Request to buff ink palettes

Silvarien

With the coming of Inkmilling, I think the ink palette artefact has slipped in terms of usefulness. My in-game father calculated that it would take roughly 10 rl years for an ink palette to return its investment in inks, and hunting up inks to be produced through Inkmilling is generally seen as more desirable. I did buy three palettes, and I personally like them, but I only know one person who has one palette, and the general consensus is that it is not a good buy. However, I would have to argue that the palette has the POTENTIAL to be an excellent artefact if buffed a little.

Some options would be:

-Increase a palette's carrying capacity from 6 to like 12.
-For like 50 additional credits, allow palettes to be "tuned" to increase the possibility of gaining a certain type of ink.
-Along with the first option, make the palettes produce more inks per Achaean day.
-Reduce the cost of an ink palette from 450 cr to something smaller.

I am not saying all this just because I have palettes. Almost everybody told me not to buy them, and people think I made a terrible choice in buying them. But I think if tweaked properly, this could be a very popular artefact because things that inks are used for are essential to the game.

Thank you for reading my suggestion.

Sena

I agree. They were extremely terrible when Rurin was the only source of inks, and they're twice as terrible now. They take several RL years to get even the slightest benefit from them, and they can't even be considered a convenience artefact because they're less convenient than simply buying inks.

Assuming each ink colour is equally likely:
If the current capacity and production rate is kept, I would reduce the price to 100 credits.
If the price is kept at 450 credits, I would make them hold 30 inks, and generate 5 per hour.

An ink generation artefact just doesn't seem like a very good artefact though even if it is made more reasonable, simply because no matter what it will basically just be a gold-generating artefact. I'd much rather it be changed to do something else, like give a 10% or so chance (on each individual ink) of not using up an ink when inking a rune or tattoo. Or increase your rift capacity for inks only, stacking with Prospero's Vaults (or maybe just work like a pocketbelt for inks). Or either of those effects on top of the current crappy ink regeneration.

Antonius

I'm all in favour of making them more useful, though I'd still probably never buy one. Even at 100 credits I can't help thinking that most people would probably get more benefit from just buying a phial to make a regularly used/inked tattoo permanent.

Kyrra

I've had a palette for a while and I've never had issues with it.

For a single palette only generating 6 inks an hour, I usually end up with a surplus of inks, and I do go through a lot sometimes.

I did get warned off them as a bad investment, but I wasn't looking to make money off them in the first place. I think they are worth it.

Also, I will clear inks out of Rurin shops in three cities over inkmilling. I'd rather cut a loss than lose the time.

@Antonius, while you can perm tattoos, you can't perm runes.

Sena

Kyrra said:

6 inks an hour

Is it really that much? Everyone I asked (years ago) said it was 1 ink an hour.

If it is 6, it's a lot better than I thought. It will still take a year to break even and start getting any benefit from it (assuming you can log in to empty it 12 times a day), but after that year it's pretty profitable, so it's a decent long-term investment.

I'd still like if it did something other than generating inks though. Generating a nearly-unlimited riftable commodity serves almost no purpose at all except making gold (there's no convenience, nothing unique to be gained from it, no increased availability, etc.), even more so than something like an artefact that boosts fishing profit (something that was always denied for exactly that reason), which I don't like much as an artefact effect.

Kyrra said:

I wasn't looking to make money off them in the first place.

Out of curiosity, why did you get it then? Making or saving money is the only purpose it serves, other than being able to hold an extra 6 inks, which is pretty meaningless.

Silvarien

It's 3 inks an Achaean day, so I think 6 in two hours?

Iocun

What if instead of producing ink owning a palette would simply allow you to ink any tattoo without needing any inks at all?

Would runelorists be mad at this? (Adding completely free runing on top would probably be too much.)

I just think that just tweaking the artie a little bit does little good. It needs a major boost to be more useful.

Kyrra

@Sena, it is only 3. I suppose I save money with my palette but I'm patient enough for the slow but steady supply of inks. If I wanted to mass produce them, I'd put my trans inkmilling to use.

I go through periods of totem work, and despite giving free runes to most people ( my inks ) there are times where I don't use inks and they build up in the rift. They do add up over time and I have no triggers or aliases to check my palette every hour. It's just something I randomly do.

@Iocun, please no. As someone with mostly permed tattoos, an idea like that would render a palette useless. Inks aren't only used for tattoos, and gipping runeists isn't fair. You also need to factor in that the cost of one palette can get you four permed tattoos, reducing the need for inks for tattoos altogether. Maybe tattooing on novices that lose boars every five minutes but still..

