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If you were a newbie combatant....

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  • KuyKuy Member Posts: 1,497 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    > @Alaskar said:
    > I don't gag everything. But breathing, mass , stuff sipping and eating, stuff like that. No doubt exposure helps though

    If you gag what your opponent is curing, how do you know how to carry out your offense?
    [2:41:24 AM] Kenway: I bet you smell like evergreen trees and you could wrestle boreal mammals but they'd rather just cuddle you
  • MithridatesMithridates Member Posts: 1,956 @ - Epic Achaean

    lol magi

  • AlaskarAlaskar Member Posts: 393 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    I don't gag my current target either. Though I considered it, as I don't use venoms or anything...
  • CaladbolgCaladbolg Campbell County TNMember Posts: 1,166 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    edited June 2014
    Alaskar said:
    I don't gag my current target either. Though I considered it, as I don't use venoms or anything...

    Just remember you already have the numbers for sip/moss balance. You can track that and then hit them with massive damage before they are able to sip/potash out of it. or set up a combo so they only have one chance to sip/potash out when normally they'd have two.

  • NaahNaah Member Posts: 235 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Caladbolg said:
    Alaskar said:
    I don't gag my current target either. Though I considered it, as I don't use venoms or anything...

    Just remember you already have the numbers for sip/moss balance. You can track that and then hit them with massive damage before they are able to sip/potash out of it. or set up a combo so they only have one chance to sip/potash out when normally they'd have two.

    Or just cleave. :)

  • AlaskarAlaskar Member Posts: 393 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Holocaust isn't very accurate and timing wise, and to stack high burst damage I have to combine it with stormhammer, meaning that they're going to have time to heal anyways. Up until a certain point knowing when they sip and eat may be useful, but for high health opponents if I'm unable to prep and catch them in retard they're going to live through it and then hammer me after the stormhammer and Holocaust
  • TohranTohran Everywhere you don't want to be. I'm the anti-Visa!Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    edited June 2014
    I'm sort of on that level, the biggest frustrations I have are as follows. (I use serverside curing, and when I intro Cubs, I ensure they read the help files and activate theirs as well, unless they have something better. Rare, but it happens) I also use the website provided client. Note that these are in no particular order.

    1) Noone fights 1v1. You want to fight someone, you have to take them down while dealing with all of their friends/citymates/housemates/etc.

    2) The speed of combat. I can barely keep up with what is going on, and I've been playing since 2005. So I just watch for balance and pull my next trick from there, which is mostly dsl.

    3) Artefacts. Yeah, I have some. Then you've got people like @Rangor‌ and @Jhui‌ who have ALL of them. You can't compete without dropping serious coin into this game. Not something a newbie is likely to do.

    4) Weapons. While it doesn't affect everyone, you NEED certain stats on your weapons if you plan to do combat. Rapiers/dirk/whip below a certain speed? NOPE! Weapons are expensive, just look at @Nemutaur‌ ads that he puts up weekly for rapiers if you don't believe me. 

    5) Armour, same exact problem as weapons. You have to find a forger willing to spend literally hours just typing FORGE after paying them some exhorbitant amount of gold/credits to MAYBE get a suit of armour worthy of combat. With the steel shortage going on right now, it's not likely going to change.

    6) Client/system differences. A lot of the good combatants have the advantage of coding, or at least that's how it seems to me. Some clients are much better than others as well.  With that knowledge, a lot of people know how to break a system, when I used Vadi's Nexus system it happened to me a lot. A newbie would use the serverside curing, dunno if you can break that or not, never had it happen yet. Figuring out the defence priorities is also a pain, since your major combatants in your faction of choice, lilkely don't use the serverside system and don't know the priorities. Had it happen with @Rangor‌ if you think it's not likely.

    7) Experience loss. This is the major reason I avoid a lot of combat and get really pissed when Eleusis gets raided by 7 top-tier combatants from Ashtan when we have 3 Cubs, 2 Viridi, a ward or two, Talya, @Torrent‌ , @Exelethril‌ , @Rollanz‌ , and myself. I just spent all day getting 5% or so, and unless I get REALLY lucky and snag a killing blow, I'm going to lose all of that work, plus some, maybe even losing a level, which means losing health, which means I'm easier to squish. Endlessly losing experience because you can't stand up to someone who is either loaded with arties, or they brought a bunch of friends is the most frustrating part of this game. For me anyway.


    I cannot suggest any solutions to any of these, except a complete revamp of the forgings system. No, I don't know how, it just needs fixed. There ya go @Sarapis‌ ask anyone I've fought, some newbies are more effective than I am!
    Ulrike
  • TohranTohran Everywhere you don't want to be. I'm the anti-Visa!Member Posts: 331 ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent

    Vadimuses said:
    Combat mechanics are biggest. 2+ affs per second from an serpent (dstab+snake) or an apostate (evileye+hunt/ents) - good luck keeping up, while trying to attack yourself, while knowing what strategy the opponent is going for you, while prioritizing your curing! Want to help yourself out by making some simple triggers as Garao said? As soon as you do that, illusions will be an endless barrage that'll keep owning you.

    For group combat, spam is a giant issue for certain.

    PS. I'd like to see people making this game try playing it again - so they know what issues people are actually facing today. Things changed from a decade ago.

    Also, bolded.

