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Battlerage

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  • KyrraKyrra Australia
    Kerria said:
    Is it just me, or is battlerage to 2h balance a bit off? I feel like I'm losing rage before I can even think of moving to the next mob with my balance and I have a Lvl1 Artie bastard.
    My hunting is okay with it from what I tested out earlier and wasn't losing rage that badly, but I've got a level 3. I don't know that it makes much difference.
    (D.M.A.): Cooper says, "Kyrra is either the most innocent person in the world, or the girl who uses the most innuendo seemingly unintentionally but really on purpose."

  • NyghuraNyghura
    Tharvis said:
    Nyghura said:
    So I just got my first battlerage ability as I hit level 6 and.... I can't use it. I was all excited!

    http://pastebin.com/7yPztq7S

    As you can see it requires a Golem and us little novices don't get Golems until we get our third class skill.
    @Mortori any chance the first magi ability can be swapped with another - to avoid this?
    I knew there was someone I should've tagged but I couldn't for the life of me think of who it would be. Thanks @Tharvis
  • MakaelaMakaela
    @Kerria I use a Lvl 1 Artifact Warhammer. Maybe see if a regular hammer is faster than the artie bastard sword. Also are you using battlefury focus speed? If not that should shave off a second or two of your balance.

    @Kyrra it will make you balance slightly faster so that might be enough. I have not looked at arte Bastard stats yet as I got a hammer for hunting.

  • JarrodJarrod
    edited May 2015
    Re: shields brought up earlier in the thread, I hope they don't change them. That's the one thing that makes battlerage more than "macro the two damage abilities to your bashing attack and spam" when solo. Save your 'cooldowns' for shield phase and you can burst them down in 2-3 shields without crits, as fast or faster than before.

    Or just bring anyone with recklessness (that's why it exists), we did a long string of Tasur'ke denizens (enough to spawn ~3 bosses) and maybe 1 in 10 would get a shield off due to timing of burst from from 35% to 19% and instant shield. Otherwise things never shielded and died super fast.

    From what I've seen, most complaints about the actual use of the skills (outside bugs/oversights like Magi skill) is just people not using them well.

    Second note: Most 'group' bashing skills I'd rather nobody bashing with me uses at all, currently. From what I've seen it consumes the debuff off the mob, and in almost every single situation I'd much rather the effect than someone doing a slightly larger than burst-damage hit.
    image
    Cascades of quicksilver light streak across the firmament as the celestial voice of Ourania intones, "Oh Jarrod..."

  • TherisTheris
    I'll add my two cents to this:

    I really like the new bashing changes. It looks like it's going to lead to more benefits from fewer kills, which means more mobs available; it seems much less likely that a single person will be able to repeatedly clear an entire large area alone anymore. I love that this has made bashing more interesting and added incentive to group up, although I understand why people who preferred the old bashing would be frustrated because it's harder to multitask with the changes.

    As a jester, I was ecstatic to learn that RAP was NOT a musical attack, and that DUSTTHROW and ENSCONCE don't require diamond dust and firecrackers, respectively (because we already have to shell out so much money for materials). The longer battles are really making me feel my squishiness now (I was hoping for a battlerage ability to dodge a few attacks, or something), and the fact that battlerage fades so quickly means it's hard to hit and run without losing momentum (though, it looks like they're going to extend the decay). Also, regarding shields, I'm feeling them a LOT more. We already had no way to deal with denizen shields while bashing, and now that battles are longer, it's much more of an issue. I'll probably submit an idea to get a shieldbreak/attack combo added to Pranks, because it seems like other classes have been getting love in this area (e.g., sylvans, who already had reflections, got a new shieldbreak/attack combo with their new skills, magi got a buff to staffcast earth).
  • MakaelaMakaela
    Ok I just issued Myself cus I thought back to my hunting. A friend is telling me I am thinking to much on it but even considering it is a X2 exp event...

    Should a level 63 at 25.8% have gotten to level 65 and 32.4% in less than a full clear of Manara.. which is a level 20 to 30 hunting area?  Am i being overly worried that they overtweaked exp gain or justifiably worried?

