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2h hammer vs bastard

CaledCaled Posts: 77Member ✭✭ - Stalwart
Unfortunately it seems no one has done a speed comparison yet, at least not with number crunching and posting the results.

Various threads that I have read recommend using the sword for bashing. One thread recommends L1 hammer and L2 sword in pvp.

My limited testing with forged weapons, and the same battlerage strat, have me killing vashnar mountain lions in 29 seconds with a hammer, and 35 with a bastard sword.

I'm in no hurry to buy artifact weapons. I may even experiment with DWB before buying weapons, but I am keen for a discussion on 2h weapons , both pvp and pve.

Answers

  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo DomingoPosts: 3,046Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Hammers have a faster balance and do more limb damage. Swords have a slower overall balance and do less limb damage but allow you to use venoms.

    Everyone knows swords are cooler than hammers, though.

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

    Rekhyr
  • ThorbirThorbir Posts: 2Member


          
    Mathilda
  • CaliraCalira Posts: 505Member, Secret Squirrel ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    For PvP, both are very strong and have different uses. Would recommend being comfortable with both.
  • CigolCigol Posts: 8Member
    Are hammers better for bashing since they are faster?
  • CaledCaled Posts: 77Member ✭✭ - Stalwart
    That's what I've been finding, though I haven't done proper testing yet, and it may change with artefact versions of the two weapons.

    What small tests I've done show that the damage is almost the same. Against the lions each hit is either 9 or 10% for both weapons. I may have imagined it but it seemed like the bastard sword might have done 10% more often. To do real testing I need to find a target that is weaker - damage differences should show up better that way. Also, I shouldn't have mixed in battlerage attacks.

    The hammer is significantly faster though, so I'm definitely killing stuff faster when I time first hit to kill. A little bit easier to to flee as well with a faster balance.

    At some point I will do the tests properly - try and copy Mindshell's testing in this thread
    http://forums.achaea.com/discussion/5800/pve-analysis#latest
  • VoliVoli Posts: 82Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    At higher levels, more speed = more crits, in theory. Because if you can put in 15-20 attacks a minute vs. 10-15, you have roughly 5 extra hits worth of potential crits.

    Unless I just don't understand how crits work here.

    I assume that's why I use REAP instead of CULL as a Depthswalker. Why Thyr is considered better than Mir, unless you need to hunker down. Etc etc.


  • CaledCaled Posts: 77Member ✭✭ - Stalwart
    If anyone is interested, I did some testing of weapon speeds. Times were recorded using a script in Mudlet that only timed balance times if focus speed preceded the attack. The attack was slaughter, and I repeated the test a minimum of 100 times for each weapon. A simple loop to add all the times and divide by the total produced the mean times below.

    As you can see, the increase in 5 speed for the bastard gives more than 0.2s speed increase.
    While the 3 speed for the hammer is essentially unnoticeable (and irrelevant with only 100 repetitions).

    I also did a quick damage test using Great Rock Stirges as the test subject. Warhammer did  63% damage to the target per hit, while the bastard sword did 68%. There was no difference in damage between artefact and non-artefact weapons.

    Conclusions:
    1. For un-artefacted bashing, warhammer is better.
    2. For bashing at least, the L1 warhammer shows negligible different to the standard hammer.
    3. The level 1 bastard sword is significantly faster than the standard bastard
    4. If the speed increase is linear, then the L2 bastard should be faster than either warhammer

    I would like to test hammer speeds more. I'll see if I can borrow a level 2 hammer and see if there is any noticeable speed increase. It's possible there is a diminishing returns mechanic kicking in, or that my test results were flawed somehow.

    I would also like to test damage more - I'm wondering if weapon damage doesn't affect the pve slaughter.

    Lastly, I will eventually compare the two warhammers with pvp attacks, as it would be nice to figure out if it is ever worth buying, for anyone.


    Spoiler has the weapon stats in it:
    It is a two-handed weapon.
    Damage: 197  To-hit: 174  Speed: 131
    A rustic, Eleusian bastard sword has no venoms or magical effects on it.



    It is a two-handed weapon.
    Damage: 204  To-hit: 182  Speed: 136
    A Dawnrender bastard sword has no venoms or magical effects on it.




    It is a two-handed weapon.
    Damage: 183  To-hit: 165  Speed: 146
    A rustic, Eleusian warhammer has no venoms or magical effects on it.




    It is a two-handed weapon.
    Damage: 186  To-hit: 170  Speed: 149
    A Stonesmith's Maul has no venoms or magical effects on it.

     ------ 2h weapon speed using focus speed/slaughter ------
      Standard forged bastard : 3.283s
      Level 1 Artefact bastard: 3.060s
      Standard forged hammer  : 2.862s
      Level 1 artefact hammer : 2.825s
     ------ ------------------------------------------ ------
    Thorbir
  • ElisellaElisella Posts: 122Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    L3 sword is around 2.7-2.8 seconds balance. I'll have some % numbers for damage for you later.

    I don't remember there being a huge difference between forged/artie bastards in damage, but getting under 3 seconds a swing is huge in terms of killing speed.
  • CaledCaled Posts: 77Member ✭✭ - Stalwart
    Just an update. L2 bastard, mean time is 2.93s
    Ekin
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