  • AlrenaAlrena Member Posts: 647 @ - Epic Achaean
    Tohran said:
    6) Client/system differences. A lot of the good combatants have the advantage of coding, or at least that's how it seems to me. Some clients are much better than others as well.  With that knowledge, a lot of people know how to break a system, when I used Vadi's Nexus system it happened to me a lot. A newbie would use the serverside curing, dunno if you can break that or not, never had it happen yet. Figuring out the defence priorities is also a pain, since your major combatants in your faction of choice, lilkely don't use the serverside system and don't know the priorities. Had it happen with @Rangor‌ if you think it's not likely.
    @Tohran actually, Ellodin and myself use serverside curing. I could definitely help you with the priorities. I know I made a few files in my House's ooc/combat clan about it for the newbies.

    ExelethrilSherazad
  • SantarSantar Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 2,482 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Did you mean: cursory

  • MakariosMakarios Administrator Posts: 1,971 Achaean staff

    Not sure what Santar's post is talking about.

    But at an initial glance, a lot of the most active combatants seem to be using server curing. Whether that's in conjunction with anything else, hard to say.

    MelodieJurixeShirszae
  • SantarSantar Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 2,482 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited June 2014

    Bastard abusing his mod powers!

  • FalhradFalhrad Member Posts: 8
    edited July 2014

    I am a newbie.  I will never be a combatant.  Ever.

    1.  I can't code, can't understand code, and have zero intention to learn.

    2.  The PK system is utterly dependent on coding and scripting.  Combat defense = script.  Keeping up w/ afflictions is impossible without a script.

    ** And i'm not thrilled w/ the PvE content.  I've one combat command for PvE and everything else is crap I'll never use.  It's neither compelling nor rewarding.

    HasarPraxides
  • AlaskarAlaskar Member Posts: 393 ✭✭✭ - Distinguished

    look up the wundersys or whatever it's called in the technical forum section.  With a little learning and work,  you'll find Achaea combat to be very rewarding. The admin have really worked to remove the necessity of coding to be moderately successful in combat. 

  • SenaSena Member Posts: 3,957 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    @Falhrad It's true that scripts are required for combat*, there's no way you can keep up with afflictions manually while also maintaining your offence. But writing scripts, or even understanding them, is not required at all. There have been plenty of top-tier fighters who, like you, would be completely incapable of writing a curing system and had no interest in learning.

    *With server-side curing though, you can get started in combat without any scripts at all. That won't be sufficient for high-end combat, but it will get you started, and it's enough to do well in raids and group combat where optimal curing isn't as important.

    MelodieUlrike
  • MithridatesMithridates Member Posts: 1,956 @ - Epic Achaean

    I can't code for shit and I manage.

    Exelethril
  • FalhradFalhrad Member Posts: 8
    edited July 2014

    Still not doing it.  Having something else control Falhrad's actions is alienating.  If the system is so complicated it takes a script to manage, then the system should be overhauled.

  • JovoloJovolo Member Posts: 3,339 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Lmao

  • JacenJacen Member Posts: 2,325 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Lol love that attitude. I suppose you log in and just stare at the screen, since using the keyboard would be OOC?

  • FalhradFalhrad Member Posts: 8

    Hey - you folks asked.  Admin wants to know why newbies aren't interested in combat.  A newbie answered, and the response was: well, don't be newb, use scripts like all the old dogs do.

    You don't have to like my answer.  It's still my answer.

  • JovoloJovolo Member Posts: 3,339 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    No one said you need to use scripts to get involved in combat. You just sound jaded.

  • MizikMizik Member Posts: 2,271 @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Don't need scripts. 

    Easier with, obviously. 

    Having 'someone' control is not how it works. This is a MUD! Your first MUD, it seems. This is how these games work. What makes them fun!

    Like learning how to do combos in Street Fighter, Marvel vs Capcom, etc.

    You're just button mashing. Do better.

    Atalkez
  • FalhradFalhrad Member Posts: 8

    Actually, it occurs to me there's no reason to keep playing this game.  It's almost entirely PK based, on a PK system that I find objectionable.  I'm gonna call it a loss and move on.

    Have fun folks.  Achaea has truly exceptional writing and a pretty nice HTML5 interface.  Hope you guys stay in the top three for years to come.

    Trey
  • RohaiRohai Member Posts: 451 ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean

    Newbish combatant here. One thing I think is tough about getting into combat is learning about other classes' abilities. Even through trial-and-error it's rough because I can look back through the log of a spar/duel and still have no idea what exactly I could/should have done differently because I just don't know the mechanics of the moves my opponent was using. It seems like the only way to figure that out IG is to hound skilled combatants asking them to explain everything to you, but no one wants to be That Guy constantly asking stupid questions. I guess another option is to make a newbie alt to switch between classes and look through their AB files, but that seems kind of cheesy (plus you'd only be able to see 2/3 skill sets). I guess my suggestion is to make information about different class skills/abilities more accessible IG somehow.

    NimUlrike
  • AtalkezAtalkez Member, Secret Squirrel Posts: 5,540 @@ - Legendary Achaean

    That particular issue falls under your House/City to make sure you're getting that experience to know what youre seeing.

    The Sentaari had a scroll with all instakills,  their messages, and their counter. Was very helpful





    You hug Aurora compassionately.
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