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Thank you, loved the denizen shields, time for them to go

Aminah
Aminah Member Posts: 82 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
Delete denizen shields.

1. They aren't fun. I suppose waiting for them to attack gives me a moment to lick the cheeto cheese from my fingers before pressing my alias again, but please.
2. Very few classes can actually counter denizen shields. Inb4 just use hammer.


If you don't want to delete ALL of them, fine. Orcs and Ogres could make sense, especially the warriors. Others can be justified in an RP sense.

But at least delete for ones that don't make sense. Wild men in caves? Goblin miners? Crazy denizens?

Comments

  • Kinilan
    Kinilan Member, Seafaring Liason Posts: 1,342 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    All sentients can use shield.

    All sentients are worth bonus xp because they can use shield.

    And if you hate them shielding you're going to HAAAAATE the bashing changes around the corner.
    AminahTrillianaTharvis
  • Aminah
    Aminah Member Posts: 82 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Kinilan said:
    All sentients can use shield.

    All sentients are worth bonus xp because they can use shield.

    And if you hate them shielding you're going to HAAAAATE the bashing changes around the corner.
    Please god no.

    What do you know??
  • Tahquil
    Tahquil Member Posts: 4,579 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Did all the recent classes that had tweaks done to them receive/already have ways to break shield efficiently?

    I know knights always could, but with the Sylvan changes they added in a way we could effectively break shields. It could be that they may place way each class can do this.
  • Austere
    Austere TennesseeMember Posts: 2,378 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Tahquil said:
    Did all the recent classes that had tweaks done to them receive/already have ways to break shield efficiently?

    I know knights always could, but with the Sylvan changes they added in a way we could effectively break shields. It could be that they may place way each class can do this.
    Sylvan has always had a counter to shield.  Two of you're counting reflection. 
  • Tahquil
    Tahquil Member Posts: 4,579 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited May 2015
    What's the first one? And I'm not quite sure what you mean as reflection being a counter.
    I'll just resay this "effectively break shields".
  • Sarathai
    Sarathai Member Posts: 2,139 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited May 2015
    Tahquil said:
    Did all the recent classes that had tweaks done to them receive/already have ways to break shield efficiently?
    Monks got their shield-break with the tweaks. Sylvans and Sentinels already had one (even if reflections might have been more useful for the former), Druids have Hydra shatter (only on players, though), and knight classes have and had a couple. I think Magi have a shield-break with earthstrike now as well.

    So most classes, at least, seem to have an ability that will break a shield.
    - (Eleusis): Ellodin says, "The Fissure of Echoes is Sarathai's happy place."
    - With sharp, crackling tones, Kyrra tells you, "The ladies must love you immensely."
    - (Eleusian Ranger Techs): Savira says, "Most of the hard stuff seem to have this built in code like: If adventurer_hitting_me = "Sarathai" then send("terminate and selfdestruct")."
    - Makarios says, "Serve well and perish."
    - Xaden says, "Xaden confirmed scrub 2017."



  • Tahquil
    Tahquil Member Posts: 4,579 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @sarathai : Mmm.. Diverting the damage and effectively breaking a shield is not the same thing though.
  • Sarathai
    Sarathai Member Posts: 2,139 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited May 2015
    Tahquil said:
    @sarathai : Mmm.. Diverting the damage and effectively breaking a shield is not the same thing though.
    Specifically, Sylvans had Erode and reflections. Now they have Shear and reflections.
    - (Eleusis): Ellodin says, "The Fissure of Echoes is Sarathai's happy place."
    - With sharp, crackling tones, Kyrra tells you, "The ladies must love you immensely."
    - (Eleusian Ranger Techs): Savira says, "Most of the hard stuff seem to have this built in code like: If adventurer_hitting_me = "Sarathai" then send("terminate and selfdestruct")."
    - Makarios says, "Serve well and perish."
    - Xaden says, "Xaden confirmed scrub 2017."



  • Aminah
    Aminah Member Posts: 82 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    I think @Jacen has a really good point

    If all classes could feasibly take part in countering the denizens' shields, it would make them having shields a lot less annoying.
  • Blujixapug
    Blujixapug Member Posts: 1,833 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Most classes have some way to deal with shields.

    Alchemists: Copper.
    Apostate: Truestare through shield.
    Bard: Raze. Cantata.
    Blademaster: Raze. Shin Burst through shields.
    Druid: ??
    Infernal: Raze. Razeslash & variants.
    Jester: ??
    Magi: Reflection.
    Monk: Roundhouse punch punch.
    Occultist: ??
    Paladin: Raze. Razeslash & variants.
    Priest: Aura.
    Runewarden: Raze. Razeslash & variants.
    Sentinel: Rive.
    Serpent: Bite through shield. Flay.
    Shaman: Truecurse through shield.
    Sylvan: Shear. Reflection.

    Does Badjoke work on NPCs? I feel like druids must have something in one of their morphs. Anyone with an active heal, like jesters/occs with Priestess Tarot, can technically use it while an NPC shields, but that generally doesn't benefit your momentum unless their attacks are really slow.

    NPC shields are a little annoying, but they add variety and a little strategy to bashing. Do you repeatedly break, letting the NPC repeatedly shield, while you sip back up on health? Or let them attack you so you can kill them. I'd rather not see them removed. If anything, give occs/druids/jesters an interesting way of interacting with NPC shields.

