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You automated, bruh?

24

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  • DaeirDaeir AustraliaMember Posts: 6,276 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I automate everything that I can.
    I even automate these forum posts too
    KasyaRekhyr
  • SkyeSkye The Duchess BellatereMember, Seafaring Liason Posts: 2,965 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I only automate basic things like triggering engage off of lunge.
    :|

    You disgust me.


  • DaeirDaeir AustraliaMember Posts: 6,276 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I automate everything that I can.
    This is an automated forum response, my coder hit f1 at some point in the past half-week
    ShirszaeAlcinae
  • KandraKandra Member Posts: 189 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    I am a special snowflake that doesn't fall in any other category(please explain).
    Now that I think about it, buried somewhere in my stuff is a trigger to truewrack Aerek when he sends me a tell. :tongue: 
    Aerek
  • AeliosAelios Member Posts: 449 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    I automate my affliction tracking.
    I automate my affliction tracking, in that I use a modified version of Austere's aff tracker found on the forums here to show me what afflictions (around 80% accurate) that I believe my opponents have. 

    The rest is all manual commands. Well, manual in my sense. (Aliases/Macros)

    Not manual in the @Sarapis sense of literally typing everything in vs. aliases.

    :D


    My crystal ball says that the list of bans will start from the top of these results and go down. Just a guess!


    "You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else."

     -Albert Einstein

    Austere
  • AustereAustere TennesseeMember Posts: 2,245 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I am a special snowflake that doesn't fall in any other category(please explain).
    Aelios said:
    I automate my affliction tracking, in that I use a modified version of Austere's aff tracker found on the forums here to show me what afflictions (around 80% accurate) that I believe my opponents have. 

    Update! 
  • AerekAerek East Tennessee, USAMember Posts: 1,818 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I only automate basic things like triggering engage off of lunge.
    I automate the "free" things that can be done after commands that I physically send, like Engage after Lunges, Fury after Impales, Contemplate after DSLs, but I have a little bit of a phobia about putting the decision-making or acting power in the hands of a machine instead of myself. I do use lots of variables that I'll "load" actions into, (As in, I'll set a variable to "smash mid" or "battlefury focus speed", and then my normal macros will call that variable on every attack until I change it) so it's not like I don't use scripting to make my life easier and more convenient, but my client is never choosing my venoms, attacks, or peripheral offense for me.

    Granted, knights don't have any third balances to handle. I can imagine I might have some scripts or triggers in place to help manage a third balance with less room for error if I had one, especially if that balance is often desyncronized from my main balances, such as with Bard, Occultist, and Dragoncurse. Some classes do just have more things to keep track of than others, and turning complex, multi-faceted operations into something that a human can easily control is essentially what scripting is there for.

    Kandra said:
    Now that I think about it, buried somewhere in my stuff is a trigger to truewrack Aerek when he sends me a tell. :tongue: 
    Aerek arrives from the north.
    Moving awkwardly, as though manipulated by invisible strings, Kandra scuttles in from the north.
    Moving awkwardly, as though manipulated by invisible strings, a diminutive homunculus resembling Kandra scuttles in from the north.
    -- Grounded in but one perspective, what we perceive is an exaggeration of the truth.
  • JulesJules Member Posts: 2,169 @ - Epic Achaean
    How do people in this thread feel about instances where there is a huge melee (i.e. an unbelievable amount of spam)?  Does it influence your approach at all?  It seems like it almost has to.  
  • AtalkezAtalkez Member Posts: 4,958 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    My offense has no triggers of any kind involved in it.
    I rely on my chat box and party calls in mass spam like that. Huge box displays for hitting shield and people that try to cleave or whatnot during it.


    You hug Aurora compassionately.
    JulesAlcinae
  • JulesJules Member Posts: 2,169 @ - Epic Achaean
    Even as a non-fighter whose main experiences are sporadic raid defense and the occasional CTF, that sounds awfully familiar.  It seems like *someone* has to be keeping track of it all (and at the very least prioritizing targets) or it's just a wreck, and it's so, so much worse if the groups really are big.  

    Another question for people, related to some of the recent discussions.  Do you feel like you'd enjoy more opportunities to engage in melees where there were fewer people (on both sides) if that were made possible?  Achaea is the biggest IRE game, which is probably why we also seem to have some of the biggest, spammiest melee fights (which seems to almost demand some serious automation in terms of filtering and prioritizing information, at least by the person guiding the group).  That said, I have a feeling people would still need to rely on a combat leader who would probably have made a fairly fancy script, but at least it might feel more like you could take in what was going on.   
  • AustereAustere TennesseeMember Posts: 2,245 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I am a special snowflake that doesn't fall in any other category(please explain).
    Jules said:
    Even as a non-fighter whose main experiences are sporadic raid defense and the occasional CTF, that sounds awfully familiar.  It seems like *someone* has to be keeping track of it all (and at the very least prioritizing targets) or it's just a wreck, and it's so, so much worse if the groups really are big.  

