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  • NizarisNizaris The Holy City of MhaldorMember Posts: 537 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited November 2012
    I would settle for getting truly-aligned classes to stick to their alignments, and letting all else be free-agents. So:

    Ashtan: Occultist
    Hashan: No exclusive
    Mhaldor: Apostate, Infernal
    Shallam: Priest, Paladin
    Eleusis: Druid, Sylvan, Sentinel
    Delos: Bard, maybe?
    Cyrene: Bard, maybe?

    Free-agents: Serpent, Shaman, Jester, Runewarden, Blademaster, Monk, Alchemist, Magi, etc ...

    Would also support the idea of new classes for Hashan, Cyrene and Delos that exemplify their ethos. Hashan, especially, would be intriguing. I would recommend a vampire or werewolf, if those weren't already taken by Aetolia. Also, I suppose that the Twilight-movie-based RP would be bad to have in Achaea. But yeah, a night-focused class would be a good addition to Hashan. Just please don't cannibalize necromancy for it.

    Also, love your idea with Delos, @Amunet!
    image
    Corbeaux
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Inferno no, Ashtan cannot take Serpents from Hashan, the spin-off snakes can deal.
    image
    CorbeauxSherazadTvistor
  • AchillesAchilles Los AngelesMember Posts: 2,478 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Ashtan:
    Occultists
    Serpents

    Cyrene:
    Runewardens
    Bards

    Eleusis:
    Sylvans
    Druids
    Sentinels

    Hashan:
    Alchemists
    Shaman

    Mhaldor:
    Apostates
    Infernals

    Shallam:
    Paladins
    Priests

    Rogues/Delos:
    Jesters (a comedian needs to be able to make fun of everyone)
    Monks (monastary or loner types)
    Blademasters (vagabonds)
    Magi (elements open to all alignments, can pick sides based on personal/philosophical beliefs)

    image
    ArillesBoosteya
  • EldEld Member Posts: 3,946 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Don't understand why people want to put serpents in Ashtan. If anything, they seem like one of the better candidates for an unaligned class.
    VayneBoosteya
  • CorbeauxCorbeaux Member Posts: 108 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    edited November 2012

    Basically because of their human ancestry (the rape of Maya by the Unnamable Horror spawned humans and all that chaotic jazz), genetic mutations from humans, chaotic blood, etc. Ashtan being the throne of Chaos (as termed by Pandemonium) makes Ashtan a perfect fit for serpents. That is, of course, if this discussion wasn't entirely hypothetical.

     

    Edit: Also, much love for @Amunet and her suggestion.

    (Party): Mizik says, "This can't possibly go wrong."
    Vayne
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited November 2012
    The venom aspect, which is the definitive mark of serpentfolk, is tied to Chaos, but you have the Serpentlords and their strong ties to Hashan and Twilight, in addition to subterfuge being a "Dark" skillest. Then you have Hypnosis which came from Valnurana. There are other supports about early human Serpentfolk that lean towards Hashan, but that would be telling. The Shadow Boys were nothing but a spin-off of the Serpentlords guild who had ties to Hashan all the way back to the empire.
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    LysHalosBoosteya
  • AchillesAchilles Los AngelesMember Posts: 2,478 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Eld said:
    Don't understand why people want to put serpents in Ashtan. If anything, they seem like one of the better candidates for an unaligned class.
    It's definitely more of a darkness aligned class, straight from the help file Serpents are often attracted to rather shady careers, but given the classes (and trying to give each city at least 2) which is a big reason why there are so few in Cyrene and Shallam.
    image
  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    A bunch of serpent abilities lean toward the trees, even if they are obviously underused. Always gave them a forestal feel, so I'd sooner say Hashan or Eleusis.

    And Alchemists would better embody Hashan if the ether were darker or more mystic. If I were to design a Hashan class it'd end up looking like this:image

    I like my steak like I like my Magic cards: mythic rare.
  • CorbeauxCorbeaux Member Posts: 108 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    If you want to make an argument concerning the skillsets, that's fine. I'm merely speaking, though, from a lore standpoint, one that obviously comes before Lucius Errikale, Caprian Zyle, and the serpentlords in general.
    (Party): Mizik says, "This can't possibly go wrong."
  • EldEld Member Posts: 3,946 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited November 2012
    Xith said:

    And Alchemists would better embody Hashan if the ether were darker or more mystic.

