New Bashing Changes!

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Comments

  • We hit a falcon and check his life.

    image
  • Aerek said:

    I don't see why Dragon needs to be some universally lusted-after carrot. AND SOME OTHER THINGS AEREK SAID


    Sure it doesn't have to be, but the idea is that it's open to every single person that plays the game regardless of faction and all that, and it's a goal everyone can have achieve.

    That said it's also a wonderful business model for achaea, make dragon worth while, and then look at the amount of time to acquire it, but then you can drop some money and drastically shrink that timeline. 

  • Also, why are we making bashing more balanced across all of the classes?

    Classes have always had advantages/disadvantages over other classes, that is what gives us the diversity among them. Druids are never going to be as great at 1v1 combat as some other classes but you get great utility and mobility and a gold generating class skill. Monks have no mobility or utility but excel(led) at 1v1 and had an advantage in bashing compared to classes that have huge utility/mobility. With all of the changes that have been going in lately (gold drops, bashing damage, ranged combat, etc.) the classes seem to be becoming more and more vanilla. 

    I'll also point out that the disparity between Dragons and Newbies and their gold generating potential can't be approached with real world economics because Achaea is a pocket world where people are not faced with the same limitations as the real world. RL economics can be applied to a lot of things in Achaea but that just isn't one of them. Dragons SHOULD have a much higher gold generation and buying power compared to a newbie. Yes, credit prices will become inflated and newbies won't be able to buy as many credits on the credit market... but they aren't stuck there. As they continue bashing they become stronger and more efficient, they can take on higher level mobs with bigger drops and eventually become a dragon themselves. It isn't like the real world where people struggle to go to college to get a job and can't get a job because they don't have the same connections as the wealthy kids and they get stuck working at a minimum wage job while the privileged make more and more money. No, you hunt Minia/Lodi, you become stronger and bash Manara and get stronger and bash higher level areas and get larger drops. Everyone is reborn with the exact same opportunities/privileges/status.

  • Cooper said:
    When you get to be level 99+, most of the time you don't need the extra tanking dragon gives you.

    Sure, PTV is great - but you can buy wings and get to the popular bashing spots just as fast (and a lot of them faster).

    Not sure what the point of Dragon is now - not that great or interesting to PvP as, not significantly better (and in a lot of cases a lot worse) than lesserform bashing, and it still takes hundreds of hours to get there.


    I think the point is PTV is a -free- reward for hitting dragon so you don't have to spend 800cr on wings. I've never had any need to buy wings on Sobby as Universe Tarot was just as good for getting me around, albeit a little slower. In my experience, wings are used more to get to fights / fight on clouds rather than getting around.

    PTV for me was only ever useful for getting me out of places like Istarion or other areas which I couldn't universe from, again, not such a huge reward for the effort put in.

    Even with the old Dragon I always used to bash as Jester unless I was feeling particularly lazy as the utility of priestess / magician / hermit / universe I found far more useful. I do have an SOA, level 3 pendant, level 3 Blackjack and other defensive artifacts though


    (Party): Mezghar says, "Stop."
  • edited July 2014

    I only glanced over most of the thread but what is this about lairs? If I could please have one on Meropis so I can ptv from mainland to Meropis then hunt in lesserform*, that would be great. Thank you.

    *my survivability as an int-Monk is very low. Even between transmute, numb, and regeneration (boosted) my ability to be a tank is really pathetic not to mention I have 11 str so that makes it all the worse. Then there's that wp drain.. My comment about hunting in lesserform is obv a joke. Well for the moment I can at least grin at things hitting me in Dragonform while I flail at them with nerf toys

  • Daeir said:
    Eleison said:

    Any idea how Priests fit into this? I have no idea how you all figure out this DPS figure (is there some neutral base to calculate from?)

    They are almost twice as good as they were previously, and the benefit compounds even further with artefact maces.

    Priest party!!!

  • thx for the new ability to bash bearably with only a bastard sword and trans weaponry, I feel so freeeeee 

  • I hate everything about this change.  It was poorly researched, poorly tested, and made bashing more uneven than it originally was.

    If I wasn't banned, I'd explain.

  • JamethielJamethiel Adelaide
    edited July 2014

    I died FOUR TIMES IN A ROW with starbursts between testing all this out on glubbers. I'm an IDIOT...and anyone who knows me knows that me dying that many times is just like HUH?

    ETA: can't spell.

  • edited July 2014
    Masaryk said:

    Wait, Achaea isn't real life...?


    :\

    No, Achaea is just a fantasy...

    etcetera etcetera...

    GALILEO (GALILEO)

    GALILEO FIGARO -MAGNIFICO-O-O-O

    and so on and so forth...

    BISMILLAH! NO, WE WILL NOT LET YOU GO (LET HIM GO!)

    couple of guitar riffs later...

    BASHING really matters - BASHING really matters...to...me


  • So..  yeah..  still gonna just say I love the changes, personally.. and selfishly.  I'd just changed class from Monk-Serpent-Mage in a short period, loved the mage flavor so I decided to stick with it, and two days later the mage bashing doesn't suck. 

  • TraelorTraelor Columbia, SC

    I had some RP reasons to switch from Priest that supported my OOC lackluster attitude towards our awful bashing. Plus, Alchemist seemed like a fun combat class, and it is. Now I kinda wish I'd stayed. I will say the Alchemist bashing is much improved and I'm loving lesserform hunting.

    The XP boost to dragon bashing has me interested in trying it at some point, but Alchy is just so much fun that it'll likely be a while before I give it a real chance.