    Another question for people, related to some of the recent discussions.  Do you feel like you'd enjoy more opportunities to engage in melees where there were fewer people (on both sides) if that were made possible?  Achaea is the biggest IRE game, which is probably why we also seem to have some of the biggest, spammiest melee fights (which seems to almost demand some serious automation in terms of filtering and prioritizing information, at least by the person guiding the group).  That said, I have a feeling people would still need to rely on a combat leader who would probably have made a fairly fancy script, but at least it might feel more like you could take in what was going on.   
    Most consistent raiders will tell you small group pk is the best.  No one likes being spammed out.  People like being tactical. Even automation requires some input because of curing priorities.

     Personally,  I have relays to pt for personal afflictions that have no third person message and are not easily noticeable.  If I have to lead a defense, all of my target calling is manual (this includes my pt echo for raiding too), but I do have a intelligent function that relays three targets at a time for stormhammer, as well as auto enemies everyone in my room that isn't part of my group.  Nothing makes you feel better than raiding with Jhui-daddy and calling the next target, seconds before he calls the same one.  Glorious. 
    JulesExelethrilSzanthax
  • JulesJules Member Posts: 2,169 @ - Epic Achaean
    What if you don't call the same one though :P  I bet there are CONSEQUENCES.  
  • JacenJacen Member Posts: 2,304 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I get lost a lot when leading parties. I struggle to both do something useful while also calling targets. Its very difficult to do both, especially when you're one of the more prioritized people in the group. I do try and make up for it after I die by sticking around to call some targets, now that I don't have to worry about doing things myself, but that's not hella fun.
    image
    Jules
  • AeliosAelios Member Posts: 449 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    I automate my affliction tracking.
    Austere said:
    Aelios said:
    I automate my affliction tracking, in that I use a modified version of Austere's aff tracker found on the forums here to show me what afflictions (around 80% accurate) that I believe my opponents have. 

    Update! 
    Never! 

    1.0 for life!

    "You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else."

     -Albert Einstein

  • AinlyAinly Member Posts: 130 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    My offense has no triggers of any kind involved in it.
    I don't use triggers for offense, I prefer being able to react on my feet and not have a bad trigger screw me up.  Only thing I do use are plenty of highlighting and echos that tell me what's going on.
    Exelethril
  • TaelTael Member Posts: 1,197 @ - Epic Achaean
    edited May 2015
    I automate everything that I can.
    Here to rep the dark side.

    To the extremely limited extent that I am even remotely capable in combat or have ever been, it's because I automated things.

    My reaction speed for pretty much anything is, in general, not great. On top of that, despite being a fast typist and a text game enthusiast, I'm actually a very slow reader. To me, even a 1v1 is blisteringly fast - too fast for me to keep up with it, even with highlighting and gags (I don't mean I actually read the lines, I'm not an idiot, only that things simply happen too fast for me to keep track of). I spent a good while trying to learn to fight mostly manual a year or two ago when I was serpent, and maybe there's a level of highlighting and custom displays for things like afflictions that would change things, but my efforts felt mostly wasted - I knew the things I needed to do a lot of the time, but no amount of practice seemed to allow me to execute them. And that was for dstabs and hypnosis, which is nothing compared to the complexity of something like bard managing harmonics (including minuet), tunesmithing, asynchronous balance, and venoms, or the speed of something like nimble swiftcurse.

    Automating things is one of the only options I have for participating in any meaningful way. And I imagine I'm probably not alone in that. And I'm glad that Achaea has a place for people like me. And as someone who enjoys difficult programming problems like this, Achaea also presents a pretty unique kind of gameplay for people like me.

    And I can understand the frustration with highly-optimised automated offenses, but it's not like it's completely trivial to build them - possible certainly, but it requires knowledge, experimentation, practice, and a lot of time spent working on things. And I don't get the sense that these automated offenses are yet able to compete with the best combatants.

    I think the difference is less that people who work on automated offense are bad or somehow cheating, and more that it's just a different style. As someone who both enjoys that style and relies on it, it frustrates me that everyone seems to have such a negative opinion of it simply because they don't enjoy it as much themselves. If you don't enjoy it, don't do it. When every top-tier combatant is using a fully-automated offense because manual or semi-manual can't hope to compete, then that will be a pretty serious problem, but we don't seem to be there yet. And, again, it's not like there's just a mudlet function win(), automation requires a lot of work and thought and there are clear drawbacks too - the state of a fight can be very complicated, can change in invisible ways as people swap priorities and other hidden variables, and relying on automation means that you're essentially screwed whenever you get into a state you hadn't prepared for.

    While I think ultimately it very well might become one, I don't think offense automation is a problem yet.
    PenwizeShirszaeNakari
  • AustereAustere TennesseeMember Posts: 2,245 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I am a special snowflake that doesn't fall in any other category(please explain).
    Jules said:
    What if you don't call the same one though :P  I bet there are CONSEQUENCES.  
    Then I just rotate to whatever the majority of the group is focused on.  Chat box for lyfe.

    Aelios said:
    Austere said:
    Aelios said:
    I automate my affliction tracking, in that I use a modified version of Austere's aff tracker found on the forums here to show me what afflictions (around 80% accurate) that I believe my opponents have. 

