Skill Proposal: Teaching

Penwize

I'd like to toss out an idea I had for a miniskill/skill.  Here it is:

Teaching.

The ability to convey one's experiences in a meaningful way, giving your words the weight and clarity needed to enlighten less experienced individuals.

How it works, mechanically:
Teaching allows someone to formally declare a lesson.  Once a lesson is begun, one of the teacher's SAYs every 20 seconds that is at least 80 characters long will give xp to everyone in the room.  The xp given should be a function of the teacher's lessons in teaching and the teacher's level, and should be a reasonable appreciable amount since mostly lower level people will be receiving it. Beginner teachers can only teach up to something like (level-20)/2.  Transcendent teachers can teach up to something like (level+50)/2.  The teacher gains the xp as well, as reward for teaching.  The number of says allowed to generate xp this way per RL day is limited, and a lesson is also a function of the teacher's lessons in teaching, ranging from 10 to 30.

Abilities:
LESSON BEGIN: Declare a lesson as begun.
LESSON PAUSE:  Declare a break in your lesson.
LESSON PREPARE: tells you how many SAYs you have to generate xp remaining for the day.  Also tells you who in the room is eligible to receive xp from the lesson.


The idea behind this is primarily to foster more RP and care in developing newcomers, while rewarding participation on both sides (which will have a significant impact on how often it is done).  We're a bit short on rewards for actively helping out, and rewardless activities usually wind up getting neglected.  I think this would fill a void there in a significant way, and really encourage interaction at a level that needs it.

Antonius

Sure, I can't see any way in which this could or would be abused... I can understand, and appreciate, wanting to incentivise people to interact with and teach new players, but I don't think a mechanic that essentially boils down to "here's a substantial amount of free xp" is the way to go about it at all.

Chryenth

Thinking about it, there should probably be a limit on the amount of xp gained via this method, as well. That said, even the highest level players aren't going to be teaching much over level fifty at the highest level of skill.

Maybe cap it at 50% of a level, or no more than a certain amount per IG day/month?

Nizaris

Interesting. With proper limits, I could see this as being effective. I am assuming a certain amount of quality control will go in, as @Santar noted in a previous post. Looking at the changes that I put into the Congregation requirements to really emphasize mentor-protege relationship, I could see this as going a very far way in encouraging the behaviour. I'm cautious, but I like it.

Penwize

I understand the hesitation behind giving out "free xp," but honestly you can rat until level 60 with 0 risk and at a reasonable rate of xp gain.  This would be considerably more interesting than that.  I've already mentioned a handful of restrictions to prevent it from being abused.

Silvarien

I think the problem with giving "free XP" from such a mechanism is that it appears to GREATLY exceed other forms of "free XP." The Chorale by Bards and the Rite of Prayer by Priests and Paladins are only super-effective on the very young, low-level players. But the RP involved draws even a ton of veteran players, and even if you get only like 0.02%, people still typically see that as worth it.

If this greatly exceeds those methods in XP gain, I think a lot of people will be bitter and think that the system of things like this is getting out of whack.

If that can be addressed, I think the idea itself is solid. It's just that I don't think "free XP" should be handed out so strongly.

Jacen

Silvarien said:

I think the problem with giving "free XP" from such a mechanism is that it appears to GREATLY exceed other forms of "free XP." The Chorale by Bards and the Rite of Prayer by Priests and Paladins are only super-effective on the very young, low-level players. But the RP involved draws even a ton of veteran players, and even if you get only like 0.02%, people still typically see that as worth it.

If this greatly exceeds those methods in XP gain, I think a lot of people will be bitter and think that the system of things like this is getting out of whack.

If that can be addressed, I think the idea itself is solid. It's just that I don't think "free XP" should be handed out so strongly.

I'd hardly call it free xp. Achaea's hardcoded rewards are geared too much towards the single player gamer (bashing, ship trades) or trying to overpower and defeat other players (granted that's the typical purpose of games) while giving no hardcoded rewards to those who aide new players, who are actually improving the quality of the game by helping retain novices and building up the playerbase. Very much like this idea, or some thing very similar.

Trevize

I would love this for sermons.

Jonathin

I like a version of this simply because there are no rewards, and as such, no xp gain for people who hate combat and hate bashing but love strictly RP. The only reward is the occasional HF which usually doesn't come when people are used to rituals or sermons and self gratification, which really is not on par with combat, bashing, or questing.

Wysteria

Sounds like the mini skill could be like being a lecturer at a university.

Example would be getting a [specific] room full of Sylvans wanting to learn Elementalism, then letting the teacher have at it, multiple people get their lessons done, and the teacher gets a bit of xp in the process. Eventually come exam finals time, the students will lose sleep and a bit of xp, then the teacher will assess everything, and everyone gets their xp back and then some if they pass with flying colours.

………this idea probably might not work out as it could be.