    I really sympathize with a lot of the sour feelings about dragon bashing here. Achaea doesn't have a very linear endgame like most common MMOGs do and so dragon was that epic loot feeling personified. I understand the concerns over economic imbalance but it seems to me like attacking that imbalance directly would be a more efficient way of controlling it. I feel this is a passive way to manipulate gold earning that's caused more issues than something more direct like a cap on CFS or a cap on how much gold a player can carry in their hands/pack. Not that I'm suggesting either of those things be implemented, just offering examples.

    I do understand the sentiment of making dragons less powerful to keep gold farming at a minimum, I just think there could have been more direct ways of managing the issue through direct system manipulation rather than alternating an outside variable.

    However, with the changes to bashing making it much better to hunt in lesserforms, isn't this going to expand the economic issues rather than contract them? People who loved playing as a serpent but hated the bashing will now have more incentive to do so. I suppose you could argue that spreading the gold out across players is helping, but if that elite 1% simply becomes an elite 5% you haven't really ameliorated these issues.

    I also really appreciate @Tecton and @sarapis for being so forthcoming and willing to listen. I know from my own experience that sometimes you make a decision you think will be beneficial to your organization and it turns out to cause consequences you can't foresee. The people affected are in a much better position to comment because they deal with those changes each day. However, it really sucks to hear that you did something no one liked and it made things worse instead of better. 

    Traelor - Saving the day since 594

  • CaladbolgCaladbolg Campbell County TN
    edited July 2014
    Karai said:

    I only glanced over most of the thread but what is this about lairs? If I could please have one on Meropis so I can ptv from mainland to Meropis then hunt in lesserform*, that would be great. Thank you.

    *my survivability as an int-Monk is very low. Even between transmute, numb, and regeneration (boosted) my ability to be a tank is really pathetic not to mention I have 11 str so that makes it all the worse. Then there's that wp drain.. My comment about hunting in lesserform is obv a joke. Well for the moment I can at least grin at things hitting me in Dragonform while I flail at them with nerf toys

    Int monk isn't a real thing. quit doing it already x.x

    Since you don't pvp anyways. Int monk in pvp is likely a thing.. kinda like Con Knight or Strength blademaster.. or um.. Stonefist Strength Magi..

    Oh idea, Dex build Raja with dodging trait Paladin for epic cleaves and no attacks hitting me to stop it!

  • Int blademaster is now a thing though, if you don't care about PvP. Burst is pretty good.

  • Sena said:

    Int blademaster is now a thing though, if you don't care about PvP. Burst is pretty good.

    As it stands, what would you currently consider to be the dominant bashing class, seeing as Monk might have been knocked out of the title?



  • CaladbolgCaladbolg Campbell County TN

    Sena said:

    Int blademaster is now a thing though, if you don't care about PvP. Burst is pretty good.

    How high is the bashing damage on burst now? I always wanted to try an int bm build for PvP but never could afford a level 3 collar and +3 int slash and Talisman to make sure it'd work.

    Also always kinda figured Decay/Warp/Burst was the same skill.

  • I still need to see burst at some int other than 12, just in case it's actually not affected by int. If it gets the usual int bonus, then burst is simply overpowered and needs fixed.

    It's 780 damage at 12 int, 4s eq.

  • edited July 2014
    Stuneree said:

    As it stands, what would you currently consider to be the dominant bashing class, seeing as Monk might have been knocked out of the title?

    I'm still missing info on a lot of classes. I'm missing priest (I've only seen L2 mace), knights (don't know much about DSL damage now), shaman, and bard. Besides that, the dominant classes are the ones that seem broken/overpowered right now, and will probably be adjusted down to more reasonable levels. So I can't really say yet.

    Daeir said:
    When was burst changed to be usable on npcs? Or has that always been the case?

    It was always the case, it was just useless before (unless you didn't have a sword).

  • Sena said:
    Stuneree said:

    As it stands, what would you currently consider to be the dominant bashing class, seeing as Monk might have been knocked out of the title?

    I'm still missing info on a lot of classes. I'm missing priest (I've only seen L2 mace), knights (don't know much about DSL damage now), shaman, and bard. Besides that, the dominant classes are the ones that seem broken/overpowered right now, and will probably be adjusted down to more reasonable levels. So I can't really say yet.

    Priest, 12 str with Nimble. 480 damage at 2.6s

  • edited July 2014

    @Sena: This might give you a start with Duality damage.

    Strength  90 damage  151 damage
    10460590
    11492632
    12528678
    13562722
    14594764
    15624802
    16654840
    17680872
    18704904
    19726932
    20742954
    21758974
    22770988
    237781000
  • What were the speed stats of those weapons? It seems to depend on more than just the damage stat.

  • AchillesAchilles Los Angeles
    Sena said:

    What were the speed stats of those weapons? It seems to depend on more than just the damage stat.

    Soulpiercers 90 198 228

    Vorpal Broadswords 151 167 167

    image
  • Wait so you're telling me... with soulpiercers and 15 strength, I could get 624 dps? Sounds a lot better than my 207 dps...

  • That's the damage of a single hit, not the DPS.

  • Ahh ok, so it hasnt been divided yet
  • CaladbolgCaladbolg Campbell County TN
    Sena said:
    Stuneree said:

    As it stands, what would you currently consider to be the dominant bashing class, seeing as Monk might have been knocked out of the title?

    I'm still missing info on a lot of classes. I'm missing priest (I've only seen L2 mace), knights (don't know much about DSL damage now), shaman, and bard. Besides that, the dominant classes are the ones that seem broken/overpowered right now, and will probably be adjusted down to more reasonable levels. So I can't really say yet.

    Daeir said:
    When was burst changed to be usable on npcs? Or has that always been the case?

    It was always the case, it was just useless before (unless you didn't have a sword).

    I came up with about 380ish dps from a lv3 mace 14 strength.

    But I don't have th actual numbers anymore.

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