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Aetolian looking to move.

PinotlPinotl Member Posts: 2
edited December 2012 in The Matsuhama Arena
Hi there folks, I've been playing Aetolia for a couple of years on and off and I'm looking at starting my first character on Achaea. I'm heavily PVP-oriented and I hear a lot of good things from former players about the Achaean classes / houses / cities / combat system as a whole.

I just have a couple of questions regarding a few facets of the system:

  • Does choice of race matter beyond specific racial skills / aesthetics / rp? (I.e. can I mix and match stats as any race as you can in Aetolia?)
  • How necessary is it to bash to endgame to engage in PVP?
  • Are artefacts a requirement rather than a perk? (I've heard this is the case and I'm prepared to make investments but I'd like to know what I'm getting myself into).
  • Are there any particular classes that are great/horrible at 1 v 1? I realise that group combat is usually more prevalent but I'd like to know that my class is capable of winning duels.

Beyond that, if anyone could give me a rundown on some of the classes, in particular their role/quality in PVP, that would be great :) (I've been thinking of possibly Sentinel, Runewarden or Jester)

Thanks in advance folks!

Comments

  • NemutaurNemutaur GermanyMember Posts: 1,068
    Race matters, there are no statpacks here.

    Bashing to endgame is not really needed, level 80+ just lets you forget about sleeping and eating food.

    Arties depend on the class, but a lot of classes do very well without arties.

    There will always be classes that are better or worse in 1v1, it all depends on what class your opponent is as well though.
    SylvanceAlyssea
  • IocunIocun Member Posts: 3,506 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Race doesn't matter very much, really. Every race comes with several possible specialisations that have different distributions of stats, so you can pretty much fit every race to your class, making racial choice mostly an RP thing. There are some unique racial traits too, but while they can be very neat, none of them is crucial for PvP, so unless you really want to fully min-max your character, you shouldn't have to worry about making the wrong race choice.

    As Nemutaur said, bashing all the way isn't required, but having a medium-high level (at least level 70 or so, better 80+) is something you'll eventually want for PvP survivability. You can get away with a bit lower levels if you have more defensive artefacts and vice-versa though.

    You usually don't need any artefacts at the medium levels of combat, especially if you're good at what you're doing. If you want to reach the top tier, you may need to invest in some to keep up with everything though, but it's very class-dependent. Out of the classes you mentioned, jester does well without any artefacts at all and isn't overly much buffed by them. Runewardens and sentinels both gain a lot from offensive artefacts, but in the case of runewardens, they can be replaced by good forged weapons just as well (which just requires a large time investment in forging them, or a monetary investment in buying them from other players). Sentinels can be tough combat-wise without any artefacts currently, but classes are constantly being rebalanced, so that too may change in due time.

    I can think of no class that's absolutely horrid for PvP, nor of one that's absolutely overpowered. It's hard to make general observations about this, since some classes shine particularly in certain areas of combat and have weaknesses in others. E.g. some classes allow you to kill inexperienced people very easily, but will reach a certain point where it gets hard to kill experienced opponents (this typically applies to "trick" classes like occultists or jesters), while others have a very steep learning curve, but allow you to kill pretty much anyone once you get past that. As I said before though, all classes are constantly being evaluated and re-balanced, so this all changes a bit continuously.
  • TvistorTvistor Member Posts: 2,895 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Err, I hear alchemist is pretty bad 1 v 1 though, despite the fact they have some very interesting raid utility.Their offense was described to me as inexorable, but incredibly slow and predictable.
    PM me if you want to playtest a MUD.
  • IocunIocun Member Posts: 3,506 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Alchemist still needs some work, yes, but it does have one or two very powerful combat strategies. It takes some time, but not more than some other classes take. Their main issue is that they rely a lot on momentum, yet can be rather easily hindered.
  • EldEld Member Posts: 3,946 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    There was a thread on the old forums with a similar question that got a number of useful replies (interspersed with plenty of the usual cruft). It's several months old at this point, but probably still reasonably current, as I don't think there've been many major changes since then.

    http://www.achaea.com/forum/the-1v1-class-you-hate-to-fight-against
    Pinotl
  • NellaundraNellaundra Member Posts: 1,556 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited December 2012
    I've been messing with Aetolia and let me say this.  Achaea is an entirely different beast.  There -will- be a pretty huge adjustment to here from Aet.

