellery? As in, only the jeweller can get that benefit, or any amulet gives you less xp loss? That seems more like an artifact than something that a shiny trinket can give you. 

Food giving a benefit? Why? What about the food would mean that there was an xp gain? is it spiked with something magic?

Asmodron

Antonius said:

They're primarily for show by design. The moment things start conveying mechanical benefits they stop becoming roleplay aiding luxuries and become a requirement. Tailors can already increase the amount of warmth an item gives, but no to the rest.

While I agree they are primarily for design, but they are also rather unimportant. Many simply dont notice or even care to have clothing of a certain look, simply because it isnt something people notice unless they look very carefully, and in a pk world like Achaea, that wont happen very often. I was suggesting small bonuses as to make these trade skills have some more significance.

Asmodron

Khaibit said:

In tailoring, you can already make clothing thicker.
There are traits that let you sew longer lasting things and faster. 
I am not really sure what the point of adding these things to the skill is. 

Fashion? Would that mean denizens didn't hate you as much for murdering them? What about dragons, no one cares what a dragon is wearing. No one cares what the person murdering you is wearing.

Amulet n jewellery? As in, only the jeweller can get that benefit, or any amulet gives you less xp loss? That seems more like an artifact than something that a shiny trinket can give you. 

Food giving a benefit? Why? What about the food would mean that there was an xp gain? is it spiked with something magic?

Fashion was just a random idea themed towards tailoring, which was based on the idea of village feelings not being accumulated as much. I thought that people will generally consider repreiving those that seemed of higher station, rather than a common vagabond.

Amulet was simply an item, like a brooch of thoth, that when worn would reduce xp loss upon death


And food is generally based on the nutritional value concept. Eating something makes you more healthy, or more aware, thus health and mana. It would be a concept based on skill and 'magical' since you are making the food to have that quality.

Kayeil

It's a concept that is very Lusternian in nature. I am not sure if they still have it there, but consuming food items could have different bonuses, and they had robes there you could apply different benefits to.

Khaibit

I am not keen on the idea of making them a necessity, rather than just a fun thing

Antonius

They don't need to have "significance" from a PvP/PvE point of view. The most significant things to a lot of players are the purely cosmetic things like clothing, jewellery, food, and all the other customisations that are possible.

I don't even know what "a certain look" means, but I think you're probably wrong. A lot of people put a lot of thought into the style of clothing that their character wears, the colours that suit their character/their character likes, etc. Unless you mean that people have individual styles, rather than there being a constantly shifting sense of what's "hot" across the realm, which... yes, Achaea doesn't have fashion magazines, which I personally think is a good thing.

What even determines whether an item of clothing is "fashionable"? If you can just mark whatever you like as fashionable when designing clothing then the entire system is pointless.

Kayeil

I thought it an odd feature in Lusternia and wasn't a fan, especially the robes thing. I don't feel it fits well into Achaea.

Asmodron

mmm, if people wish to keep them 'design only', then I can respect that.

Kayeil

I think the only real advantage I can see to bonuses being added to crafting items of any sort would be more sales for designers, but again that works better in Lusternia because they have a lot of shops with a much smaller playerbase, where we have a larger playerbase with only enough shops to accommodate a smaller fraction of the population.

Asmodron

Since this thread exists, I may as well make good use of it by placing this suggestion here.


The Gathering skill seems to have a unique deficiency about it, in that it is the only Trade skill that gains its main useful ability upon Trans (butchering), compared to the other trade skills. This seems generally unfair for the Gathering trade skill, with the other trade skills having much more beneficial use in term of market gain from an early level and onward.

Additionally, Almost 90% of the abilities in gathering are for cooking, which is more of a design skill, when in truth the gathering skill was initially made to compliment the inkmilling skill, whereas the main ability and ingredients for Inkmilling are all contained in 1 ability at trans.


The Gathering skill itself:

One gains the ability of Clay (red clay and gold flakes) and later Lumic as inkmilling ingredients. They gain nothing else until Butchering, which in itself is the most beneficial of abilities.

Butchering:

Butchering contains 6 ingredients, ingredients which are pivotal to Inkmilling. These ingredients are: red chitin, yellow chitin, ink bladder, fish scales, shark teeth, buffalo horn, and wyrm tongue.

Rather than keep it all at Trans skill, I think it would make much more sense (and more fair) to make the Butchering skill gained early, perhaps at Apprentice, and then add the different ingredients able to be butchered as one learns in the skill.