    Part of the Hashani tradition is a respect and desire for knowledge (of all sorts, which I've always thought of as the basis for accepting all classes, regardless of alignment), which seems to fit pretty well with alchemy. That and the strong ties to astronomy and such make for a pretty solid argument for aligning them with Hashan if you were going to pick one city.

    Would not object to an army of Raven clones, though.
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Corbeaux Like I said, I have other supports, but that would be telling.
    image
  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Eld said:
    Xith said:

    And Alchemists would better embody Hashan if the ether were darker or more mystic.

    Part of the Hashani tradition is a respect and desire for knowledge (of all sorts, which I've always thought of as the basis for accepting all classes, regardless of alignment), which seems to fit pretty well with alchemy. That and the strong ties to astronomy and such make for a pretty solid argument for aligning them with Hashan if you were going to pick one city.

    Would not object to an army of Raven clones, though.

    Also Twilight helped build them a planet. So there's that.
    I like my steak like I like my Magic cards: mythic rare.
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Alchemists fit perfectly with Hashan given the astronomy, knowledge, research aspect for sure.
    image
  • IocunIocun Member Posts: 3,506 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited November 2012
    Corbeaux said:
    If you want to make an argument concerning the skillsets, that's fine. I'm merely speaking, though, from a lore standpoint, one that obviously comes before Lucius Errikale, Caprian Zyle, and the serpentlords in general.
    One might however argue that even from a lore standpoint there are ties to "nature". There's the whole beastly/wild/animalistic thing behind the story of the original serpents. In that aspect, serpents are "uncivilised" and brutal in their original lore which fits nature and chaos to similar degrees. Still, they are certainly no class of "nature protectors" in the sense of the forestal classes, but simply proponents of a certain aspect of nature, which would make fitting them into Eleusis a stretch.

    Hashan and Ashtan are equally good fits. They both have a certain "shady underground" aspect in their cities, which all other cities are lacking.
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited November 2012
    @Iocun I think that is rather a stretch regarding the nature aspect.

    EDIT:
    We can argue RP reasons on personally bias all day, but Nizaris brings up a good point, Hashan was/is the Dark aligned city. There are no hard aligned classes but there are ones that are pretty well entrenched in the culture, Serpents and Shaman, and to a lesser extent Alchemist.

    Giving Hashan a heavily aligned class would be difficult without making a new class. Shaman would most likely have to control runelore which would be contested by Cyrene, Serpents are far too utilitarian to be isolated to one city, and Alchemists are designed to be part of each city.

    That said, a new Dark class would be pretty awesome.
    image
    Boosteya
  • TerraTerra Member Posts: 676 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean

    The question posed was which city would you put the class in if you could only put it in one. Out of bias, having played an Ashtani serpent for a long time and played up the Chaos ties, I chose Ashtan for serpents. But I agree there are very strong ties to Hashan as well. Though, I never thought they fit Mhaldor or Shallam very well.

  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    The SL and SS to have the most legitimate claims, both descending from the original guild, one more towards Darkness and one more towards Chaos. The Naga can be shoehorned into Vengeance, but I think it has been long agreed that the Dawnie justifications are pretty much a joke.

    [forumrp] All non-Serpentlords are illegitimate [/forumrp]
    image
  • AnatralAnatral Member Posts: 98 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Please tell me this conversation is and will remain entirely hypothetical. Otherwise, I'm going to have to ensure that Eleusis and Hashan (concoctions & alchemy) ally against everyone else.

    Let the Ithmian Empire Reign forever!
    Tvistor said:
    Achievement Unlocked : Made A God Feel Guilty.
    Boosteya
  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Anatral said:
    Please tell me this conversation is and will remain entirely hypothetical. Otherwise, I'm going to have to ensure that Eleusis and Hashan (concoctions & alchemy) ally against everyone else. Let the Ithmian Empire Reign forever!