    EDIT: To clarify upon this, the systems in Aetolia are flat out stone-age compared to Achaea.  Add that to Aetolia's bashing being -ridiculously- easy and you get a lot of complacency.
    image
  • TanrisTanris Member Posts: 683 @ - Epic Achaean

    I got to about level 88 (I think) on aetolia in a week when I was curious about it. A few things to consider from what I know (my Aetolian knowledge is severely limited, mind):

    - Parry does not work prone here. That alone should probably completely readjust the way you view limb based classes if you didn't know previously.
    - There is no pre apply restoration to cure limb damage here (you can pre apply and it'll fix the limb if its broken mid apply, but not the damage if you apply to try to cure that before it actually breaks).
    - Achaea still has illusions.
    - Endgame is not necessary whatsoever. It does not give stat bonuses here like aetolia does, so its essentially just an additional class (dragon, although that might change at the end of this event: noone really knows), plus the health/mana benefits. I'd say level 85 is more than enough at any tier.
    - Nearly all races can work for any class because of the stat specialise system, with a couple notable exceptions.
    - Aeon in achaea functions differently. You cannot enter ten commands and have them all go through at once 1 second later, its command-wait one second-command-etc.
    - Systems are far, far superior here. I'm sure there are some decent systems in Aetolia out of the mainstream access, but as a guideline the most prevalently available public systems here outclass the best of what I saw in aetolia by a vast degree. (That's not meant to sound "our systems are better"-ish, its just how it is. Same when comparing achaea to all the other games, no clue why).

    Classes:
    If you want to be good in group combat and one v one, there are a few good classes for you. I'd not recommend sentinel. Its decentish with artifacts at mid tier, but even with artifacts at high tier you'll hit a brick wall. If the person won't fight outdoors and knows how to prioritise/outrift correctly, they have no real reason to die to you currently.

    Jester has a high  learning curve and its also either trick dependent, or in a constant battle with improving automated curing. It also sucks (like, really sucks) at getting kills in teams: its more of a support role, which admittedly it does do quite well. Due to that though its also high prio in groups, and dies very fast to damage (some of the worst defence in game for groups, although very good defence one v one).

    Runewarden. Good at just about everything, honestly. Good rapiers turns it into a juggernaut in teams/one v one, and its good very solid bashing. Definitely a good option, and has good jumping utility to complement it (not the best, sure. But very solid). A good beginner class, and potentially one of the best high tier. There's nothing really not to like about runewarden.

    As for classes that immediately spring to mind as different to aetolian equivalents, Idrani and Occultist are significantly different (I think its Idrani, right? Necromancy/tarot/domination). Idrani is terrible if not much has changed since I checked it out (admittedly, it was a good while ago now), whereas Occultist is a good class (the one v one can be extremely tiresome, but the group is hands down amazing).

    Monk there is pretty similar to here, except we have a few things they don't and the same the other way (no prone parry here makes monk arguably a lot better here).

    Our magi doesn't have their brand things (I only know about the shadow mage version, no clue on the other), and due to our differing aeon mechanic our magi excell in retardation, which is extremely powerful. Aetolia magi has an instakill iirc, but ours don't really need one: damage output and staffstrike (aff plus limb damage + minor damage) makes it a pretty different class completely.

    Our serpent is different here, probably similar to aetolias pre illusion change. Just a guess on that though.

    Our sentinel also vastly different (Aetolia's was god mode last I knew, ours isn't).

    Hope some of that jumble of information was useful.

    Sohl
  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Pinotl said:
    • Does choice of race matter beyond specific racial skills / aesthetics / rp? (I.e. can I mix and match stats as any race as you can in Aetolia?)
    • How necessary is it to bash to endgame to engage in PVP?
    • Are artefacts a requirement rather than a perk? (I've heard this is the case and I'm prepared to make investments but I'd like to know what I'm getting myself into).
    • Are there any particular classes that are great/horrible at 1 v 1? I realise that group combat is usually more prevalent but I'd like to know that my class is capable of winning duels.

    Beyond that, if anyone could give me a rundown on some of the classes, in particular their role/quality in PVP, that would be great :) (I've been thinking of possibly Sentinel, Runewarden or Jester)


    - race used to matter more, but stats have been levelled out to a degree, so that only the real combat sticklers will care.
    - you've got to get at least 70-80 to hold up pvp, which will vary based on class
    - I'd like to say arties don't matter, but are advised to keep up with top-tier fighters (again depending on class). Elm pipe is advised at least. And some arties will make your hunting (bashing) easier if you want to go that route.
    - takes in-depth study to fully understand where each class's weakness is, but the idea is that all are good in some way (ongoing fixes to keep the balance)

