Reduce Clotting Spam

Nim

I hate gagging just about anything other than my prompt, but fighting anyone who causes a ton of bleeding necessarily involves a lot of (potentially laggy) CLOT commands. Therefore, I suggest a means of clotting multiple times with one command, eg. CLOT 5 might clot five times.

It would essentially function like typing the CLOT command five times, and return a summary of the results - even down to only actually clotting once in retardation, for example. Ideally, it should grant no actual combat advantage (unless you count reducing combat spam as an advantage) - just convenience and general lag-reduction!

Sylvance

I can't see how this is different from proposing that Clot should be [5 times] more effective. Which it shouldn't.

Sena

Sylvance said:

I can't see how this is different from proposing that Clot should be [5 times] more effective. Which it shouldn't.

You can already clot any number of times at once, there's no balance. This just condenses multiple spammy commands into one. Clot 5 would take the same mana and willpower as clotting 5 times.

There are two benefits to this, aside from reducing spam: A single command is much better in retardation (avoiding that buff was already suggested), and it's less affected by lag (for someone with a slow connection, one command can be a lot faster than 5+). The latter is a good thing, and something that's already being done in other areas.

Sylvance

Sena said:

Sylvance said:

I can't see how this is different from proposing that Clot should be [5 times] more effective. Which it shouldn't.

You can already clot any number of times at once, there's no balance. This just condenses multiple spammy commands into one. Clot 5 would take the same mana and willpower as clotting 5 times.

There are two benefits to this, aside from reducing spam: A single command is much better in retardation (avoiding that buff was already suggested), and it's less affected by lag (for someone with a slow connection, one command can be a lot faster than 5+). The latter is a good thing, and something that's already being done in other areas.

I must have misunderstood (and still be misunderstanding) what the OP meant about what would happen in retardation, then.

ETA: Quotes.

Jonners

Nim said:

 and return a summary of the results - even down to only actually clotting once in retardation, for example.

What I take from that is if you CLOT 5 while in retardation it will work like CLOT on its own, once. My understanding of how retardation is supposed to work is limited, however.

Nim

Yeah. Basically, if you type CLOT 5, it should work exactly like you've typed CLOT;CLOT;CLOT;CLOT;CLOT, but with only one line of output instead of five.

So in retardation/aeon, it should effectively be transformed into a single CLOT command, but ideally it'll still only give one "You move sluggishly into action" message.

This idea should not make CLOT any stronger - except strictly in terms of helping reduce any disadvantage caused by having a laggy connection/client - only more convenient to use!

Seftin

Till you factor in a form of jester/shaman aeon lock into bleed i guess. Though doing that is rather irrelevant when compaired to their instakills.

Jovolo

I remember Earionduil classleading this a while ago and it didn't get implemented for some reason. I don't know why. Though the idea seems fine, and beyond it working as intended (i.e, it's supposed to be like this to hinder clotting in aeon and retardation) I can't see why it wouldn't be implemented.   

Sylvance

Okay, makes sense. +1 OP

Iocun

I suppose it was rejected last time because the suggestion didn't account for aeon/retardation. With Nim's suggested remedy for these, I can see no reason not to implement it.

Penwize

I put this into classleads a long time ago and if I recall it was approved for investigation but never actually followed up on.  My suggestion was pretty much exactly this.  I remember having a conversation with someone about why it wasn't followed up on, and I think we concluded that there were other things that could make clotting fail aside from just aeon/retardation.  Stupidity is a good example: spamming clot in stupidity would cause a number of the clot commands to fail.  Amnesia is another, potentially causing one of your clots to fail.  I'm not sure how important these two scenarios are, but there they are. 

Would really like for this to be changed though, because it makes gags a requirement when fighting high-bleed enemies or else you have a good chance of missing something important in the scrolling silliness.

Iocun

Amnesia would, if anything, hinder this form of clotting more than old clotting. Previously, at most it could make you clot once less, which isn't a big deal in most cases at all. That's why amnesia is a non-issue with this change. Stupidity would have a somewhat reduced effect, yes, but I don't consider this big enough a deal to dismiss the idea. I don't think anyone actually uses stupidity actively to stop clotting - if anything, it tends to be a random side-effect.

Penwize

Yeah, they're minor differences but their existence does make changing it from multiple commands to a single command not entirely functionally identical.  I'd be fine with stupidity and amnesia affecting them differently, though, since I doubt it would really affect combat balance in any significant way and it would improve the lag and spam situation immensely when fighting bleed-heavy classes.  The tradeoff seems worth it.

Eld

For amnesia, if you were really worried about it, you could just have it reduce the count by one.

Iocun

Eld said:

For amnesia, if you were really worried about it, you could just have it reduce the count by one.

No reason for that. If you're worried about amnesia messing up your new clotting too much, you're still free to use clot;clot instead of clot 2.

Nim

Stupidity's a good point. One way to deal with it is just have random number of clots fail, combine all the emote stupidity actions into one emote, and do other stupidity actions that come up (like touch shield) as normal.

Iocun

Probably too much coding effort for the benefit it would provide. It's not as if stupidity will suddenly become useless with this change.

Antidas

Seems like a great idea, but one question...what would happen if I clotted for more than I was actually bleeding? Would it then take the willpower/mana for all of those clots, even the ones you didn't need, or would it simply clot the maximum amount necessary and not count the excess?

Jonners

Clotting normally states that 'You are not bleeding' and doesn't cost afaik, so I would assume it wouldn't as a group command too

Eld

Antidas said:

Seems like a great idea, but one question...what would happen if I clotted for more than I was actually bleeding? Would it then take the willpower/mana for all of those clots, even the ones you didn't need, or would it simply clot the maximum amount necessary and not count the excess?

Similarly, if I clot more times than I have the mana for, do I still lose the willpower for the extras, and vice versa, as is currently the case?

Penwize

For all these questions, the sentence "Basically, if you type CLOT 5, it should work exactly like you've typed CLOT;CLOT;CLOT;CLOT;CLOT, but with only one line of output instead of five." pretty much answers them.  How does it currently work? Any implementation of condensed clotting should work the same.