  • TharvisTharvis The Land of Beer and Chocolate!
    Not really @Makaela, Manara actually stays relatively decent exp/hour even up to the higher levels (90). Which is probably something that needs some diminishing returns, but, eh.
    Aurora says, "Tharvis, why are you always breaking things?!"
    Artemis says, "You are so high maintenance, Tharvis, gosh."
    Tecton says, "It's still your fault, Tharvis."

  • MakaelaMakaela
    @Tharvis ah! Ok it just seemed weird to me. Good to know I am just being paranoid.

  • AntoniusAntonius
    It's entirely possible that they have increased the experience gain too much, but that's not really something for you to worry about. If they think it's too high then they'll reduce it.

    Results of disembowel testing | Knight limb counter | GMCP AB files

  • AustereAustere Tennessee
    edited May 2015
    As a dragon,  I support the over tweaking of experience.  The less people can complain about hunting, the more they will pk.

    Is there currently a way to see what afflictions are on your target denizen?  I  looked into coding a method for an hour or so last night(and got ridiculously far),  the simplicity of it seems like it would be better to just let us diagnose denizens for free..While I don't care to release what I have, it will be tracking only (since I wouldn't touch the convaluted bashing rules with a thirty foot pole. 
  • KatzchenKatzchen Mhaldor
    @Makaela Manara was always still amazing right up through the 60's and beyond. It takes longer to do a full clear now too.


                   Honourable, knight eternal,

                                            Darkly evil, cruel infernal.

                                                                     Necromanctic to the core,

                                                                                             Dance with death forever more.



  • DraekarDraekar
    It would be nice if after say 4-5 seconds of not hitting the rage just decayed at a certain rate. This rate could be quite high but I think I would prefer this to just a full fade on timer.
  • MakaelaMakaela
    @Kinilan I am actually addicted to hunting now. Now the ease of exp but the fact I get to make decision in:
    Should i use rage
      If yes which
      If no how long do i want to save for
     
    I just find it more fun in general

  • RispokRispok
    Didn't see it mentioned yet, but in addition to changing butchering numbers, have talisman drops been adjusted to compensate for the change?
  • AtalkezAtalkez
    Kinilan said:
    I don't see the point of it all. Bashing was already dull and now it feels even worse. My gold/xp gain over time might be the same but it FEELS slower and more tedious. Battlerage didn't add anything new, sometimes you do extra attacks. You're still just mindlessly killing things. If there was more inter-play between the abilities within a class it could be a little more interesting.   Why are we limited by both rage AND cooldowns?

    The damage+ abilities are poorly designed. You need a partner from  a very narrow range of classes that meshes with yours and then, because the damage+ attack strips the aff to really make it work you have to time it so you hit right before the aff fades otherwise you're just wasting a stun or a clumsy or whatever.. To do that properly people are just going to turn to systems which is a step back from recent changes.

    The defensive abilities feel bad. If you need them you're fighting well above your level and then they won't come fast enough to really keep you alive. Targeted defensives are even worse. They don't really serve a purpose outside honours mobs.

    I feel bad just shitting all over this but I think a lot of work was done for nothing. The major impact from all of this was greater total rewards within a given area and that could have been rolled out with far less work.





    I dunno. The changes have me interested in hunting now.




    Penwize has cowardly forfeited the challenge to mortal combat issued by Atalkez.
  • ShunsuiShunsui
    Rispok said:
    Didn't see it mentioned yet, but in addition to changing butchering numbers, have talisman drops been adjusted to compensate for the change?
    * To allow for more interesting fights, and the opportunity to use the Battlerage abilities more 
    effectively, we've made each fight last longer by increasing denizen health pools across the lands. 
    Don't worry, though... we've also increased their experience and gold/talisman drop rates to 
    compensate!

  • SarapisSarapis
    Rispok said:
    Didn't see it mentioned yet, but in addition to changing butchering numbers, have talisman drops been adjusted to compensate for the change?
    Yep.
  • VakvyrVakvyr
    Bash with friends and don't worry about maximizing potential.  Like the only time I actually care about what rage I have is when we're doing a room where our tank needs a safeguard. Otherwise it's just a race to kill something and ooo and ahhhh at the crits.
  • KlendathuKlendathu Eye of the Storm
    Lots to take in, a few coding challenges, but I wholeheartedly believe this is a positive change. Those who say bashing was boring now have additional challenges.