    Sentinel: Forestal class, arguably the strongest of the three. Haven't played it, but their combat is based on damage and hindering. Metamorphosis has wonderful utility, they can make their own cures of course, and woodlore is full of traps, loyal entities, and clever tricks. They do have to be in Eleusis though if not rogue.
    Runewarden: Their role is neutral. Due to Runelore though, they are capable of very powerful damage bursts and can withstand a lot of damage, making them a strong physical tank class. And if you choose to forge, you can potentially make good money.
    Jester: My class. Neutral technically, but their tendancies can earn them a lot of ill will. Expensive class because tarot cards are 20gp each and so are all the props/bombs/jitb/puppets. Very fun combat class, awesome utility in general. But there are also aspects that are broken and in the process of being improved.

    Of course you can make an alt for each to try them out and then stick with your favorite. All fun classes in their own way.

    I like my steak like I like my Magic cards: mythic rare.
  • ZeonZeon Member Posts: 757 @ - Epic Achaean
    edited December 2012
    I'd recommend doing some research into the remaining factions Evil/Nature/Chaos and deciding which sounds the most interesting to you from a roleplay perspective. Some classes are better at 1v1, group combat, pve, etc, than others, but in the end pretty much every class is viable at whatever you're trying to do.

    I wouldn't say that any class is objectively better than any other class as a general statement. I also wouldn't say that any class is broken and in the process of being fixed to correct its brokenness. Achaean combat is a heavily shifting spectrum and there is a pretty well defined metagame at this point, all classes are constantly being adjusted as a result. 

    If you are interested in getting involved in PVP and can see yourself investing money in credits, but not wanting to have to do so, I'd pick runewarden. Runewardens aren't aligned to a faction so you can play one wherever you want. They have solid pve and pvp and they can do very very well without artefacts, though they benefit greatly from having them.

    Jester is a nice choice as well, though their pve is pretty subpar (equally viable, just slower). The upkeep costs aren't that much especially if you see yourself bashing regularly. Their class skills are pretty silly though, so if you don't see your character as the kind of man/woman to be riding around on a balloon giraffe, jester probably isn't for you.

    Also I know this wasn't on your list and I do feel bad pitching a aligned class, but occultist is a really great class as well. They're really easy to play, their pvp is good, and their group combat is unrivaled. Their offense is one of the easier/easiest of all the classes, and they have amazing utility. They have pretty average/below average pve potential, but that just means it takes longer to bash, not really a problem if you're willing to do it. As a general rule bashing to a high level is 90% about your RL willpower, and 10% about how easy your class makes it.

                   Party right, party hard,

                                            Sing and dance, perfect bard.

                                                                     Prefarar loop, accentato whore,

                                                                                             Buy a new rapier, get nerfed some more.

    Tanris
  • PinotlPinotl Member Posts: 2
    Really helpful everyone thanks...regarding the aeon differences I was devastated when aetolia made aeon/retardation easymode so I am glad to hear it works as it should over here. Probably going to go with Mage or runewarden, although I've heard good things about shaman and the idea of vodun is very appealing...what are the general thoughts on the shaman class?
  • MizikMizik Member Posts: 2,089 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited December 2012
    Heavy PK? Don't do it.

    Runewarden is the overall super class. More a class you should end up as, fat and happy.

    Magi requires less Trans skills, and I imagine the difference in Retardation will be pretty thrilling for you. Solid, inexpensive class to get you on your feet before you decide if you want to invest.

    I think you'll fit right in!
    image
    Rovelda
  • XithXith Member Posts: 2,602 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Do Magi. If you're considering it, just do it. Won't regret it. Also very simple to learn.
    I like my steak like I like my Magic cards: mythic rare.
  • XerXer LangleyMember Posts: 804
    edited December 2012
    Simple to learn? Fighting in retardation has been slow going for me (admittedly, I haven't had much time to practice it exclusively as I want with all the other shenanigans going on). If fighting in retard well is actually easy to learn from the Magi end, I'm going to give somebody a concussion.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    e^(iπ) + 1 = 0
  • ZeonZeon Member Posts: 757 @ - Epic Achaean
    Magi makes for a decent mid, but make sure not to play them in blind pick or you might get countered by a bard or occultist.

                   Party right, party hard,

                                            Sing and dance, perfect bard.

                                                                     Prefarar loop, accentato whore,

                                                                                             Buy a new rapier, get nerfed some more.

    Tvistor
  • AniariAniari Member Posts: 5

    Dwarf Miner and go monk!!!!

     

     

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