    NPC lifesteal attacks are way more annoying. No strategy there, either. You bring a team, or else wait for a big enough crit, or hope you get lucky and they just don't use the lifesteal attack for 15 attacks in a row.
    image
  • Tahquil
    Tahquil Member Posts: 4,579 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Jacen said what I was trying to say.. apparently badly though.

    Erode was no way efficient to taking down a denizen's shield. I mean, sure it took down the shield but a majority of the denizens I fought against where able to re-raise that shield before I could place any damage on it. Erode, erode, erode isn't a good tactic.

    Reflection is just another 'wait it out' tactic with personal damage mitigation.

    With the Sylvan changes we have Sychronisity which allows a sylvan to break a shield and inflict damage at the same time like a raze/slash. What I was trying to say in my first post is I think the classes that have been tweaked have this same sort of route. However I'm not familiar with the Sentinel/Druid and Magi paths of shield breaking.
    AminahBlujixapug
  • Blujixapug
    Blujixapug Member Posts: 1,833 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Tahquil said:

    Erode was no way efficient to taking down a denizen's shield. I mean, sure it took down the shield but a majority of the denizens I fought against where able to re-raise that shield before I could place any damage on it. Erode, erode, erode isn't a good tactic.
    It's good in the sense that forcing them to shield endlessly lets you sip back health.
    image
  • Sarathai
    Sarathai Member Posts: 2,139 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I feel like druids must have something in one of their morphs.
    Hydra Shatter can break an adventurer shield (third head balance, but longer than hammer cost), but we need to use a hammer tattoo for denizen shields. Waiting for the next attack tick and tanking the hit (soak it with Vigour if possible) is probably more effective.
    - (Eleusis): Ellodin says, "The Fissure of Echoes is Sarathai's happy place."
    - With sharp, crackling tones, Kyrra tells you, "The ladies must love you immensely."
    - (Eleusian Ranger Techs): Savira says, "Most of the hard stuff seem to have this built in code like: If adventurer_hitting_me = "Sarathai" then send("terminate and selfdestruct")."
    - Makarios says, "Serve well and perish."
    - Xaden says, "Xaden confirmed scrub 2017."



    Blujixapug
  • Jacen
    Jacen Member Posts: 2,325 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Tahquil said:

    Erode was no way efficient to taking down a denizen's shield. I mean, sure it took down the shield but a majority of the denizens I fought against where able to re-raise that shield before I could place any damage on it. Erode, erode, erode isn't a good tactic.
    It's good in the sense that forcing them to shield endlessly lets you sip back health.
    If you have to stall the denizen so you can sip health, your efficiency is already much worse than what's being discussed here.
    image
    Brean
  • Tahquil
    Tahquil Member Posts: 4,579 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Blujixapug : Good point. I never really thought in terms like that.

    I am mildly curious on how this community will take a change Aetolia implemented on a few denizens. Whether they think it positive or negative:
    A few denizens will, once getting to a certain health level, shield and stop attacking making the player have to break the shield to continue. Once that single shield is broken the denizen won't put up another shield.
    Jules
  • Kasya
    Kasya TennesseeMember Posts: 657 @ - Epic Achaean
    Priests have strip. It's only really effective in groups that don't otherwise have a shield breaking ability that I've seen.
    BlujixapugHalosMelodie
  • Brean
    Brean Member Posts: 194 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Kinilan said:
    All sentients can use shield.

    All sentients are worth bonus xp because they can use shield.

    And if you hate them shielding you're going to HAAAAATE the bashing changes around the corner.
    Denizen starburst ftw
    TrillianaKasyaTharvis
  • Austere
    Austere TennesseeMember Posts: 2,378 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Brean said:
    Kinilan said:
    All sentients can use shield.

    All sentients are worth bonus xp because they can use shield.

    And if you hate them shielding you're going to HAAAAATE the bashing changes around the corner.
    Denizen starburst ftw
    100% random(disable on honours denizens), double gold drop, experience and essence,  and you got a deal.  Otherwise, just go hunt Lupine Hunting Grounds. 
    TrillianaKasyaSarathai
  • Jules
    Jules Member Posts: 2,169 @ - Epic Achaean
    Tahquil said:
    @Blujixapug : Good point. I never really thought in terms like that.

    I am mildly curious on how this community will take a change Aetolia implemented on a few denizens. Whether they think it positive or negative:
    A few denizens will, once getting to a certain health level, shield and stop attacking making the player have to break the shield to continue. Once that single shield is broken the denizen won't put up another shield.
    I am for every baby-step towards minimizing the "grindy" aspects of the game.  
    TaelBorran
  • Andregor
    Andregor Member Posts: 98 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Tahquil said:
    @Blujixapug : Good point. I never really thought in terms like that.

    I am mildly curious on how this community will take a change Aetolia implemented on a few denizens. Whether they think it positive or negative:
    A few denizens will, once getting to a certain health level, shield and stop attacking making the player have to break the shield to continue. Once that single shield is broken the denizen won't put up another shield.
    I would love this.
    image
    Tael
  • Aktillum
    Aktillum PhilippinesMember Posts: 1,368 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Jester: ??


    Does Badjoke work on NPCs?
    Badjoke does not work on NPC shields.

    Blujixapug
  • Borran
    Borran Member Posts: 845 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Aktillum said:

    Jester: ??


    Does Badjoke work on NPCs?
    Badjoke does not work on NPC shields.
    Denizens just don't get it.

    AminahJulesSarapisHalos
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