Santar

I managed to intercept part of a conversation Penwize was having that would be a -perfect- example to illustrate this idea. However, since Penwize asked me nicely to not post any specific details, I'll post a slightly edited log of the occurrence:

Penwize says, "Blah, blah blah Eleusis blah blah. Blah blah Nature blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah, and blah blah. Blah blah blah blah blah blah Artemis blah blah blah blah blah blah blah Dragon. Lupus blah blah and blah. Blah blah blah blah blah, and finally blah. Trees."

Your soul cries out in ecstasy as it reaches new heights of power. You have advanced to level 99.

You have reached the illustrious level of Greater Dragon.

Cynlael

No speech about afk radiancing people, or about hunting? Sounds like a faked Penwize log.

Iocun

Cynlael said:

No speech about afk radiancing people, or about hunting timestamps? Sounds like a faked Penwize log.

Cynlael

I stand by what I said, no correction was needed.

Jakiro

I like this. With the way I used to teach to newbies back when I was in the Druid House, I could definitely have used a mechanic like this to keep them more interested/willing to listen to me talk (and I did so a lot). I've no problem with the 'free xp' idea if it promotes RP between people.

Berenene

Santar said:

I managed to intercept part of a conversation Penwize was having that would be a -perfect- example to illustrate this idea. However, since Penwize asked me nicely to not post any specific details, I'll post a slightly edited log of the occurrence:

Penwize says, "Blah, blah blah Eleusis blah blah. Blah blah Nature blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah, and blah blah. Blah blah blah blah blah blah Artemis blah blah blah blah blah blah blah Dragon. Lupus blah blah and blah. Blah blah blah blah blah, and finally blah. Trees."

Your soul cries out in ecstasy as it reaches new heights of power. You have advanced to level 99.

You have reached the illustrious level of Greater Dragon.

So, in Mhaldor, it would go something like this?

Sarapis

I'm not a fan and I don't see how this adds any RP. Someone could literally just type random letters, and as long as it's enough characters long, people get xp. Doesn't make sense to me.

 If you want to teach new players, you can actually teach them and actually help them gain xp by taking them to appropriate places for them to hunt and helping them. That's RPing and actually teaches them something useful, whereas, with all due respect, this doesn't. 

Nellaundra

Yes, it teaches them that @Penwize has a crit rate of 130%.  Hunting isn't fun and I'll take any alternatives of getting xp over it.

Sylvance

Sarapis said:

I'm not a fan and I don't see how this adds any RP. Someone could literally just type random letters, and as long as it's enough characters long, people get xp. Doesn't make sense to me.

 If you want to teach new players, you can actually teach them and actually help them gain xp by taking them to appropriate places for them to hunt and helping them. That's RPing and actually teaches them something useful, whereas, with all due respect, this doesn't. 

@Sarapis - I don't see that 'problem' as being any bigger than Chorale. Incidentally, MKO seemed to be doing just fine with a similar skill (not so similar that this one wouldn't work), which was a one-man Chorale. People weren't typing random letters, they were investing a great deal of creative energy into RPing it.

Nellaundra

Honestly, I'd just like a method of getting XP that doesn't boil down to 'commit genocide against everything'.  The influence system seems like it'd be good, or something similar.  But, almost everything xp-wise is genocide or do obscure fetch quests or say random key words to the right NPC.

Iocun

I'd like such methods too, but I'd steer clear from things that are based so much on intricate character interaction as teaching. As much as I dislike doing repetitive, tedious tasks in-game, they are a more adequate source for XP generation, since the fact that they're already rather "empty" tasks means there's less risk of devolving something that was previously a source of inventive and detailed RP into a powergamey mechanic.

I simply don't quite buy into the assumption that you can improve RP by rewarding such things with material benefits in an automated fashion. Any hardcoded reward system can never measure the quality of someone's RP and is thus unsuitable as a means to encourage it in any meaningful sense.

Sarapis

Iocun said:

I simply don't quite buy into the assumption that you can improve RP by rewarding such things with material benefits in an automated fashion. Any hardcoded reward system can never measure the quality of someone's RP and is thus unsuitable as a means to encourage it in any meaningful sense.

Agreed. If people are doing it for the reward, they will seek the optimize for that reward. Roleplaying is both the means and the end for itself as far as I'm concerned.

Chord

If we're looking at the intention of re-skinning this in a positive manner, instead of wholesale throwing it out, I have an idea.

Instead of a mini-skill, it's a house/order room. A lecturing hall or something of that sort. The purpose of it would be to give incentive to attending/giving house ethos lecture to improve house identity. This way it has oversight, would be incredibly difficult to abuse, and would actually add to the atmosphere instead of detracting.

Jonathin

This really isn't much different from what we already have. The game already mechanically awards people for spending 30+ minutes raiding a city with numbers sometimes more than 2:1 or raiding only during off-peak hours. The system itself was not a bad idea and it made raiding a lot less tedious, but application of said idea wasn't really perfect.

I don't like combat really all that much. If this gets people who don't care about RP engaging in more of it, then I think it's worth at least a try. A whole-hearted attempt to get people to experience all of the facets of Achaea is a good thing, even if it has to be removed later.