    Update! 
    Never! 

    1.0 for life!
    There is literally no reason not to update at this point.  Everything, including processing speed has been updated.  The only difficulty is party relays (which are possible because I have them)

    Jacen said:
    I get lost a lot when leading parties. I struggle to both do something useful while also calling targets. Its very difficult to do both, especially when you're one of the more prioritized people in the group. I do try and make up for it after I die by sticking around to call some targets, now that I don't have to worry about doing things myself, but that's not hella fun.
    I use two targetting aliases, one for raids and one for everything else.  As someone who grew up using "tar", it was fairly easy to rotate to "t" for raids.  It also allows you to do a few other fancy things without having to remember if you toggled your relay variable or not.  
    JulesAziik
  • XinnaXinna Member Posts: 691 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    I am a special snowflake that doesn't fall in any other category(please explain).
    Iakimen said:
    Everyone in Eleusis is automated, honestly.

    Over years of exhausting and grueling effort, our shared system has reached such perfection that Rangor only has to call a target for us to all synchronize in unity, creating near instantaneously an impeccable combination of sheer forestal destruction. We've hesitated in utilizing this ultimate technique in its entirety, for fear of destroying Achaean combat as we know it - but now that the age of automation has arrived, the time is ripe to unleash this wave of terror upon you all.

    It only fails when Rangor typos the target, but soon...soon we shall automate that too. Or he could learn to type.

    And then it'll be over. :smile: 

    WTB a name change plz.
  • DaeirDaeir AustraliaMember Posts: 6,276 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I automate everything that I can.
    Iakimen said:
    Everyone in Eleusis is automated, honestly.

    Over years of exhausting and grueling effort, our shared system has reached such perfection that Rangor only has to call a target for us to all synchronize in unity, creating near instantaneously an impeccable combination of sheer forestal destruction. We've hesitated in utilizing this ultimate technique in its entirety, for fear of destroying Achaean combat as we know it - but now that the age of automation has arrived, the time is ripe to unleash this wave of terror upon you all.

    It only fails when Rangor typos the target, but soon...soon we shall automate that too. Or he could learn to type.

    And then it'll be over. :smile: 
    This is an automated response of approval generated by the Automation Hivemind

    All hail norge
  • AeliosAelios Member Posts: 449 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    I automate my affliction tracking.
    Iakimen said:
    Everyone in Eleusis is automated, honestly.

    Over years of exhausting and grueling effort, our shared system has reached such perfection that Rangor only has to call a target for us to all synchronize in unity, creating near instantaneously an impeccable combination of sheer forestal destruction. We've hesitated in utilizing this ultimate technique in its entirety, for fear of destroying Achaean combat as we know it - but now that the age of automation has arrived, the time is ripe to unleash this wave of terror upon you all.

    It only fails when Rangor typos the target, but soon...soon we shall automate that too. Or he could learn to type.

    And then it'll be over. :smile: 
    conjure illusion (Party): Rangor says, "TARGET: Rangor."

    "You have to learn the rules of the game. And then you have to play better than anyone else."

     -Albert Einstein

    Theris
  • JulesJules Member Posts: 2,169 @ - Epic Achaean
    Maybe Rangor is an eagle who doesn't have time for this, but Alot of forestals just understands.  
  • CynlaelCynlael Member Posts: 3,257 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    My offense has no triggers of any kind involved in it.

    It's 'a lot' /rage.

    TharvisJulesJeslyn
  • TahquilTahquil Member Posts: 4,275 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited May 2015
    @Artemis , @Gaia
    Formally petitioning to have Alot made into a Eleusian denizen.

    AthelasJules
  • DaeirDaeir AustraliaMember Posts: 6,276 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I automate everything that I can.
    Eleusis already has an iridescent cloud of fart gas, do they really need a mythical grammar creature too?

    Of course they do.
    Halos
  • TahquilTahquil Member Posts: 4,275 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited May 2015
    If I had the credits or the money to buy enough credits I would make an Alot. That beast is fucking adorable. I would see if if I could get it coded to appear when people say 'alot' and just stare at them.
    JulesSkye
  • JovoloJovolo EnglandMember Posts: 3,164 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I only automate basic things like triggering engage off of lunge.
    "but Alot of forestals just understands."

    With the grammar in that sentence, it made me feel that Jules was referring to the mythical beast "Alot", of the forestal lands, and how he understands Rangor. (Someone has to?)
    Jules
  • ChiamChiam Member Posts: 144 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    edited May 2015
    My offense has no triggers of any kind involved in it.
    i'd probably love it if I can script up an auto offense for different strategies/opponents, but I cant code anything asides from basic highlights and triggers and it seems like a chore to learn (doesnt help that I usually get answers like 'lol learn2fight noob not code' when i ask a certain someone)

    Basically I fight with all the F key macros, numpad, and tons of 3-letter aliases.

    in fact, @Ainly just taught me yesterday how to make rebounding highlights only echo if it was my target, instead of getting spammed by curing highlights in every group fight. 

    edit: oh wait I got my contemplate/sap/catharsis from someone. @Nocroth I think
    Exelethril
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