I'd suggest maybe upping how many inks are produced a day to six but don't change how many it can be held. It's good for them to be random, and they do add up over time.

Iocun

Fine, make it work for runes too then. I just think that free inking would provide more convenience than just producing ink and convenience basically is what such arties are for.

Kyrra

That would make a lot more sense.

Sena

Inking any rune/tattoo without requiring inks at all isn't really reasonable. Especially not after the auction items that work as unlimited ink of a single colour. I don't think a 50% chance of not using an ink would be unreasonable though. It would effectively cut the cost of the inks you use in half (which is much better than generating inks that you can sell), and they'll also last longer, so there is some added convenience.

Kyrra

I guess I can pick up the trait that gives me Rurin discounts again :P

Trevize

I don't like the 'ink-free tattoos' or runes ideas.

Iocun

They don't like you either  >:P

Trevize

Perhaps allow it to be used to mix inks, as well as the current functionality? Mix red/blue to get purple, etc.

Blujixapug

Just delete it and refund the four people who own them, tbh. Or retire it, let the four people who own them keep theirs, refund them anyway, and write them a letter of apology for having the gall to sell them such a useless item.

Prior to Inkmilling it was a terrible artifact, but it conceivably could have been fixed by increasing its ink spawn rate (although this would have created the same problem as trader's satchels, since once you buy one the initial investment is a sunk cost, and people would be selling the ink they amassed in bulk for peanuts because lol economics). Now that people can create their own ink, without an artifact, on demand, in greater quantities, the Palette is irredeemably useless.

Kyrra

I hate Inkmilling, to be honest. The time spent gathering reagents is just as awful as the time spent gathering and refining cooking ingredients. Yeah, it's probably cheaper over all than buying inks from Rurin if you have the time to spare to create the few hundred that you want.

A lot of people complain that it's difficult to keep up the demand of supplying inks to people in large amounts at half the cost of Rurin's prices.

At least inks are useful. I've never found a practical use for flowers, cigars, or chocolates. Can chocolates even stop you from starving to death?

I'd rather my palette, thank you. And you're not taking it off me. Ever.

Sena

You don't have to mill inks to benefit from inkmilling. People sell them. You can simply buy 2000 of each ink at half Rurin's prices, there's no need to spend any time on it.

Edit: Apparently I skipped over the entire second line of your post. I've never had any trouble finding cheap inks, they always seem to be available in large quantities.

Kyrra

Yeah but I'd be spending the gold either way.

I guess because I use my palette to provide me inks for my own use and not to sell, has me viewing things differently. I like that I don't need to spend gold and I don't want to have to spend gold. I see inkmilling as time spent gathering reagents to make my own inks so I don't have to spend gold, and that's a crapload of time that could be spent on other things.

So I have an artefact that works perfectly fine for me, isn't broken for me, that most people want to delete out of the game because they will never buy or use one. It's not a veil that impacts on anyone's gameplay.

Sena

I don't really understand being averse to spending gold on inks but fine with spending credits on inks. Is it that the credits are a large one-time cost instead of making multiple smaller purchases?

Kyrra

Sena said:

I don't really understand being averse to spending gold on inks but fine with spending credits on inks. Is it that the credits are a large one-time cost instead of making multiple smaller purchases?

Pretty much. I see it as being more efficient, even though I won't ever "profit" or break even on what I spent.

That's why things like obfuscated vials appeal to me as well. I still get refills from tuns sometimes, but it's useful to be able to top up yourself sometimes too.

Tarkanian

Sena said:

If the current capacity and production rate is kept, I would reduce the price to 100 credits.

This please. Thanks.

Sena

Tarkanian said:

Sena said:

If the current capacity and production rate is kept, I would reduce the price to 100 credits.

This please. Thanks.

That was based on the assumption of 1 ink per hour. With 3 inks per hour, and a capacity of 6, I'd probably make it 250-300 credits.

Katzchen

I got about half the exp from 80-96 from gathering. :P It's pretty slow these days though.

Draqoom

I own a palette. I have no issues with it. I routinely get 200+ of every type of ink (except black) and end up giving them away to runlore folk. I got it because hunting as a monk was draining my tattoos very quickly and runes help with hunting. I liked getting unlimited inks for runes and tattoos essentially for free for life. I don't feel like it was a bad investment because I use it all the time. I do feel that it should produce black inks because why not, and I do feel like it's less useful in general now that artie tattoos are 100cr, but for me it does what I got it for and that's plenty for me.

Kresslack

I got one when I got a Runic Gauntlet, and while it's better than not having one at all, I really don't get that much from it. Especially being Runewarden, I blow through inks, so it's much more practical to use Inkmilling to make large batches.