    I imagine that's why the original poster put hypothetical in bold. But I can't see any form of this being implemented for any reason. Though I wouldn't be surprised to see something weird like some Scarlatti event that makes bards Cyrene-only. Thinly scattered class, after all. Or some forced rp to distance Cyrene from Shallam enough that they can't have devos anymore. There are limits though. Nobody can claim or exile monks/magi/bm/runewarden. Shamans/jesters could be rejected from some cities, but probably not claimed (unless Hashan ever deals with spirits again, who knows).
    I like my steak like I like my Magic cards: mythic rare.
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Xith said:
    (unless Hashan ever deals with spirits again, who knows).
    Again? When did we stop?
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  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Vayne said:
    Xith said:
    (unless Hashan ever deals with spirits again, who knows).
    Again? When did we stop?

    I guess I wouldn't know. But I mean in a world-shaping way.
    I like my steak like I like my Magic cards: mythic rare.
  • DelphinusDelphinus Member Posts: 896 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited November 2012
    Corbeaux said:

    Basically because of their human ancestry (the rape of Maya by the Unnamable Horror spawned humans and all that chaotic jazz), genetic mutations from humans, chaotic blood, etc. Ashtan being the throne of Chaos (as termed by Pandemonium) makes Ashtan a perfect fit for serpents. That is, of course, if this discussion wasn't entirely hypothetical.

    That's... really stretching.

    The game's lore is overwhelmingly in favour of Hashani Serpents. Humans/mhun/trolls/atavians/xorani are a red herring.


    Vayne said:
    @Iocun I think that is rather a stretch regarding the nature aspect.

    "They lived among the animals and learned to disguise themselves from danger, and learned the language of the beasts." It's about as plausible as Corbeaux's claim -- which is to say, yes, slightly, but utterly trumped by Hashan's.
    Boosteya
  • CorbeauxCorbeaux Member Posts: 108 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Not really, no.

    The relevance of certain lore, when placed against other more documented lore, is entirely subjective.

    That being said, it's moreso a talking point in game than a hypothetical thread. The alignment of traditionally non-aligned classes would be difficult regardless.
    (Party): Mizik says, "This can't possibly go wrong."
  • AinaAina Member Posts: 102 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    What's the decision behind putting Blademasters in Ashtan or Hashan?
  • VayneVayne Rhode IslandMember Posts: 1,897 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    All Blademasters will be put on a boat and sent back to Meropis.
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    HalosBoosteya
  • AinaAina Member Posts: 102 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    We'll just take a ferry back, though.
    VasoolBoosteya
  • EldEld Member Posts: 3,946 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Vayne said:
    All Blademasters will be put on a boat and sent back to Kashar.

    HalosBoosteya
  • TanrisTanris Member Posts: 683 @ - Epic Achaean

    People, please.

    Ashtan gets blademaster and occultist because can you just imagine a city of exclusively those two classes. I dare you to fight us for the right to have blademaster instead.

    AinaIdelisaRoveldaBoosteya
  • JhaeliJhaeli Member Posts: 541 @ - Epic Achaean
    Runewarden used to be the class that represented Cyrene's ethos perfectly, but the city has changed quite a bit over the years and now Runewarden is treated like the knight class that everyone gets. Ironic considering that the Bard Guild originally wanted to be able to include members from a variety of cities because they felt that the Arts were boundless, so to speak. Also, despite advocating for greater recognition for those orgs who want Knights in-game, I still don't think that Knights really fit the ethos of certain cities and don't think Runewarden should be a class that every city gets for that reason.

    Not that these are particularly relevant to the OP's question; just some thoughts I had while reading the thread. Continue!

    "Gilgamesh, where are you hurrying to? You will never find that [everlasting] life for which you are looking. When the gods created man they allotted to him death, but life they retained in their own keeping. As for you, Gilgamesh, fill your belly with good things; day and night, night and day, dance and be merry, feast and rejoice. Let your clothes be fresh, bathe yourself in water, cherish the little child that holds your hand, and make your wife happy in your embrace; for this too is the lot of man." 

    FrizticBoosteya
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