    Tharos, the Announcer of Delos shouts, "It's near the end of the egghunt and I still haven't figured out how to pronounce Clean-dat-hoo."
  • KatzchenKatzchen Mhaldor
    edited May 2015
    Okay, so hunting in groups has had a major buff, which was a long time coming as it was truly awful before, but I'm thinking some mid levels (80-90, not sure about others) might have had quite a strong nerf in solo hunting. I need to explore the different options more now, but I've been chased out of my normal hunting grounds since I can't tank more than one of them without hit/running now, and that loses rage and momentum, plus increases chance of death, and lower hunting grounds are experience wise maybe similar to the old ones when rage is used properly, but the gold is very lacklustre.

    Considering gathering and questing have also taken a gold earned over time hit, maybe this could be looked into. Also you'll definitely need to update your 'recomended areas' guide for levels! Anything aggressive with groups just went up in who can handle it, and many lower areas were just made feasible or even excellent for higher levels to hunt.

    All in all I really like the change though. Glad I can hunt with other people now without one or both of us losing out!


                   Honourable, knight eternal,

                                            Darkly evil, cruel infernal.

                                                                     Necromanctic to the core,

                                                                                             Dance with death forever more.



  • TalysinTalysin
    What is the magi battle rage skill set?
  • AepasAepas
    I find battlerage to be amazingly fun. I do still think some of the lower level things could be scaled back just a bit though.
    Replies the scorpion: "It's my nature..."
  • NyghuraNyghura
    edited May 2015
    Magi battlerage for peoples and @Talysin

    http://pastebin.com/wARkPceA

    1) I think it's so cool I afflict with aeon
    2) I'm glad the just moved golem hug instead of removing it. I like the idea of it (thanks @Mortori
  • TalysinTalysin
    Some of those magi skills make me think Sylvans should have gotten them instead. I get to throw water at my targets, but you get to basically wind whip them :/.
  • NyghuraNyghura
    Talysin said:
    Some of those magi skills make me think Sylvans should have gotten them instead. I get to throw water at my targets, but you get to basically wind whip them :/.
    I hope it doesn't look like your trying to Magikarp them to do death...
  • JarrodJarrod
    On further playing with various Battlerage abilities:

    -Class combos are almost entirely irrelevant. If the afflictions are good, you don't want to consume them. If the afflictions are bad, you're better off just using your burst hit than combo'ing it. All afflictions have some use, especially when you're higher up, however

    -If you don't have one recklessness in your group, you're probably going to have a bad time. If you have two you can kill pretty quickly and always reckless mobs to prevent shielding. Inhibit is the best ability if the mob can heal (DKs, undead bosses, etc), recklessness is best otherwise. Sensitivity is the number three aff for groups, but is mostly useless with 1-2 people

    -Silver dragon is really damn good in groups with sensitivity and recklessness available (pair 2, alternate sensitivity/reckless every target and win)
    image
    Cascades of quicksilver light streak across the firmament as the celestial voice of Ourania intones, "Oh Jarrod..."

  • AlaskarAlaskar
    That was a rather, uhm, dramatic post. The willpower drain per denizen may be awful, but drain/reward ratios should have remained constant or nearly the same. Since each denizen's xp and loot scaled with health, it would seem that where 5 curses may have been 5 slain denizens and 5% xp, it is not just 1 slain denizen and 5% xp. Or that was my understanding of the end goal. A three digit number in your prompt wouldn't be terrible, and if you want to grind, just grind. You don't -have- to use rage. Hell, it's pretty easy to code something to automatically use it if you have it. And dying 100 times? Not the new bashing changes fault. Once or twice, maybe. 

    Really, that was a rather unwarranted post. It was almost petulant, really. As if you'd already made up your mind to not enjoy the changes, and therefor didn't even try to find the positives in them. Maybe try looking at it as something that may take longer to figure out but can be equally rewarding or more so? 

  • BorranBorran
    I agree with @Bluef on one account: endurance/willpower. I don't think the ratio has remained the same because I used to hunt my cycle constantly and never hit yellow endurance. Yesterday, I was surprised to find that when I cleared part of Moghedu I hit yellow endurance. 

    I'm not complaining because I remember blowing through endurance like crazy as a monk and it gave me incentive to do other things- house reqs, combat, or just socialize. 

    As far as the crits- I've found I'm critting more because I get more hits with the rage abilities. Random is random?

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