So to compare, this is the current Gathering skill:

These are the abilities available in this skill
-----------------------------------------------
Clay                Red clay occasionally contains flakes of gold.
Saltwater           Pure essence of the ocean.
Fruit               Delicious and juicy edibles.
Grain               Wheat, rice, corn, maize, barley, oats, rye...
Vegetables          Healthy food to help you grow big and strong.
Eggs                Boil 'em, fry 'em, put 'em in a souffle.
Milk                It does a body good!
Nuts                Crunchy garnishes for your meals.
Olives              Versatile fruit grown in fertile soil.
Sugarcane           Sweet-tasting plant that rots your teeth.
Lumic               Blue moss growing underground.
Cacao               Cacao pods that can be refined into chocolate.
Refining            Turn ordinary items into something extraordinary.
Dust                Valuable diamond dust gathered underground.
Butchering          Select the choicest cuts of meat from your prey.


I suggest it would be much more fair and provide a better use for upcoming gatherers, if it became this:

These are the abilities available in this skill
-----------------------------------------------
Clay                Red clay occasionally contains flakes of gold.
Butchering          Select the choicest cuts of meat from your prey.
Saltwater           Pure essence of the ocean.
Fruit               Delicious and juicy edibles.
Grain               Wheat, rice, corn, maize, barley, oats, rye...
Chitin               Harvest the scorpion chitin for inks
Vegetables          Healthy food to help you grow big and strong.
Squid                 Squid bladder used for inks
Scales                Harvest fish scales for inks
Eggs                Boil 'em, fry 'em, put 'em in a souffle.
Milk                It does a body good!
Sharkteeth         Harvest shark teeth for inks
Nuts                Crunchy garnishes for your meals.
Olives              Versatile fruit grown in fertile soil.
BuffaloHorns    Harvest buffalo horns for inks
Sugarcane         Sweet-tasting plant that rots your teeth.
Lumic               Blue moss growing underground.
Cacao               Cacao pods that can be refined into chocolate.
Refining            Turn ordinary items into something extraordinary.
Dust                 Valuable diamond dust gathered underground.
WyrmTongue    Harvest wyrm tongues for inks.




@Sarapis

Anrin

Helms! I would love to be able to wear a helmet in the game. They don't even have to confer any benefit.

Qwyn

Toz, is that you?

Anrin

Who, me? Nope.

Citrus

Asmodron said:

Tradeskill stuff

Absolutely agree.  Tradeskills are completely unbalanced as they are, but I believe that since they are thought of as 'RP' tools now that balancing them isn't a priority for the Garden.  Gathering supports Inkmilling and Cooking, moreso cooking.  So a free tradeskills supports a 150 credit tradeskill, that's pretty silly.  You should add the ability to gather cooking materials to the Cooking tradeskill and keep Gathering for Inkmilling, as it stands for someone wanting to make Inks a lot of the Gathering skill is useless but you still have to Trans it to Butcher so you can make inks, even red ink you have to be Trans to get the required reagents.

Then you have Synthesis which is basically Harvesting and Remedies in ONE skill, you can gather materials AND make curatives.  And the most ridiculous thing is that the 3 primes needed to make literally everything in Synthesis is one of the first skills you get.  If you're wanting the best return on tradeskills then Synthesis is a no-brainer, 110 credits to be able to gather and craft any curative you need.  Compared to making inks, 220 credits needed just to be able to make each type of ink.

Antonius

Synthesis only makes minerals, which require extracting then synthesising versus just harvesting. If you want to make elixirs and salves, you will need Remedies regardless if you take Harvesting to use herbs or Synthesis to use minerals or opt to take neither and buy herbs/minerals to use. Tradeskills are, by design, not intended to be fully self-sufficient in order to promote trade between players - the skill to create doesn't also give you the ability to gather materials. That's also why taking a large number of tradeskills is (to a certain extent) prohibitively expensive.

Venoms, for example, require inks plus herbs or minerals. If you take Toxicology, and want to be able to gather everything you need without buying from another person, you'll need to take Harvesting/Synthesis and Inkmilling. For Inkmilling you'll then need Gathering.

Dairon

Antonius said:

Synthesis only makes minerals, which require extracting then synthesising versus just harvesting. If you want to make elixirs and salves, you will need Remedies regardless if you take Harvesting to use herbs or Synthesis to use minerals or opt to take neither and buy herbs/minerals to use. Tradeskills are, by design, not intended to be fully self-sufficient in order to promote trade between players - the skill to create doesn't also give you the ability to gather materials. That's also why taking a large number of tradeskills is (to a certain extent) prohibitively expensive.

Venoms, for example, require inks plus herbs or minerals. If you take Toxicology, and want to be able to gather everything you need without buying from another person, you'll need to take Harvesting/Synthesis and Inkmilling. For Inkmilling you'll then need Gathering.

Having learned Gathering, Ink milling, and finally toxicology.. I would not recommend this